Author Topic: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol  (Read 600 times)

chemchem

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #20 on: October 17, 2009, 08:18:48 PM »

Prove me wrong. Please. I have 18L of the shit and a grip of KMnO4. But without some real compelling, as in refs backing the KMnO4 oxidation of 2-phenylethanol to phenyl acetic acid, it isn't getting another thought.


Thats lucky, I wish I had one liter of the stuff.

I dont understand why people do oxidations with KMnO4, I suppose its easy to get but if your getting phenethyl alcohol you should be able to get some stuff to do better oxidations.

I mean I don't think many synthetic chemists would think of going that route, if I were to oxidize a primary alcohol I would try one of the following reactions that are all highly documented:
Core-Kim Oxidation (gotta trust EJ Corey on his shit)
Dess-Martin Oxidation (cool mechanism, will be doing this one soon on a project.
Ley Oxidation (I've never had luck with this one and TPAP is rather expensive but you only need catalytic amounts... Anyone wanna trade hard to finds?)
Oppenauer Ox. (again, someone hard to find)
Pfitznew-Moffatt Ox. (Need DCC, cool mechanism)
Swern Ox. (well known, very mild and easy to find materials. My recommendation...)

These can all me done with primary and secondary alcohols, but does anyone know why certain oxidations (such as swern, dess-martin, corey-kim, etc) can't be done with tertiary alcohols?

No one uses kmno4 for oxidations. I did it back in the day before I knew anything about ochem to try and make methcathinone from ephedrine, probably worked slightly and gave benzaldehyde too... stupid.

I hope that helps, most of these are easy enough to just do at home, no inert atmosphere, etc..

Now, lets get back to the topic on how to acquire phenethyl alcohol or the aldehyde...

EDIT: I just read that the product wanted is phenylacetic acid and not phenylacetaldehyde. I gave reactions to produce the aldehyde, although the acid could be produced from the aldehyde so I will keep it up, plus I'm still interested in phenylacetaldehyde.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2009, 08:44:59 PM by chemchem »

Wizard X

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #21 on: October 19, 2009, 10:05:59 AM »
CARBOXYLIC ACIDS FROM THE OXIDATION OF TERMINAL ALKENES BY PERMANGANATE. http://www.orgsyn.org/orgsyn/prep.asp?prep=cv7p0397 will work for Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2009, 10:09:19 AM by Wizard X »
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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #22 on: October 19, 2009, 08:45:32 PM »
I can't believe I am typing this, but...

I don't agree, Wiz. Your highness, with the greatest respect, wouldn't the acidic conditions make the KMnO4 even more prone to cleaving the side chain, not less? No sarcasm, seriously, you have advanced the art.

We collectively haven't gotten to the bottom of this issue, but it is there. I know saying I can't find my reference is like saying I read it on a rest stop stall while glory holeing, but, there is something about the phenyl and KMnO4. I am ignorant and not the greatest chemist, but this doesn't work.

KMnO4 is the go-to oxidizer for primary alcohols to carboxylic acids. 2-phenylethanol and phenylacetic acid are both important chemicals to the flavoring/fragrance industries. If KMnO4 works than it should be an easy thing to search with the few different common names and find the refs using exactly these reactants. Anyone with library time to kill care to advance the art and prove me wrong?

While there why not grab us the refs of what does work. I have money on the addition of phenylethanol to refluxing sodium dichromate/sulfuric being 70-80% to PAA.

I'm not saying don't try it, just I'm not going to. I'm pretty sure other easy to source PTC's should work fine as well. Please let us know if it runs, but my money is against it. I really think KMnO4 is a dead end for phenylethanol, unless you are looking for benzoic acid.

Wizard X

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #23 on: October 20, 2009, 12:10:17 AM »
I can't believe I am typing this, but...

I don't agree, Wiz. Your highness, with the greatest respect, wouldn't the acidic conditions make the KMnO4 even more prone to cleaving the side chain, not less? No sarcasm, seriously, you have advanced the art.

We collectively haven't gotten to the bottom of this issue, but it is there. I know saying I can't find my reference is like saying I read it on a rest stop stall while glory holeing, but, there is something about the phenyl and KMnO4. I am ignorant and not the greatest chemist, but this doesn't work.

