megalomania
June 14th, 2003, 08:51 PM
shady mutha
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-18-2001 07:07 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is from"Techniques of safecracking"by Wayne B Yeager-Loompanics Unlimited.
Chapter 7 -Explosives.
One of the burglars methods of safe entry is via high explosive.Nitroglycerine is still widely used today,but the power,reliability,and safety of plastic explosives,such as C-4,is favored by modern safecrackers over the old timers "grease"
Back in the old days ,nitroglycerine was simply drained from dynamite sticks,but when stricter guidelines for dynamite manufacture were introduced,burglars found it necessary to make their own.Nitro is simply a mixture of nitric and sulfuric acids with a little glycerin thrown in.There are several books on the market today which offer the recipe,but one of the best is Uncle Festers"home workshop explosives".
When blowing a safe with nitroglycerine,the safecracker also needs a moldable substance to create a funnel-like device.Historically,soap(such as fels Naptha)has been used for this function.When the soap is hand kneaded for about 15 minutes,it becomes a very malleable substance with a consistency that will not permit the nitro to leak through it.Also in the safecrackers toolbag should be a strip of cellophane,blasting caps,and a prybar.
Of all nitroglycerine techniques,the most common is what is called the"jam-shot."It is feasible on most safes,round and square door alike,and requires no physical movement of the safe.The purpose of the jam-shot is to blow the door open while still on its hinges.Occasionally a safecracker will use too much"grease"which requires either another shot of nitro,or some serious door prying.
The piece of cellophane is folded into an 8"x1/2" strip,and placed lengthwise into the space between the door and the door frame.The soap is fashioned into a cup,with a funnel shape made around the cellophane.This provides a channel for the flow of the nitroglycerine once it is introduced into the cup.The blasting cap is places carefully into the cup,the wires are unrolled and extended to the battery hookup,which should be safely out the way of the explosion.
I will finish this later if people are interested.
Pyro
Frequent Poster
Posts: 104
From: Danbury,CT,U.S.A
Registered: MAR 2001
posted 04-18-2001 08:50 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Something in that which caught my attention was the mention of uncle fester's book, which has the reliablity of the A-crapbook.Just someting to keep in mind.-Pyro
firebreether
Frequent Poster
Posts: 110
From:
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 04-18-2001 10:11 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why would you need a book to know how to make nitroglycerin? All it is is nitrated glycerin just like nitro-anything is nitrated anything. Which means a nitration bath. And it shouldn't be too hard to get optimal ratios of HNO3 and glycerin and H2SO4. All you need is common sense not to blow your ass up.
BoB-
Frequent Poster
Posts: 679
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-18-2001 11:55 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dude, Nitro kills experienced chemists, it requires perfection everytime.
shady mutha
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-19-2001 02:01 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The nitro is now poured into the cup,and the safecracker observes the rate at which the safe is"drinking".Nitro is a syrupy liquid,and there must be a continuos,unbroken chain of liquid all the way to the detonator.When approximately one ounce has been consumed,and the burglar has determined that a continuous river of nitro exists from the last drop down inside the door,all the way to the blasting cap,he sets off the detonater.This is the real art of safe blowing-knowing exactly when to detonate.If all goes well,the safe door will be blown open,and the contents revealed.
The "gut-shot"or"spindle shot" is another very popular nitroglycerine method.The use of the gut-shot is limited,though,since the safe must be moveable,and the modern safes relocking device may render this technique useless.
The gut-shot requires that the burglar first knock off the combination dial with a hammer,then tilt the safe over on its back.A blasting cap is attached to the spindle,and an eyedropper-and-a-half of "grease"is allowed to trickle down the shaft of the spindle.The nitro will find its way into the locking mechanism,and when detonated,will destroy the entire "guts" of the lock.The door can then be opened by simply turning the handle.
In addition to nitroglycerine,professional burglars use castable high explosives such as C-4,PETN,RDX or TNT to either blow a hole in the safe,or blow the safe apart.These high explosives can be sometimes be purchased from legitimate users,or can be manufactures using a formula in"home workshop explosives".
The ribbon charge is simply a rectangular box of high explosive placed on or near the target safe.To help direct the force of the explosion,several bags filled with water are placed on the charge.This also serves to significantly reduce the noise level of the explosion.This type of explosive technique will usually penetrate 3-4 inches of steel,so obviously a great amount of damage is done to the safe.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-19-2001 10:19 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Any modern safe would not open to an explosive attack against the lock. As soon as the lock is seperated from the safe door, spring loaded relockers kick into place, sealing the safe.
