megalomania
June 8th, 2003, 01:03 PM
TylerDurden
Frequent Poster
Posts: 94
From:
Registered: APR 2001
posted 04-27-2001 05:42 AM
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I was just wondering if ping pong balls could be used for yet another purpose. Since they are made of celluloid, which is just guncotton with a few percentages less nitrate in it, maybe it has some of the properties of guncotton. Guncotton can detonate. Now if you would grind the ping pong balls into (celluloid) dust, confine it, stick a blasting cap in it.... would it detonate?
Or put another way: can celluloid be made to detonate under certain circumstances (strong confinement, using a detonator with or without a booster, maybe adding some other chemicals (some nitrate maybe))? Or will it always be a low explosive because it contains just not enough nitrate.
[This message has been edited by TylerDurden (edited April 27, 2001).]
BoB-
Frequent Poster
Posts: 679
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-27-2001 07:28 AM
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Grind it into a dust? dude that would take like 1.8million pingpong balls to get a pound.
I think Aerodynamic Inventions (or whatever) use to have a method using ping pong balls as a AP binder.
the freshmaker
Frequent Poster
Posts: 175
From: Heaven
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 04-27-2001 07:30 AM
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I don't think that celluid is for any good as an explosive. It has a low nitrogen content compared to gungotton (13%)
BTW you'll neved a shitload of pingpong balls to make to have enough celluid for any bomb.
------------------
good boy with bad ideas
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-27-2001 03:50 PM
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Ping pong balls are only slightly nitrated, I doubt it would detonate unless inside a 100lb block of PETN confined in a 20ft thick walled steel sphere.
Test:
1.Double base smokeless powdered isn't that easy to detonate, now take some and set light to it - observe how fast it burns.
2.Take a ping pong ball and set light to it, observe how fast it burns.
3.Compare the two burn rates - realise how amazingly less nitrated ping ping balls are from DB SP.
No, ping pong balls are not an easily available, over the counter source of high explosive.
TylerDurden
Frequent Poster
Posts: 94
From:
Registered: APR 2001
posted 04-27-2001 07:37 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
But blackpowder also doesn't burn fast unconfined/in open air. And I remember something of inmates in a perticular case used celluloid (scratched from playing cards) to manufacture somekind of bomb, so...
zaibatsu
Frequent Poster
Posts: 407
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-27-2001 08:14 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Um, BP DOES burn fast unconfined, pretty damn fast for good comercial BP. Drop a match on a small pile of it, and you'll get a woosh sound, and some smoke. Its most likely that you mean smokeless powder. Although that doesn't burn too quickly unconfined, it burns very fiercely.
Also, it was nitrocellulose laquer that the inmate scratched off of the playing cards I believe, but killed himself with it in the end, by accident. Oh, and your two major points have both been wrong, please try and think about what you say before you post. Not an insult, just advice.
------------------
Handguns don't kill people... Half as well as full-auto
Visit me at www.surf.to/eliteforum
Agent Blak
Frequent Poster
Posts: 766
From: Sk. Canada
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-28-2001 11:25 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No one else has dreamt about the use of Ping Pong Balls to make to make AP Putty. The way I see it is why would you waste perfectly good smokeless(DP or SP) for AP Putty when you can use it with some Petrolium Jelly, Al Dust and need it togetherto have something more powerful and easier to detonate than ANNM? it is really beyond me.
------------------
A wise man once said:
"...There Will Be No
Stand Off At High Noon
... Shoot'em In The Back
And, Shoot'em In The Dark"
Agent Blak-------OUT!!
simply RED
Frequent Poster
Posts: 240
From: HELL
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 04-28-2001 12:23 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Acetone peroxide putty is really powerful when you make it with pure pyroxyline or good type of smokeless powder. I have tried to use it even for shaped charges and it seems to work, but not as good as plastified PETN...
Do someone know the detonation velocity of the AP putty when brought to maximum density?
TylerDurden
Frequent Poster
Posts: 94
From:
Registered: APR 2001
posted 04-29-2001 07:16 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OK, you convinced me. The chance that it was gonna work was not very high, I know. But it was just a thought. And an open mind and unconventional approaches can sometimes result in something useful. Just not this time.
By the way, can celluloid be used as a low explosive? That is: when confined and ignited will it burn and explode the container? Or is celluloid only a flammable chemical that needs oxygen/air to burn?
[This message has been edited by TylerDurden (edited April 29, 2001).]
CodeMason
Frequent Poster
Posts: 383
From: Your Nightmares
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 05-18-2001 10:54 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Cellophane" is an extremely common plastic subsitute, and is often coated woth nitrocellulose lacquer. Considering that this is the same grade of NC used in ping pong balls, and considering they now sell huge rolls of the stuff, I doubt it's very explosive.
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-18-2001 02:24 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Do you mean cellophane as in cling-film (saran wrap)? If so, why would they coat it with NC? Why wouldn't the layer of NC be apparent?