KMnO4 is the go-to oxidizer for primary alcohols to carboxylic acids. 2-phenylethanol and phenylacetic acid are both important chemicals to the flavoring/fragrance industries. If KMnO4 works than it should be an easy thing to search with the few different common names and find the refs using exactly these reactants. Anyone with library time to kill care to advance the art and prove me wrong?

While there why not grab us the refs of what does work. I have money on the addition of phenylethanol to refluxing sodium dichromate/sulfuric being 70-80% to PAA.

I'm not saying don't try it, just I'm not going to. I'm pretty sure other easy to source PTC's should work fine as well. Please let us know if it runs, but my money is against it. I really think KMnO4 is a dead end for phenylethanol, unless you are looking for benzoic acid.

Oxidation of primary alcohols to carboxylic acids. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxidation_of_primary_alcohols_to_carboxylic_acids

http://www.chemguide.co.uk/organicprops/alcohols/oxidation.html

Download Oxidation of Primary Alcohols to Carboxylic Acids. http://rapidshare.com/files/42475815/Oxidation.of.Primary.Alcohols.to.Carboxylic.Acids.rar
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Sedit

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #24 on: October 20, 2009, 01:11:07 AM »
Magpie recently had a very nice thread over at Science Madness that applys here nicely. The thread discussed is right here, Oxidation of Diols with Nitric acid. I tryed using H2SO4/NaNO3 on Ethanol to produce acetic acid but due to the volitility of Acetaldahyde I succeeded in not wanting to eat fruit for quite some time and filling my Lab with fruit flys seeking the motherload of rotten apples. Some Acetic acid was produced evident after a few days and allowing the Acetaldahyde to fully leave the system but it was not exactly what I was looking for.

It does not work for me but since Phenylacetaldahyde is not volitile then you will oxidise it just fine into the carboxylic acid. Magpie reported yeilds of 25% from Ethylene glycol to oxalic acid but the June 1939 edition of J Chem Ed listed an improved process that yeilded anywhere from 60%-80% returns from the oxidation.

I hope this helps. You want over the counter and I can not see any reason that the Nitric acid could not be made insitu prior to the oxidation from the reaction of H2SO4 and NaNO3. It work for me to produce acetaldahyde and a quick trip to Home depot could get test in order for about 15$ assuming you already had the Phenyl Ethylalcohol.
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Naf1

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #25 on: October 20, 2009, 01:49:44 AM »
@Goldmember,
"Ive not seen or found and easy otc oxidation of the alcohol"

DEVELOPMENT OF GREEN AND OF POLYMER-SUPPORTED
OXIDIZING AGENTS FOR OXIDATION OF ALCOHOLS

Gives a good overview at the start.
http://etd.lib.ttu.edu/theses/available/etd-04212006-170853/unrestricted/SyedJavedAliThesis.pdf

"On a side note, Phenylacetaldehyde.
I know I keep pumping this one,but how about"

Personally I think the TCCA is hard to get (I may be wrong), but otherwise seems sound.


Solvent free permanganate oxidations
Ahmad Shaabani and Donald G. Lee
Tetrahedron Letters 42 (2001) 5833–5836

Abstract—The oxidations of organic compounds by permanganate under solvent free conditions have been studied. Thiols and
primary aromatic amines undergo oxidative coupling reactions to give disulfides and diazenes, respectively, sulfides are oxidized
to sulfones, primary and secondary alcohols are converted to aldehydes and ketones, 1,4-diols and cyclic ethers give lactones and
arenes are oxidized to the corresponding a-ketones. The experimental procedure is simple and the products are easily isolated in
good yields.

http://www.erowid.org/archive/rhodium/pdf/solventfree.kmno4.oxidation.pdf


Mild and Efficient Oxidation of Aromatic Alcohols and Other Substrates Using NiO2/CH3COOH System
E-Journal of Chemistry
Vol. 5, No.2, pp. 365-369, April 2008
Abstract-A variety of aromatic alcohols were efficiently oxidized to their
corresponding aldehydes and ketones in good to excellent yields using nickel
peroxide activated by acetic acid. Some thiols and amines were also readily
oxidized by this oxidant under mild conditions."

http://www.e-journals.in/open/vol5/no2/0651-365-369.pdf

And two completely unrelated easter eggs;

