megalomania
May 10th, 2003, 09:25 PM
pete
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Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 01:29 PM
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I have been reading this site for some time now and after reading about all of these explosives i decide that i would find out for myself what some of these chenicals could do. So in my dream(-; i took three days of collage, i was very sick, and did some pretty hefty nitrating. The chemicals on which i performed tests were, picric acid, TeNN, RDX, Nitroglycerin, Ammonium Nitrate, TNX and di-nitropropane. All of these were set of by caps containing varring amounts of acetone peroxide and RDX. Some Nitrocelluose was also tested. All of the caps were electronic in nature. I have pictures as setting these chemicals of, for the first time in some cases, with all the electrics to deal with was enough, and posting pictures makes me nervious.
pete
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Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 01:49 PM
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O.k, first i will go throught the various ways that the chemicals could be, in theory be made. Picric acid is one of the harder chemicals to get good yields of, in the past i have used the asprin method, but this time i 'lent' some phenol of school, which i forgot to tell them i was lending, oh well. The phenol was placed in sulphuric acid, and then nitric acid added to the cooled mix. The complete process for this can be really found and works quite well if you are carefull about the nitration. Nitrocelluose was standard, TNX was made via a three stage nitration, thought yield was poor. The best nitration was of napathlene to TeNN, this was completed by the easily found three stage process of nitration, on Mega's site. The yield was excellent, this is a good nitration to try. The production of RDX consumed the most time, the nitric acid for this was purged of NO2 by the acid being heated to 50-60 degrees cel. and then air was manually blown through a long pipe which lead into the acid, after about 10 minutes the acid was much clearer. A NO2 scavenger and then added to the acid, urea, to remove an remaining NO2. This acid was then cooled below 20 degrees cel. and Hexamine added in the form of a powder, post addition the mixture was warmed to 55 degrees cel. for 5 minutes then cooled and dumped into cool water, this slow precipited 30 grams od RDX. Not to bad a yield, for the explosive.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 02:00 PM
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Nitroglycerin and Di-nitropropane were created by a simple nitration of there starting alcohol type compounds. This was were i had one of my first accidents, i did the NG in four batches. While tring to make the last batch, and complete the final nitration of my TeNN, the NG over heated, scared shit less of the whole lot going of i throw a bucket of water in the general direction of the reaction mixture. Some of the water went in a halted the reaction very quickly, though there was little NG formed from that reaction. The ammonium nitrate was water purified store brought ammonium nitrate, which was thoughtly dried.
pete
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Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 02:23 PM
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All of the tests were conducted on after the other, i have not used scientific methods to test to power of the explosives, and there all of my results are subjective.
First up was 30 Grams of TeNN, the charde was set the electrics checked, in retreated to 100 meters and charged up my electric firing rig, BOOM, holy shit, TeNN is way recommended. The charge made a crater of 1o inches across and 5 inches deep, nice. Next up was a mixture of 50/50 TeNN and Ammonium nitrate, 40 grams. The bang was louder than the previous charge, a little, but deeper. The crater was about the same size, nice mix. Next was picric acid, 42 grams, all of what i made, and well what could you say apart from fuck, holy fuck, this stuff was quite good, the crater was, however, about the same size as my TeNN/AN charge? Now came the big charges, first up a 100 gram 40 percent stick of dynamite. you can probably guess the results, i felt the shock wave hit me from 100 meters back, the crater it made was quite shallow, and quite wide, 3 tops deep, and 15 wide. I liked this stuff!!!
pete
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Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 02:36 PM
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Next up was Di-Nitropropane, 20 grams, mixed as dynamite 40 percent, this was tested against the same quanty of nitroglycerin dynamite. The Di nitro was fired and went up well, and looked felt made a crater simlar to the tri nitro dynamite. Given how much safer it is, the di nitro, it is a cool explosive. The final top end of the explosives was next, first was 20 grams of pure RDX, no plastersizers were mixed with it. The crack from this stuff was felt as well as heard, it was very sharp, and loud. The crater was 7 inches across, which is quite wide for 20 grams, a thilling explosive, if you can make enough of it. The mixture of 40/60 RDX AN was disappointing, i was expecting a bang, put got nothing, don't know why, the cap fired, tore the plastic pipe it was in and rendered it unusable???