Better safes have a tempered glass backing that will shatter upon any serious shock to the safe.
------------------
"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"
Go here to download the NBK2000 website PDF.
Go here to download the NBK2000 videos.
shady mutha
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-20-2001 01:43 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is another method listed in that book,it is the same as the paladin press video'A to Z of B and E Vol 2'.Basicly the safeman drills a hole in the safe,fills it completely with water and inserts a pencil shaped explosive and detonates it,he says water does not compress,so the safe comes open.In the video which I also have it shows the bloke drilling the hole,its doesn't show what they put in but you do see him putting money in the safe-Boom-the safe was turned into dust and tennis ball sized chunks,the metal covering of the safe is still in one piece,the bloke gets the money out.
Machiavelli
Frequent Poster
Posts: 281
From: Germany
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-20-2001 05:08 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Do you have a scanner? Or a tv-card?
shady mutha
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-20-2001 07:40 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah,got a scanner,but my computer skills are very poor.I have many books that I would like to publish on the net,but the fact is I don't know how.If anyone knows a reasonably easy way to do it I will give it a go.
I tried to send a member a book threw hotmail attachments and it was a fuck up.My scanner is very slow.about 3-5 mins per page.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-20-2001 10:31 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have a video that shows a cast iron shell rupturing after it's been filled with water and placed in a freezing mix.
Water, being incompressible, and expanding when frozen, exerts incredible pressure that will rupture almost anything.
I've thought that, if someone stole a safe during winter in a cold region, rather than trying to break it open on site, just remove to somewhere safe and drill a hole in it and fill completely with water. Tap the hole and seal. Leave it outside and the water will freeze overnight and bust the safe.
This all assumes that you can move the safe and that what's inside won't be destroyed by the pressure. If it's just money than there'd be no problem. But if there's jewelry or guns, the pressure will crush them.
------------------
"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"
Go here to download the NBK2000 website PDF.
Go here to download the NBK2000 videos.
Machiavelli
Frequent Poster
Posts: 281
From: Germany
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-21-2001 03:56 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If the attacker already managed to drill the safe, there are much better techniques to use.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-21-2001 10:56 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Perhaps if one could pour a supersaturated solution that would freeze and expand when a crystal or some other activator was added. Then you could break a safe on the spot without any freezing.
------------------
"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"
Go here to download the NBK2000 website PDF.
Go here to download the NBK2000 videos.
blackadder
Frequent Poster
Posts: 313
From: London
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 04-21-2001 11:31 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If one could drill into the safe, then couldn't one just drill a series of holes in the shape of a square or circle, and then punch out the square or circle.
Sounds rather easy to me.
Machiavelli
Frequent Poster
Posts: 281
From: Germany
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-21-2001 01:30 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
blackadder:
If you're trying to drill a series of holes in a real safe (anti-burglar, not anti-fire) you'll need a lot of time and a lot of good drill bits. You'll be going against hardened steel, carbide plates and some other fun stuff. Good luck.
Drilling safes means making one or a few holes that allow you to either manipulate the locking mechanism of the door or use an endoscope to look at the discpack of the safelock.
And if you're going against a fire-protection "safe" you'd be better off using a disc grinder to chop it.
Shady Mutha:
Using mail attachments is pretty hopeless for this stuff. You need to use ftp or maybe a webdrive. Maybe I'll start a thread on this tomorrow, don't have the time right now.
shady mutha
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-21-2001 06:05 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I once tried to get into a large safe,anyone who has done'breaks'knows cracking safes is easier said than done.Anyway we rocked up with heaps of tools, it took half the night just getting in the place,waiting to see if the anyone showed after cutting the alarm.Some alarms run off mobile phones so even if you cut the phone lines the message may still get through so you have to wait.Anyway my mate is much stronger than me so I got him to start drilling.The safe was a fucking monster and demoralized us on the spot,we fucked up by not drilling a leader hole (I think)anyway the drill wouldn't bite,and after half an hour we left without so much as a dent in the safe.