Microwave- and Ultrasound-Accelerated Green Oxidation of Alcohols by Potassium Permanganate absorbed on Copper(II) Sulfate Pentahydrate
Synthetic Communications1, 38: 2011–2024, 2008
Copyright # Taylor & Francis Group, LLC
ISSN: 0039-7911 print/1532-2432 online
DOI: 10.1080/00397910801997819
Abstract-The solvent-free potassium permanganate (KMnO4)–promoted oxidation
of alcohols into the corresponding carbonyl derivatives has been examined
in detail with respect to the importance of supporting materials and supporting
irradiation. Secondary alcohols are oxidized very efficiently to the corresponding
ketones at ambient temperature by KMnO4 absorbed on a fourfold molar
amount of copper(II) sulfate pentahydrate. The reaction is accelerated considerably
by ultrasonic irradiation and drastically by microwave irradiation. Under the
latter conditions, also hydroquinone can be converted 100% into p-benzoquinone
within 4.5 min. Benzylic alcohols are oxidized most efficiently to the corresponding
benzaldehydes under heterogeneous reaction conditions."

http://www.hoahocxanh.com.vn/data/upload_file/File/tap%20chi%20nhom%202008/SC2008-38-2011.pdf

Fast and Green Microwave-Assisted Conversion of Essential Oil Allylbenzenes into the Corresponding Aldehydes via Alkene Isomerization and Subsequent Potassium Permanganate Promoted Oxidative Alkene Group Cleavage
Molecules 2009, 14, 3411-3424; doi:10.3390/molecules14093411

Abstract-Essential oil allylbenzenes from have been converted quickly and efficiently
into the corresponding benzaldehydes in good yields by a two-step “green” reaction
pathway based on a solventless alkene group isomerization by KF/Al2O3 to form the
corresponding 1-arylpropene and a subsequent solventless oxidation of the latter to the
corresponding benzaldehyde by KMnO4/CuSO4????5H2O. The assistance by microwave
irradiation results in very short reaction times (<15 minutes). The green conversion of
eugenol (4-allyl-2-methoxyphenol) into vanillin (4-hydroxy-3-methoxybenzaldehyde) has
been carried out in a similar way, requiring however two additional microwave-assisted
synthetic steps for acetylation of the hydroxy group prior to the oxidation reaction, and for
the final deacetylation of vanillin acetate (4-acetoxy-3-methoxybenzaldehyde) by
KF/Al2O3 under solvent-free conditions, respectively.

http://www.mdpi.com/1420-3049/14/9/3411/pdf

Please do not think the above paper strengthens the case for cleavage to the corresponding benzoic acid, because the above is for alkyl arene's. And alkyl arenes ARE cleaved by permanganate which results in the corresponding benzoic acid, whereas primary and secondary alcohols are oxidized to an aldehyde then a carboxylic acid.

Oxidation Brochure
http://www.acros.com/_Rainbow/pdf/oxidation_brochure_MANGA.pdf

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #26 on: October 20, 2009, 04:18:41 AM »
Solvent free permanganate oxidations
Ahmad Shaabani and Donald G. Lee
Tetrahedron Letters 42 (2001) 5833–5836
http://www.erowid.org/archive/rhodium/pdf/solventfree.kmno4.oxidation.pdf

Example 17, good to go, I guess. Alumina and KMnO4 in the microwave.

Mild and Efficient Oxidation of Aromatic Alcohols and Other Substrates Using NiO2/CH3COOH System
E-Journal of Chemistry
Vol. 5, No.2, pp. 365-369, April 2008
http://www.e-journals.in/open/vol5/no2/0651-365-369.pdf

#5 is alive! The Iranians rock 2-phenethanol to 2-phenylacetaldehyde in 79% yield.

Did anyone else notice...
"However, there are a number of drawbacks against the classical oxidants (CrO4 2-, MnO4-) and their use in organic synthesis. These include lack of selectivity, the requirement of a strong acid or base as catalyst and above all their high toxicity for man and environment5. Therefore, the development of efficient and less polluting oxidants is highly encouraged."
Followed by their prep...
"Preparation of nickel peroxide
A solution of KOH (22.4 g) in 100 mL of water was chilled and chlorine gas (generated from 20 g of KMnO4 and 120 mL of concentrated HCl) was slowly bubbled over for one hour period with stirring."

I guess they couldn't find a better way to make chlorine gas. Oh well, they somewhat avoided the use of KMnO4, even though I thought it wasn't so bad.