pete
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Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 02:58 PM
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The test area was now looking a mess and i was having to mark which were old crater and which new, looked like the moon. Now i was down to my final charges 50 grams of a 94/6 percent mixture of NG/NC, more nitroglycerin of course, and a home brew hellofite mixture to use up the remaining nitric acid. The NG/NC mixture was rigged up, this i knew would be good. I ran down to my firing point, i was tinking to myself, please let this go off, i charged the rig, and up she went. If this charge was a woman she would be the sort that you cum in your pants when she looks your way, easily the bigest bang. The crater was 14 inch wide and 8 DEEP, NICE STUFF. After that nothing could compare, but i wired the Hellifite up, it cosisted of 20 ml of Xylene and 30 ml nitric. On firing the charge went up and was quite impressive, there was very little bang, more of a womph. A small fast fire ball was produced and the heat could be felt from 50 meters off, were i was laid. There was only scorching around the blast area, but the charge looked quite impressive.
pete
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Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 03:00 PM
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In the end i didn't bother with the TNX, not worth it for want i had produced.
blackadder
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Posts: 313
From: London
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-11-2001 05:20 PM
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I bow down to you!!!
Very well done, I think I'll try NG as a high explosive when I get older, but I want to make some now!!! You felt the heat from 50m away? That's pretty damn powerful.
Agent Blak
Frequent Poster
Posts: 766
From: Sk. Canada
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-11-2001 11:01 PM
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congrats;
It seems that you have conducted a very professional test. I think a decent way to test to foces of a "GOODY"(coin by K.S.) would be a H20 displacement method; using a 55 Galon drum filled with H2O.
------------------
A wise man once said:
"...I Am Not Much of a Dancer But,
Just Wait Till The Fucking Begins"
Agent Blak-------OUT!!
Dracul
Frequent Poster
Posts: 73
From: Melbourne, Australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-12-2001 04:55 AM
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Now you just have to put the pics up.
------------------
"By the power of Grayskull, I HAVE THE POWER!" He-man
Check this out www.stileproject.com
Morrigan
Frequent Poster
Posts: 81
From: The Netherlands
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 03-12-2001 05:11 AM
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If all of this is true than you rule. Jesus man, producing and detonating so much different high explosives in such a short time is unbelievable. Nice results too. Get those pictures up. I would love to see the smoking craters…Damn you sure made a list.
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-12-2001 12:55 PM
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I just thought you might like to know that TeNN can be set off (although it is unreliable) without a detonator. Put a coil of about 2.5" of 20 s.w.g. copper wire into the explosive, connect it up to some nice long cables, and connect two car batteries to it in series. It heats up quickly, and this causes detonation. It only works, when using this method, about 30% of the time before the wire melts through and breaks the circuit, but with a bit of experimenting it could be made more reliable.
Why bother, you may be asking? Well, it means you don't have to use any nasty primary explosives, and it can't be set off by static or radio signals, and is therefore super-safe.
You just need to heat up a significant proportion of it very quickly to a fairly high temperature.
And I agree: TeNN is one of my favourite explosives. It's only drawback is the three stage nitration process, although it's not too bad. The ingredients are all very common, and it gives a pretty good yield.
Mr Cool
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Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-12-2001 12:58 PM
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P.S. - could you please post the methods you used to make TNX and dinitropropane?