Gollum
Frequent Poster
Posts: 92
From:
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 05-11-2001 04:23 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you don't really care about what's inside the safe (I make that assumption because you're using explosives anyways), you could use a shape charge or a drill to make a hole in a wall of it. Then you would fill the hole with a high det. velocity explosive and detonate it. It should make a nice big circle (Depending on the metal's crystal patterns).
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-11-2001 08:50 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Surely the idea of going to the trouble of getting into the safe is to take what is inside?
Unless it contained evidence incriminating you?
PYRO500
Moderator
Posts: 1465
From: somewhere in florida
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-11-2001 11:54 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
how about a hollow thermal lance with o2 pumped through it? or better yet a backpack oxy acetelene torch? or even thermite. I looked at the bank in town's safe and I looked at the back, they have a plate glass slab over some springloaded devices that will lock it into place on all four sides, I dont think it takes much to break that glass so on big safes I think lock disableing is out of the question even drilling the lock might break the glass. I say melt the dam safe full of water, that way not too much damage comes to the stuff inside, just if you use thermite you still may have problems.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-12-2001 10:32 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Perhaps explosive rupturing from the inside would work.
The key would be to use the explosive in such a way that the contents aren't destroyed.
If the safe contains precious metals like silver coins or gold bullion, than a straight explosive could be used because the contents won't change from the heat or pressure.
Gemstones might shatter from a brisant charge so something with high gas volume but low brisance would be better. (azide pellets)
Paper documents can't take any heat without burning, but they're immune from shock. So filling the safe with water before blowing the charge would keep it safe.
Remember, safes are designed to keep people out, not explosive pressures in. The stronger the safe the more pressure will be needed. For this purpose, total gas volume in the most important factor because it's the internal overpressure that's going to cause a rupture.
Perhaps the azide pellets from an airbag (or several) could be inserted inside a tube which then passes through into the safe via hole.
The pellets are formulated to release a very large amount of nitrogen in almost instantly. And the gas is cooler than papers ignition point because of the additives mixed with the azide to keep people getting burned by it.
The glass relocker may be a problem or not, depending. If the explosive pressure is high enough, it'll rupture the case regardless. If not, the relocker will be activated.
A possible way to defeat it would be to drill 2 small holes in the safe door. One at the top, one at the bottom. Thread both holes for bolts. Then inject quick hardening foam inside the door from the bottom.
As it expands and hardens, the pressure will be relieved out the top hole until foam comes out.
Once it's all hardened, put in the bolts. Now the relockers are frozen in place by the foam, unable to activate in time to prevent the door from blowing open.
------------------
"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"
Go here to download the NBK2000 website PDF.
Go here to download the NBK2000 videos.
Pyro
Frequent Poster
Posts: 104
From: Danbury,CT,U.S.A
Registered: MAR 2001
posted 05-12-2001 04:23 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, if your serious about getting one of the fuckers open then I don't see why you can't by the same safe(If buying the safe is cost effective, if not, this isn't such a good idea)and then make a batch or two of thermite and see how much thermite it takes to melt through the top so as not to damage the valuables inside.Once you know the exact amount of thermite then hit your mark and burn a huge hole right through the safe.I'm no expert on safes, it just seems like this is a relatively easy way to get into a safe but albeit there's some unspoken rule about not using thermite on safes and I'm gonna get whacked.-Pyro
DarkAngel
Frequent Poster
Posts: 592
From: ?
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-17-2001 05:43 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Talking about short of cash you will probable
all know those machines in supermarkets where you can putt your empty coke/beer bottles in in order to get the receipt and exchange it to money,
How do these things work and is there away to fool these thing's?
------------------
DarkAngel
For explosives and stuff go to Section1 http://www.section1.f2s.com And http://run.to/section1
sendtosection1@hotmail.com
sealsix6
Frequent Poster
Posts: 154
From: NYC,NYC,USA
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 05-17-2001 05:57 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I dont know if you have the same kind of can ones by me but they look like 2 rollers that roll and it pushes the can in well what you do is you put your finger in the can and let it go in and pull it out with your finger and let it go in again and pull it back out (I once saw a bum do it)
DarkAngel
Frequent Poster
Posts: 592
From: ?
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-18-2001 02:52 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No that isn't possible here because they made a corner in the machine so you can't pull them back
------------------
DarkAngel
For explosives and stuff go to Section1 http://www.section1.f2s.com And http://run.to/section1
sendtosection1@hotmail.com
CodeMason
Frequent Poster
Posts: 383
From: Your Nightmares
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 05-19-2001 09:07 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Uncle Fester's book on explosives does indeed suck royally. But his book on synthetic drug manufacture, Secrets of Methamphetamine Manufacture, contains some pretty good "recipes".
