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nbk2000
August 16th, 2002, 08:51 AM
Ethylene Glycol, besides being useful for making EGDN, is also a prime precursor for the manufacture of mustard gas (as detailed in my PDF). Now, usually, the easiest way to obtain this material OTC is in the form of anti-freeze.

However, anti-freeze contains all sorts of other chemicals that need to be seperated, like surfactants/stabilizers/protectants/etc, requiring fractional distillation and filtration to get to suitable purity.

Not anymore. :)

I found a product that's common (at least in the snowy US states), is 33% EG, with the other 66% being methyl alchohol which is easily removed by simply heating the product in an open container.

The product is called "De-icer". :D I'm sure you can find it in any autoparts store during the cold season.

<img src="http://server3001.freeyellow.com/nbk2000/Glycol1.jpg" alt=" - " />

$1.30 for 16 ounces, which translates into at least 5 ounces of EG. Probably more accounting for the difference in density between MeOH and EG.

I measured out 10 mL (graduated cylinder) and heated it at 180*F for two hours till constant volume.

<img src="http://server3001.freeyellow.com/nbk2000/Glycol2.jpg" alt=" - " />

After measuring the remainder, I had 3.3 mL remaining, thus 33% by volume of the deicer is EG.

If this source is too expensive for mass production, then it's at least suitable as an easy source of (technical grade) EG for use in EGDN synth and in small scale mustard gas production before investing in large scale distillation equipment or bulk chemical purchases.

VX
August 16th, 2002, 05:12 PM
In the UK we have de-icer, but it's different to yours. For a start ours is in a blue can :D (about 500ml for 99p)

But the big difference is that ours only contains iso propanol and a propellant... making it quite useless, for most things except melting ice.

PYRO500
August 16th, 2002, 06:51 PM
NBK posted a rather simple synthesis way back in september 2000. I have the pdf archives but I think you should find it yourself. I believe the 2000 archives are on the ftp.

Basicly what you do is turn the Ethylene Glycol into Ethylene Chlorohydrin by passing HCL gas through it. You then add sodium sulfide and heat it to form thiodiglycol. The thiodiglycol is then neutralized and heated with HCL to create mustard gas.

tom haggen
April 17th, 2004, 01:48 AM
son of a bitch, I finally got in gear and decided to purchase some ethylene glycol. But all they had was they "Summer De-icer"(Propylene glycol & Methonal). Guess I'll just have to wait untill next winter.

Barcy
April 26th, 2004, 09:06 PM
Just a note that I find getting coolant concentrate 93% to 99% EG (Not Antifreeze) to be quite common where I live (bloody hot area with 40 plus degrees in summer). If you are going to go to the effort of fractional distallation to remove the impurities why not make it a decent amount.

As I am siting at my computer I am looking as a product called Castrol Anti Freeze Anti Boil Engine Coolant Concentrate. 95% EG and treated with a product called Deatonium Benzoate. Hope you can use this.

nbk2000
April 27th, 2004, 04:45 PM
Denatonium Benzoate is a super bitter tasting substance used to make the glycol unappealing to anyone who might otherwise drink the sweet tasting poison.

I wonder if the DB can be destroyed by boiling the EG, as EG has a rather high Bp, rendering it 'tasty' again. ;)

Ropik
May 14th, 2004, 11:09 AM
NBK, I just wonder from which manufacturer is this useful De-icer? I was able to find abou four antifreezes called De-icer and I am in doubt that all are so good as this one.
Thanks.

nbk2000
May 14th, 2004, 06:32 PM
Prestone...................

Barcy
May 29th, 2004, 09:01 PM
Eureka!, I just found a supposed 100% EG product and believe it or not is "100% Australian Made" (not common in this day and age). Nulon long life concentrated coolant "100% concentrate 1060gm/l EG. Au$34.95 for 5 litres from Super Cheap. 5 litres of EG...hhmmmm and suggestions what I could do with this? I have shied away from making NG, but with so much EG it is hard not to give it a try.

I could try to rid the area of a few feral cats and the odd wild dog or dingo. Any suggested doses or mixes to feed these animals?

croc
August 20th, 2004, 09:11 PM
Quote: "Any suggested doses or mixes to feed these animals?"
I don’t think it is very toxic as a poison but it is used as a precursor to make a couple of chemical warfare agents. I have 2 types of antifreeze. One packaged by castrol the other by a place in my state. The castrol has 95% EG v/v with 10 mg/k denatonium benzoate. The second one says it freezes at negative 19C and boils at 124C. it contains approx 1005 grams/liter EG and 10ppm biteing agent.