Thanks in advance.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-13-2001 03:01 PM
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The TNX that i made was no good, and that is why i didn't detail its detonation, it formed as a black tar like mass, so i don't think you want my method for making that. However the dinitropropane i can answer, it is made as i simple one stage nitration of propane diol. The diol is the first hting that you will need to aquire, this is used as a component of some of the fancier anti frezes that you will find in places like Halfords, thats were i got mine. This will need concentrating, i use calcium chloride to do this, i brought this out of woolworths!!!. Place the anti freze in a bottle and add some calcuim chloride, a third the anti frezes volume will do. Screw on the bottles cap and then leave for an hour, filter out the calcuim chloride and collect the resulting liquid. This is now read, mix 30ml of strong nitric acid with 70ml of 95 percent or greater sulphuric, cool this mix in an ice bath. Once the mix is at 15 degrees cel. add the Diol, slowly, don't let the temp exceed 20 deg cel. Add 15ml of the diol to the acids, cool again and pour 300ml of cold water into the acid mix, extract the milky liquid of the bottom of the acid mix with an eye dropper, and place it in a 5 percent bi carbonate solution in a plastic bottle, plenty of bicar solution. Now, and this is safe, put the lid on the bottle and shake it, not to hard, for 5 seconds, then release the pressure, repeat at least 10 times. Extract the dinitro, place in a strong salt solution to extract the water out of the dinitro, and hay presto. Try to set this stuff of, it's quite hard to do, a really good wack is needed in the case of the pure material.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-13-2001 03:11 PM
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This is going to sound like the worlds biggest cop out, but the post was supose to say 'i have NOT taken any pictures as i was nervious as this was my first serious testing. However, not wanting to be called a bullshitter, now i'm more familar with doing this i may post some pics of future explosions, however, can someone tell me how this can be done safely, and were from, how much etc equipment will cost. As the cops nicking me for this is quite a worry, i therefore would like to know the in's and out's of how to post pics safely. Oh and is it possible to post sound, as that is half the thrill?
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-13-2001 03:15 PM
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One last thing, does anyone think that the use of Phosphoric acid to dehydrate the acid mixture in the making of RDX will work, i read a patent detailing the use of p2o5 for this. Phosphoric acid is after all a powerfull dyhydrant, and easily made.
frostfire
Frequent Poster
Posts: 266
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-13-2001 03:58 PM
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hi, It's a great deal with your achievement!
how's the explosive bla-bla-bla rule in UK?
cuz in south east third world conutries like Indonesia, Malaysia,....(except Singapore), you can obtain at least 85 % of all exp. chemicals mentioned in Mega's site, all you need just money-money, and money....
...hence it's possible to make almost all nitrated based/all explosives......next summer overseas vacation would be fun =)
SATANIC
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Posts: 237
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-13-2001 07:38 PM
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If this is true then you deserve to be called a master. a few more tests and you will be able to produce a write up you could put on the web as a manual. it would have some more personal details that would help a lot of peole who like to know that the methods they use have been sucessfully tested
Demolition
Frequent Poster
Posts: 158
From: Australia
Registered: FEB 2001
posted 03-13-2001 11:22 PM
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Extremely good information pete.I just have 2 questions for you.1-What explosive did you use in your blasting caps and how much?2-How many ml's of Nitric Acid did you use in the production of RDX and also how many grams of heaxmine did you use?All help is greatly appreciated.
Demolition
10fingers
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Posts: 411
From: USA
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-13-2001 11:54 PM
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deleting post
[This message has been edited by 10fingers (edited March 19, 2001).]