Just in case anyone wonders, my last attempt at PAA was:

100g 2-phenylethanol and 1L acetone in a 5L flask, cooled with ice and water with mag stirring. 95g KMnO4(slight molar excess) and 2L H2O was dripped in super slowly over the course of hours. 4.8g of NaOH was somewhere but don't remember now, probably in the sep funnel with the water and KMnO4. I don't remember how long it was left in the ice stirring,probably overnight or the workup but probably involved vac filtering and solvent removal under vac. The end product needed a lot of boiling water to get it all to dissolve. In fact it sat on the mag stirrer boiling while I dumped in more water and watched, checking by stopping stirring. After a bit in the fridge, lots short little needle crystals of what i'm pretty sure was benzoic acid.

I don't remember where the examples for this oxidation came from, but I did two different ones. I have notes that say examples have acetone to water ratios up to 4:1 and the required molar ratio for alcohol to carboxylic acid are 3 OH:2 KMnO4 in alkali media.

I could have been wrong. I have been before and will be again, but after having done a sodium dichromate and then getting real PAA, I am sure of the smells and the look and the two times I did KMnO4 oxidations of this alcohol, i'm pretty sure the PAA look and smell wasn't there. The pic on the wikipedia benzoic acid page is a super macro, but i'm sure you can imagine what a flask full of that looks like. That's what I had. Twice.

I did forget to recrystalize the PAA I got in the same fashion just to put a nail in this coffin. I will the next time I get some and let you all know.

Until then, if anyone has actually oxidized 2-phenylethanol with KMnO4 I would love to read about it. I wil write up the sodium dichromate oxidation the next time I do it.

Naf1

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #27 on: October 20, 2009, 04:30:17 AM »
"However, there are a number of drawbacks against the classical oxidants (CrO4 2-, MnO4-) and their use in organic synthesis. These include lack of selectivity, the requirement of a strong acid or base as catalyst and above all their high toxicity for man and environment"

When they said that, they were referring to the ability (or inability) of permanganate for example to go to the aldehyde and stop before then going to the carboxylic acid. And those particular researchers were angling for the aldehyde, so in their case the inability of stronger permanganate to stop half way at the aldehyde was a drawback. But if you were going for the carboxylic acid permanganate would actually be preferred.

"I guess they couldn't find a better way to make chlorine gas. Oh well, they somewhat avoided the use of KMnO4, even though I thought it wasn't so bad."

You know that first part of the procedure (ie, 'A solution of KOH (22.4 g) in 100 mL of water was chilled and chlorine gas (generated from 20 g of KMnO4 and 120 mL of concentrated HCl) was slowly bubbled over for one hour period with stirring.") Is just a fancy way of producing hypochlorite, you could easily miss that whole section involving chlorine gas and just add hypochlorite (bleach) from the start!

Also good luck with your further endeavours! I would love to have a look at any references you could find for the procedure you did above, I may have a dig around for you if I get the chance. If you need anything dont hesitate to ask us!

Goldmember

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #28 on: October 20, 2009, 06:58:07 AM »
A couple of quotes showing the basic permanganate oxidation yields Benzoic acid.
These are the first two lifted from the first page of a google search.
That is a far as I can be bothered looking,for I know the result in practice. There are several more out there if you can be bothered.
Not saying of course,that this couldnt work under certain conditions.

Permanganate on Phenethyl alcohol:

http://docs.google.com/gview?a=v&q=cache:D-azYLe_6EoJ:196.219.56.39/PUASite/uploads/file/Pharmacy/Courses/PHR343/Lecture%25209.pdf
Scroll to page 31

http://article.pubs.nrc-cnrc.gc.ca/ppv/RPViewDoc?issn=1480-3291&volume=35&issue=3&startPage=220
Page 221 1st paragraph

Wizard X

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #29 on: October 20, 2009, 10:06:04 AM »
Selective benzylic -OH oxidation with KMnO4 to ketone is possible without benzylic cleaverage to benzoic acid.


http://www.orgsyn.org/orgsyn/pdfs/CV1P0241.pdf
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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #30 on: October 20, 2009, 03:14:35 PM »
Am I a Lepor?

That isn't leprosy. It's syphilis.

for I know the result in practice.

Me too, it seems. I also agree that perhaps I was just doing it all wrong.

Wiz, the last OrgSyn used quite a bit more NaOH than I used, but other than that, pretty similar. I believe I followed the base amount from a Vogel but that might have been using baking soda and the acetone was from some ref where the amount of acetone increased selectivity and rate so I thought it a wise choice for a solvent to get all the players in one layer. Perhaps that orgsyn modded with the correct amount of KMnO4 for alcohol to carboxylic acid and some BAC or other PTC.