Frequent Poster
Posts: 94
From:
Registered: APR 2001
posted 04-27-2001 05:42 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was just wondering if ping pong balls could be used for yet another purpose. Since they are made of celluloid, which is just guncotton with a few percentages less nitrate in it, maybe it has some of the properties of guncotton. Guncotton can detonate. Now if you would grind the ping pong balls into (celluloid) dust, confine it, stick a blasting cap in it.... would it detonate?
Or put another way: can celluloid be made to detonate under certain circumstances (strong confinement, using a detonator with or without a booster, maybe adding some other chemicals (some nitrate maybe))? Or will it always be a low explosive because it contains just not enough nitrate.
[This message has been edited by TylerDurden (edited April 27, 2001).]
BoB-
Frequent Poster
Posts: 679
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-27-2001 07:28 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Grind it into a dust? dude that would take like 1.8million pingpong balls to get a pound.
I think Aerodynamic Inventions (or whatever) use to have a method using ping pong balls as a AP binder.
the freshmaker
Frequent Poster
Posts: 175
From: Heaven
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 04-27-2001 07:30 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't think that celluid is for any good as an explosive. It has a low nitrogen content compared to gungotton (13%)
BTW you'll neved a shitload of pingpong balls to make to have enough celluid for any bomb.
------------------
good boy with bad ideas
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-27-2001 03:50 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ping pong balls are only slightly nitrated, I doubt it would detonate unless inside a 100lb block of PETN confined in a 20ft thick walled steel sphere.
Test:
1.Double base smokeless powdered isn't that easy to detonate, now take some and set light to it - observe how fast it burns.
2.Take a ping pong ball and set light to it, observe how fast it burns.
3.Compare the two burn rates - realise how amazingly less nitrated ping ping balls are from DB SP.
No, ping pong balls are not an easily available, over the counter source of high explosive.
TylerDurden
Frequent Poster
Posts: 94
From:
Registered: APR 2001
posted 04-27-2001 07:37 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
But blackpowder also doesn't burn fast unconfined/in open air. And I remember something of inmates in a perticular case used celluloid (scratched from playing cards) to manufacture somekind of bomb, so...
zaibatsu
Frequent Poster
Posts: 407
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-27-2001 08:14 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Um, BP DOES burn fast unconfined, pretty damn fast for good comercial BP. Drop a match on a small pile of it, and you'll get a woosh sound, and some smoke. Its most likely that you mean smokeless powder. Although that doesn't burn too quickly unconfined, it burns very fiercely.
Also, it was nitrocellulose laquer that the inmate scratched off of the playing cards I believe, but killed himself with it in the end, by accident. Oh, and your two major points have both been wrong, please try and think about what you say before you post. Not an insult, just advice.
------------------
Handguns don't kill people... Half as well as full-auto
Visit me at www.surf.to/eliteforum
Agent Blak
Frequent Poster
Posts: 766
From: Sk. Canada
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-28-2001 11:25 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No one else has dreamt about the use of Ping Pong Balls to make to make AP Putty. The way I see it is why would you waste perfectly good smokeless(DP or SP) for AP Putty when you can use it with some Petrolium Jelly, Al Dust and need it togetherto have something more powerful and easier to detonate than ANNM? it is really beyond me.
------------------
A wise man once said:
"...There Will Be No
Stand Off At High Noon
... Shoot'em In The Back
And, Shoot'em In The Dark"
Agent Blak-------OUT!!
simply RED
Frequent Poster
Posts: 240
From: HELL
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 04-28-2001 12:23 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Acetone peroxide putty is really powerful when you make it with pure pyroxyline or good type of smokeless powder. I have tried to use it even for shaped charges and it seems to work, but not as good as plastified PETN...
Do someone know the detonation velocity of the AP putty when brought to maximum density?
TylerDurden
Frequent Poster
Posts: 94
From:
Registered: APR 2001
posted 04-29-2001 07:16 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OK, you convinced me. The chance that it was gonna work was not very high, I know. But it was just a thought. And an open mind and unconventional approaches can sometimes result in something useful. Just not this time.
By the way, can celluloid be used as a low explosive? That is: when confined and ignited will it burn and explode the container? Or is celluloid only a flammable chemical that needs oxygen/air to burn?
[This message has been edited by TylerDurden (edited April 29, 2001).]
CodeMason
Frequent Poster
Posts: 383
From: Your Nightmares
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 05-18-2001 10:54 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Cellophane" is an extremely common plastic subsitute, and is often coated woth nitrocellulose lacquer. Considering that this is the same grade of NC used in ping pong balls, and considering they now sell huge rolls of the stuff, I doubt it's very explosive.
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-18-2001 02:24 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Do you mean cellophane as in cling-film (saran wrap)? If so, why would they coat it with NC? Why wouldn't the layer of NC be apparent?