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-14-2001 04:20 PM
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The caps were aluminium pipes of diameter 5 mm, the primary explosive i was using was acetone peroxide, and was pressed in the cap to a depth of 12mm. The base charge in the caps was RDX, 1 gram in most of the caps, also pressed in, i say most as some explosives don't need the RDX. The production of RDX is some what of a problem, the acid that you use has to be very pure, else you get complexing with the NO2 groups, which means no explosive. To produce 10 grams of RDX i used 50 ml of pure strong white nitric acid, and 8.3 grams of hexamine. It is improtant that you remove the NO2, or yeilds will be poor.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-14-2001 04:25 PM
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Would anyone happen to know how to make phosphorous, or any related phorphorous type chemicals eg P2O5 or PCl5 etc. Thanks!!!
blackadder
Frequent Poster
Posts: 313
From: London
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-15-2001 04:42 PM
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you can't exactly "make" phosphorus, as it's an element. However you can extract it. I'm sure that you are aware that phosphorus is present in match heads.
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-15-2001 06:09 PM
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Phosphorus hasn't been used in match heads for years. Although the strikers of safety matches contain some phosphorus, not enough to get a practical amount unless you have several thousand match boxes and a lot of patience.
Ages ago NBK2000 posted a procedure for extracting white phosphorus from animal bones. The proceude was a couple of hundred years old and so used only commonly available supplies (average people didn't have access to chemicals back then).
DarkAngel
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Posts: 592
From: ?
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-16-2001 07:40 AM
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Hey Anthony/NBK that sounds interesting can you post the recipe here?
------------------
--==DarkAngel==--
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10fingers
Frequent Poster
Posts: 411
From: USA
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-16-2001 09:24 AM
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Pure phosphorous is very expensive to buy. I think the strike anywhere type matches may have some phosphorous on the tip. Some fertilizers contain potassium phosphate which you may be able to extract. Also, I have seen phosphoric acid for sale as a disinfect for dairy equipment. I think it was about a 75% solution. It is sold in rural areas at agricultural supply stores.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-16-2001 01:33 PM
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I posted the white phosphorus process in the appropriate section.
http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/Forum4/HTML/000158.html
You can skip all the extracting from bones if you buy ammonium phosphate at the ag store.
------------------
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Go here to download the NBK2000 website PDF.
Donutty
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Posts: 228
From: UK
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-16-2001 04:47 PM
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I have access to fertiliser with a high % of Potassium Phosphate (something like 0-??-25)
Mr Cool
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Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-17-2001 10:08 AM
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You can heat the white phosphorous in an inert atmosphere, and condense the vapours to form red phosphorous which is the only kind useful in pyrotechnics. I can't remember the exact procedure, I read it in an old chemistry book, but I thought I'd tell you that so that if you wanted to search for how to make red P then you would know what to look for.
frostfire
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Posts: 266
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-17-2001 10:47 AM
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hei,
when it's said yield is poor because of low conc. HNO3 or presence of NO2 or any other factors, is that mean that there's still explosive products but in a low quantity or you get pratically some ready-to-throw away crystals (no explosive)????
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-17-2001 07:36 PM
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Yeah, yield is the quantity of the product produced, so a poor yield = small amount of explosive.
fightclub
New Member
Posts: 39
From: none
Registered: APR 2001
posted 04-13-2001 06:54 PM
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One small error: Propyleneglycol dinitrate and dinitropropane are not the same compounds! It is like calling Methyl nitrate Nitromethane.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 04-14-2001 06:59 AM
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True
PHILOU Zrealone
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Posts: 479
From: Brussels,Belgium,Europe
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-17-2001 10:07 AM
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On the other hand dinitropropane has about the same VOD as NG but is absolutely much less sensitive!!!
CH3-CHNO2-CH2NO2 and CH2NO2-CH2-CH2NO2
have about the same VOD as CH3-CHONO2-CH2ONO2 and CH2ONO2-CH2-CH2ONO2.
Remember that CH3-ONO2 (7500m/s) has a higher VOD than CH3-NO2 (6500m/s)(+1km/s).
I really think trinitropropane CH2NO2-CHNO2-CH2NO2 must be even better than NG!
Don't underestimate nitroaliphatic compounds they can be surprisingly interesting...weird chemistry, formation of detonating salts upon contact with bases...