Like I said before, I also found lit that said KMnO4 would yield benzoic acid, and only after 2 failures from what should have been child's play.

I see a bunch of close..., but these are big chem$ important to lots of busine$$e$. If it was easy it would be in the refs as 2-PEA with KMnO4 gives PAA. And they would be old refs. This shit isn't close to new. This was old to my grandpaw.

So we have the microwave ref, and that's it for KMnO4. I thought close counted before two failures and reading something about the mechanism. This goes against my point, but the Goldmember links just say, and don't explain, and that gets us nowhere as far as advancing knowledge/practice.

I would also like to point out that my failure was no, or very little mixed product. No aldehyde. No PAA. From the recrystalized nightmare, one product.

I bet the alkyl arene cleavage mechanism is exactly the same as what is going on here.

Hell, I'm almost ready to toss another mol of phenylethylalcohol and a day of my time to the odds makers. So what's the KMnO4 bet? Useful scale, so the microwave is out. Something that scales. So, chipped dH2O ice will make this run when ice cooling didn't? Could be. And to get one phase, surfactant or acetone or other? More NaOH?

I' not just draging this out for fun. I want it to work. KMnO4 is THE easy cheap carboxylic acid maker. I just think it doesn't. I bet there are refs before the one goldmember posted that say why.

Naf1

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #31 on: October 20, 2009, 11:14:28 PM »
Disposable Stirbar, lol good name. Last week I dumped a thick solution of powdery crap in solvent that was in a flask down the drain, then remembered later my little stirbar was in there! (DAMN, I guess that was an expensive Disposable stirbar).

If you want success, why dont you use the method from the microwave paper?

That would be;



You would want the second method, that uses the concentrated aqueous solution of permanganate to alumina, then ground with copper sulfate. They say the best results are given when a 20% copper sulfate and 80% alumina are added to an equal weight of permanganate. So that works out to Potassium Permanganate = 50%, Copper Sulfate pentahydrate = 10% and Alumina = 40%. The reaction should take about 8 hours(?) at room temperature without microwave irradiation. As you can see they simply add the oxidant (Permanganate, Copper sulfate and alumina) to a flask followed by the alcohol (reductant). TLC analysis would be great to monitor the reactions progress and to be able to determine when it has completed. This is of course for a near quantative yield of the corresponding aldehyde, you could bypass the alumina and receive a mixture of the aldehyde and the corresponding carboxylic acid. But it is easier to work up one product in good purity than two, then you also have just one product to work with (buy reagents for ect). Alumina can be had at pet shops that sell aquarium supplies 'Phos Zorb' is one such product that consists of a pouch full of activated alumina and nothing else.

Ref;
Solvent free permanganate oxidations
http://www.erowid.org/archive/rhodium/pdf/solventfree.kmno4.oxidation.pdf

Also make sure you have 2-Phenylethanol, as 1-phenylethanol can only produce acetophenone.

Sedit

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #32 on: October 21, 2009, 02:51:15 AM »
Disposable would it kill ya to try and oxidise a few grams (5-10 at the most) of  2-phenylethanol with some nitric acid? All you would have to do is mix the two and heat in a test tube. Once the reaction initiates it is self sustaining with only a mild heating at the end to ensure high conversion. It would take no more then 30 minutes to 1 hour at the very most to run a small scale test to determine its viability and I have a hunch you, nor the rest of the chemistry forums around, would be disappointed with the results. It is milder then KMnO4 yet still strong enough to take primary alcohols to there acids.

Im just very eager to hear results of a use of nitric acid in this manner on an aromatic alcohol.
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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #33 on: October 21, 2009, 07:38:56 AM »
Naf1,
I really couldn't count how many stirbars I have tossed. It is an expensive and stupid habit.
A more expensive habit... I turned a 5L 3 neck with a mechanical stirrer in it so I could inspect the propeller from the bottom and tapped the arbol on the wall, putting a couple hundred dollars of fancy glass right through the bottom of a much more expensive piece of glass with a weak little "tink". Not even a mighty smashing of glass that would let me really experience the destruction.
I guess I have been thinking about the microwave too much these days and it mentions them right in the second paragraph. That, and I read the (r) for just oxidizer and alumina from the example above #17. One could guess that the time would be similar but without running spots you would be going it blind.
This doesn't fix the reason I am not going to try it. I am interested in different routes to PAA. I know I/we sort of took over the thread, but other peeps here want the aldehyde, not me if it is going to take a day to get to a point that I have to do another reaction to get what could be had from one reaction. I don't kid myself anymore when I read the time it takes. If it really only needed to react for 4hrs, and that is a big if, throw setup, dicking around, finally getting to work, reaction time, more dicking around, work up, distilation... yeah, lucky if it only took a day.