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 01:29 PM
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I have been reading this site for some time now and after reading about all of these explosives i decide that i would find out for myself what some of these chenicals could do. So in my dream(-; i took three days of collage, i was very sick, and did some pretty hefty nitrating. The chemicals on which i performed tests were, picric acid, TeNN, RDX, Nitroglycerin, Ammonium Nitrate, TNX and di-nitropropane. All of these were set of by caps containing varring amounts of acetone peroxide and RDX. Some Nitrocelluose was also tested. All of the caps were electronic in nature. I have pictures as setting these chemicals of, for the first time in some cases, with all the electrics to deal with was enough, and posting pictures makes me nervious.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 01:49 PM
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O.k, first i will go throught the various ways that the chemicals could be, in theory be made. Picric acid is one of the harder chemicals to get good yields of, in the past i have used the asprin method, but this time i 'lent' some phenol of school, which i forgot to tell them i was lending, oh well. The phenol was placed in sulphuric acid, and then nitric acid added to the cooled mix. The complete process for this can be really found and works quite well if you are carefull about the nitration. Nitrocelluose was standard, TNX was made via a three stage nitration, thought yield was poor. The best nitration was of napathlene to TeNN, this was completed by the easily found three stage process of nitration, on Mega's site. The yield was excellent, this is a good nitration to try. The production of RDX consumed the most time, the nitric acid for this was purged of NO2 by the acid being heated to 50-60 degrees cel. and then air was manually blown through a long pipe which lead into the acid, after about 10 minutes the acid was much clearer. A NO2 scavenger and then added to the acid, urea, to remove an remaining NO2. This acid was then cooled below 20 degrees cel. and Hexamine added in the form of a powder, post addition the mixture was warmed to 55 degrees cel. for 5 minutes then cooled and dumped into cool water, this slow precipited 30 grams od RDX. Not to bad a yield, for the explosive.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 02:00 PM
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Nitroglycerin and Di-nitropropane were created by a simple nitration of there starting alcohol type compounds. This was were i had one of my first accidents, i did the NG in four batches. While tring to make the last batch, and complete the final nitration of my TeNN, the NG over heated, scared shit less of the whole lot going of i throw a bucket of water in the general direction of the reaction mixture. Some of the water went in a halted the reaction very quickly, though there was little NG formed from that reaction. The ammonium nitrate was water purified store brought ammonium nitrate, which was thoughtly dried.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 02:23 PM
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All of the tests were conducted on after the other, i have not used scientific methods to test to power of the explosives, and there all of my results are subjective.
First up was 30 Grams of TeNN, the charde was set the electrics checked, in retreated to 100 meters and charged up my electric firing rig, BOOM, holy shit, TeNN is way recommended. The charge made a crater of 1o inches across and 5 inches deep, nice. Next up was a mixture of 50/50 TeNN and Ammonium nitrate, 40 grams. The bang was louder than the previous charge, a little, but deeper. The crater was about the same size, nice mix. Next was picric acid, 42 grams, all of what i made, and well what could you say apart from fuck, holy fuck, this stuff was quite good, the crater was, however, about the same size as my TeNN/AN charge? Now came the big charges, first up a 100 gram 40 percent stick of dynamite. you can probably guess the results, i felt the shock wave hit me from 100 meters back, the crater it made was quite shallow, and quite wide, 3 tops deep, and 15 wide. I liked this stuff!!!
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 02:36 PM
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Next up was Di-Nitropropane, 20 grams, mixed as dynamite 40 percent, this was tested against the same quanty of nitroglycerin dynamite. The Di nitro was fired and went up well, and looked felt made a crater simlar to the tri nitro dynamite. Given how much safer it is, the di nitro, it is a cool explosive. The final top end of the explosives was next, first was 20 grams of pure RDX, no plastersizers were mixed with it. The crack from this stuff was felt as well as heard, it was very sharp, and loud. The crater was 7 inches across, which is quite wide for 20 grams, a thilling explosive, if you can make enough of it. The mixture of 40/60 RDX AN was disappointing, i was expecting a bang, put got nothing, don't know why, the cap fired, tore the plastic pipe it was in and rendered it unusable???
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 02:58 PM
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The test area was now looking a mess and i was having to mark which were old crater and which new, looked like the moon. Now i was down to my final charges 50 grams of a 94/6 percent mixture of NG/NC, more nitroglycerin of course, and a home brew hellofite mixture to use up the remaining nitric acid. The NG/NC mixture was rigged up, this i knew would be good. I ran down to my firing point, i was tinking to myself, please let this go off, i charged the rig, and up she went. If this charge was a woman she would be the sort that you cum in your pants when she looks your way, easily the bigest bang. The crater was 14 inch wide and 8 DEEP, NICE STUFF. After that nothing could compare, but i wired the Hellifite up, it cosisted of 20 ml of Xylene and 30 ml nitric. On firing the charge went up and was quite impressive, there was very little bang, more of a womph. A small fast fire ball was produced and the heat could be felt from 50 meters off, were i was laid. There was only scorching around the blast area, but the charge looked quite impressive.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-11-2001 03:00 PM
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In the end i didn't bother with the TNX, not worth it for want i had produced.
blackadder
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Posts: 313
From: London
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-11-2001 05:20 PM
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I bow down to you!!!
Very well done, I think I'll try NG as a high explosive when I get older, but I want to make some now!!! You felt the heat from 50m away? That's pretty damn powerful.
Agent Blak
Frequent Poster
Posts: 766
From: Sk. Canada
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-11-2001 11:01 PM
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congrats;
It seems that you have conducted a very professional test. I think a decent way to test to foces of a "GOODY"(coin by K.S.) would be a H20 displacement method; using a 55 Galon drum filled with H2O.
------------------
A wise man once said:
"...I Am Not Much of a Dancer But,
Just Wait Till The Fucking Begins"
Agent Blak-------OUT!!
Dracul
Frequent Poster
Posts: 73
From: Melbourne, Australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-12-2001 04:55 AM
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Now you just have to put the pics up.
------------------
"By the power of Grayskull, I HAVE THE POWER!" He-man
Check this out www.stileproject.com
Morrigan
Frequent Poster
Posts: 81
From: The Netherlands
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 03-12-2001 05:11 AM
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If all of this is true than you rule. Jesus man, producing and detonating so much different high explosives in such a short time is unbelievable. Nice results too. Get those pictures up. I would love to see the smoking craters…Damn you sure made a list.
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-12-2001 12:55 PM
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I just thought you might like to know that TeNN can be set off (although it is unreliable) without a detonator. Put a coil of about 2.5" of 20 s.w.g. copper wire into the explosive, connect it up to some nice long cables, and connect two car batteries to it in series. It heats up quickly, and this causes detonation. It only works, when using this method, about 30% of the time before the wire melts through and breaks the circuit, but with a bit of experimenting it could be made more reliable.
Why bother, you may be asking? Well, it means you don't have to use any nasty primary explosives, and it can't be set off by static or radio signals, and is therefore super-safe.
You just need to heat up a significant proportion of it very quickly to a fairly high temperature.
And I agree: TeNN is one of my favourite explosives. It's only drawback is the three stage nitration process, although it's not too bad. The ingredients are all very common, and it gives a pretty good yield.
Mr Cool
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Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-12-2001 12:58 PM
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P.S. - could you please post the methods you used to make TNX and dinitropropane?