Sedit,
Although I think rdx is a better use of nitric, I might even get around to this one. As soon as I want PAA again it might get a go depending on what I have on hand and how I feel about the other contending trials and if I want to try my hand at huffing nitrogen oxides.
http://www.orgsyn.org/orgsyn/orgsyn/prepContent.asp?prep=cv1p0018
Got a link to anything with a better yield?

Naf1

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #34 on: October 21, 2009, 11:01:54 PM »
"Although I think rdx is a better use of nitric"

LOL, that maybe true. I am not really savvy with explosives, but doesnt RDX manufacture require anhydrous HNO3? I am pretty sure Sedit is talking about a maximium of 70% which is the commercially available concentration. Although I have always liked the method put forth in this patent;

Preparation of anhydrous Nitric Acid
Patent 3981975
http://www.google.com/patents?id=d1h8AAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4&source=gbs_overview_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q=&f=false

"I am interested in different routes to PAA"

Well tweak that procedure to suit your case! Alumina is used to increase the rate of oxidation of the alcohol, which results in it having a greater rate of oxidation than the corresponding aldehyde (so the oxidation reaction favors the alcohol). If you were to leave out Alumina, it would produce a mixture of carboxylic acid and aldehyde. Which could easily be oxidized further by any of the following potassium permanganate, nitric acid, chromium(VI) oxide, and acidified potassium dichromate, hypochlorite or an extra helping of the oxidant prepared earlier with potassium permanganate and copper sulfate (without alumina). But as you said about the other procedure, it would be prudent to be using TLC to see where the reaction is at.

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #35 on: October 22, 2009, 06:37:01 PM »
An extra helping of the oxidant, KMnO4 mix, and more time in the microwave would then probably push us past the carboxylic acid to oxidative cleavage by the time there was no more aldehyde and that was the original problem I and Goldmember stated with KMnO4. How much? Who knows without trying. But the others do look promising. I will report on future endeavors, be that success or failures.

I have learned tons from reading about the ways others have failed and their thoughts about it. I feel it is as important as the success stories and really helps others not to repeat hard learned lessons.

Got any ozone with something added for selectivity possibilities? I had a dream of a hot tub filled with phenyl ethanol and metal salt or something with the pumps and ozonator going. Is this even possible? Google time.

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #36 on: October 22, 2009, 11:56:26 PM »
Just for the record, the procedure I presented does not need any microwave irradiation.

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #37 on: October 29, 2009, 08:57:11 PM »
"Most reactions can be carried out at room temperature; however, improved yields for solid reductants are obtained when the reaction
temperature is near or above their melting points. Some reactions benefit from the application of additional energy in the form of microwaves."

Sure, doesn't "need", and probably not wise to start off modifying the ref on the first try, but then again, I'm not wise.

I also love nuking stuff.

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2010, 06:05:03 PM »
Oh, and wikipedia has the mp way off. It is less than PAA, not more.

Not afraid to say what was observed, or to go back and claim retardedness... That was retarded. An was I about to claim the Merck is in error as well? Yeah, I did...

After a successful oxidation, and reXtal, the error came from not the melting point, but the point at which these substances turn to "lava lamp" melt when under water. It is a significantly lower temp then their melting point.

Their crystals are however very different. PAA in water with a slow reXtal is flat sharp triangle crystal plates.

For those not wishing to produce benzoic acid, allow me to recommend as before, slow addition of PEA in acetone to sodium bichromate/H2SO4/water/acetone refluxing. All of the sickening sweet ester that is trying to rob you of paa can be NaOH reflux hydrolyzed.

...now it's better then the asian stuff!

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Re: Phenyl Ethyl Alcohol
« Reply #39 on: June 25, 2010, 06:05:31 AM »
Hello to all,

@ Locked
Can you write-up the exact procedure that you follow (Na2Cr2O7 + H2SO4 oxidation)
That will be nice  :)


So my first and useless post,
at your nice and more "advanced" Chemistry related forum.