Thanks in advance.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-13-2001 03:01 PM
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The TNX that i made was no good, and that is why i didn't detail its detonation, it formed as a black tar like mass, so i don't think you want my method for making that. However the dinitropropane i can answer, it is made as i simple one stage nitration of propane diol. The diol is the first hting that you will need to aquire, this is used as a component of some of the fancier anti frezes that you will find in places like Halfords, thats were i got mine. This will need concentrating, i use calcium chloride to do this, i brought this out of woolworths!!!. Place the anti freze in a bottle and add some calcuim chloride, a third the anti frezes volume will do. Screw on the bottles cap and then leave for an hour, filter out the calcuim chloride and collect the resulting liquid. This is now read, mix 30ml of strong nitric acid with 70ml of 95 percent or greater sulphuric, cool this mix in an ice bath. Once the mix is at 15 degrees cel. add the Diol, slowly, don't let the temp exceed 20 deg cel. Add 15ml of the diol to the acids, cool again and pour 300ml of cold water into the acid mix, extract the milky liquid of the bottom of the acid mix with an eye dropper, and place it in a 5 percent bi carbonate solution in a plastic bottle, plenty of bicar solution. Now, and this is safe, put the lid on the bottle and shake it, not to hard, for 5 seconds, then release the pressure, repeat at least 10 times. Extract the dinitro, place in a strong salt solution to extract the water out of the dinitro, and hay presto. Try to set this stuff of, it's quite hard to do, a really good wack is needed in the case of the pure material.
pete
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Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-13-2001 03:11 PM
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This is going to sound like the worlds biggest cop out, but the post was supose to say 'i have NOT taken any pictures as i was nervious as this was my first serious testing. However, not wanting to be called a bullshitter, now i'm more familar with doing this i may post some pics of future explosions, however, can someone tell me how this can be done safely, and were from, how much etc equipment will cost. As the cops nicking me for this is quite a worry, i therefore would like to know the in's and out's of how to post pics safely. Oh and is it possible to post sound, as that is half the thrill?
pete
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Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-13-2001 03:15 PM
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One last thing, does anyone think that the use of Phosphoric acid to dehydrate the acid mixture in the making of RDX will work, i read a patent detailing the use of p2o5 for this. Phosphoric acid is after all a powerfull dyhydrant, and easily made.
frostfire
Frequent Poster
Posts: 266
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-13-2001 03:58 PM
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hi, It's a great deal with your achievement!
how's the explosive bla-bla-bla rule in UK?
cuz in south east third world conutries like Indonesia, Malaysia,....(except Singapore), you can obtain at least 85 % of all exp. chemicals mentioned in Mega's site, all you need just money-money, and money....
...hence it's possible to make almost all nitrated based/all explosives......next summer overseas vacation would be fun =)
SATANIC
Frequent Poster
Posts: 237
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-13-2001 07:38 PM
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If this is true then you deserve to be called a master. a few more tests and you will be able to produce a write up you could put on the web as a manual. it would have some more personal details that would help a lot of peole who like to know that the methods they use have been sucessfully tested
Demolition
Frequent Poster
Posts: 158
From: Australia
Registered: FEB 2001
posted 03-13-2001 11:22 PM
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Extremely good information pete.I just have 2 questions for you.1-What explosive did you use in your blasting caps and how much?2-How many ml's of Nitric Acid did you use in the production of RDX and also how many grams of heaxmine did you use?All help is greatly appreciated.
Demolition
10fingers
Frequent Poster
Posts: 411
From: USA
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-13-2001 11:54 PM
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deleting post
[This message has been edited by 10fingers (edited March 19, 2001).]
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-14-2001 04:20 PM
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The caps were aluminium pipes of diameter 5 mm, the primary explosive i was using was acetone peroxide, and was pressed in the cap to a depth of 12mm. The base charge in the caps was RDX, 1 gram in most of the caps, also pressed in, i say most as some explosives don't need the RDX. The production of RDX is some what of a problem, the acid that you use has to be very pure, else you get complexing with the NO2 groups, which means no explosive. To produce 10 grams of RDX i used 50 ml of pure strong white nitric acid, and 8.3 grams of hexamine. It is improtant that you remove the NO2, or yeilds will be poor.
pete
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Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 03-14-2001 04:25 PM
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Would anyone happen to know how to make phosphorous, or any related phorphorous type chemicals eg P2O5 or PCl5 etc. Thanks!!!
blackadder
Frequent Poster
Posts: 313
From: London
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-15-2001 04:42 PM
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you can't exactly "make" phosphorus, as it's an element. However you can extract it. I'm sure that you are aware that phosphorus is present in match heads.
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-15-2001 06:09 PM
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Phosphorus hasn't been used in match heads for years. Although the strikers of safety matches contain some phosphorus, not enough to get a practical amount unless you have several thousand match boxes and a lot of patience.
Ages ago NBK2000 posted a procedure for extracting white phosphorus from animal bones. The proceude was a couple of hundred years old and so used only commonly available supplies (average people didn't have access to chemicals back then).
DarkAngel
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Posts: 592
From: ?
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-16-2001 07:40 AM
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Hey Anthony/NBK that sounds interesting can you post the recipe here?
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--==DarkAngel==--
For explosives and stuff go to Section1 http://www.section1.f2s.com
sendtosection1@hotmail.com
10fingers
Frequent Poster
Posts: 411
From: USA
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-16-2001 09:24 AM
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Pure phosphorous is very expensive to buy. I think the strike anywhere type matches may have some phosphorous on the tip. Some fertilizers contain potassium phosphate which you may be able to extract. Also, I have seen phosphoric acid for sale as a disinfect for dairy equipment. I think it was about a 75% solution. It is sold in rural areas at agricultural supply stores.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-16-2001 01:33 PM
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I posted the white phosphorus process in the appropriate section.
http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/Forum4/HTML/000158.html
You can skip all the extracting from bones if you buy ammonium phosphate at the ag store.
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"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"
Go here to download the NBK2000 website PDF.
Donutty
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Posts: 228
From: UK
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-16-2001 04:47 PM
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I have access to fertiliser with a high % of Potassium Phosphate (something like 0-??-25)
Mr Cool
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Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 03-17-2001 10:08 AM
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You can heat the white phosphorous in an inert atmosphere, and condense the vapours to form red phosphorous which is the only kind useful in pyrotechnics. I can't remember the exact procedure, I read it in an old chemistry book, but I thought I'd tell you that so that if you wanted to search for how to make red P then you would know what to look for.
frostfire
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Posts: 266
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-17-2001 10:47 AM
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hei,
when it's said yield is poor because of low conc. HNO3 or presence of NO2 or any other factors, is that mean that there's still explosive products but in a low quantity or you get pratically some ready-to-throw away crystals (no explosive)????
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 03-17-2001 07:36 PM
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Yeah, yield is the quantity of the product produced, so a poor yield = small amount of explosive.
fightclub
New Member
Posts: 39
From: none
Registered: APR 2001
posted 04-13-2001 06:54 PM
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One small error: Propyleneglycol dinitrate and dinitropropane are not the same compounds! It is like calling Methyl nitrate Nitromethane.
pete
Frequent Poster
Posts: 56
From: u.k
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 04-14-2001 06:59 AM
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True
PHILOU Zrealone
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Posts: 479
From: Brussels,Belgium,Europe
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-17-2001 10:07 AM
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On the other hand dinitropropane has about the same VOD as NG but is absolutely much less sensitive!!!
CH3-CHNO2-CH2NO2 and CH2NO2-CH2-CH2NO2
have about the same VOD as CH3-CHONO2-CH2ONO2 and CH2ONO2-CH2-CH2ONO2.
Remember that CH3-ONO2 (7500m/s) has a higher VOD than CH3-NO2 (6500m/s)(+1km/s).
I really think trinitropropane CH2NO2-CHNO2-CH2NO2 must be even better than NG!
Don't underestimate nitroaliphatic compounds they can be surprisingly interesting...weird chemistry, formation of detonating salts upon contact with bases...