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-18-2001 07:07 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is from"Techniques of safecracking"by Wayne B Yeager-Loompanics Unlimited.
Chapter 7 -Explosives.
One of the burglars methods of safe entry is via high explosive.Nitroglycerine is still widely used today,but the power,reliability,and safety of plastic explosives,such as C-4,is favored by modern safecrackers over the old timers "grease"
Back in the old days ,nitroglycerine was simply drained from dynamite sticks,but when stricter guidelines for dynamite manufacture were introduced,burglars found it necessary to make their own.Nitro is simply a mixture of nitric and sulfuric acids with a little glycerin thrown in.There are several books on the market today which offer the recipe,but one of the best is Uncle Festers"home workshop explosives".
When blowing a safe with nitroglycerine,the safecracker also needs a moldable substance to create a funnel-like device.Historically,soap(such as fels Naptha)has been used for this function.When the soap is hand kneaded for about 15 minutes,it becomes a very malleable substance with a consistency that will not permit the nitro to leak through it.Also in the safecrackers toolbag should be a strip of cellophane,blasting caps,and a prybar.
Of all nitroglycerine techniques,the most common is what is called the"jam-shot."It is feasible on most safes,round and square door alike,and requires no physical movement of the safe.The purpose of the jam-shot is to blow the door open while still on its hinges.Occasionally a safecracker will use too much"grease"which requires either another shot of nitro,or some serious door prying.
The piece of cellophane is folded into an 8"x1/2" strip,and placed lengthwise into the space between the door and the door frame.The soap is fashioned into a cup,with a funnel shape made around the cellophane.This provides a channel for the flow of the nitroglycerine once it is introduced into the cup.The blasting cap is places carefully into the cup,the wires are unrolled and extended to the battery hookup,which should be safely out the way of the explosion.
I will finish this later if people are interested.
Pyro
Frequent Poster
Posts: 104
From: Danbury,CT,U.S.A
Registered: MAR 2001
posted 04-18-2001 08:50 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Something in that which caught my attention was the mention of uncle fester's book, which has the reliablity of the A-crapbook.Just someting to keep in mind.-Pyro
firebreether
Frequent Poster
Posts: 110
From:
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 04-18-2001 10:11 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why would you need a book to know how to make nitroglycerin? All it is is nitrated glycerin just like nitro-anything is nitrated anything. Which means a nitration bath. And it shouldn't be too hard to get optimal ratios of HNO3 and glycerin and H2SO4. All you need is common sense not to blow your ass up.
BoB-
Frequent Poster
Posts: 679
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-18-2001 11:55 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dude, Nitro kills experienced chemists, it requires perfection everytime.
shady mutha
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-19-2001 02:01 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The nitro is now poured into the cup,and the safecracker observes the rate at which the safe is"drinking".Nitro is a syrupy liquid,and there must be a continuos,unbroken chain of liquid all the way to the detonator.When approximately one ounce has been consumed,and the burglar has determined that a continuous river of nitro exists from the last drop down inside the door,all the way to the blasting cap,he sets off the detonater.This is the real art of safe blowing-knowing exactly when to detonate.If all goes well,the safe door will be blown open,and the contents revealed.
The "gut-shot"or"spindle shot" is another very popular nitroglycerine method.The use of the gut-shot is limited,though,since the safe must be moveable,and the modern safes relocking device may render this technique useless.
The gut-shot requires that the burglar first knock off the combination dial with a hammer,then tilt the safe over on its back.A blasting cap is attached to the spindle,and an eyedropper-and-a-half of "grease"is allowed to trickle down the shaft of the spindle.The nitro will find its way into the locking mechanism,and when detonated,will destroy the entire "guts" of the lock.The door can then be opened by simply turning the handle.
In addition to nitroglycerine,professional burglars use castable high explosives such as C-4,PETN,RDX or TNT to either blow a hole in the safe,or blow the safe apart.These high explosives can be sometimes be purchased from legitimate users,or can be manufactures using a formula in"home workshop explosives".
The ribbon charge is simply a rectangular box of high explosive placed on or near the target safe.To help direct the force of the explosion,several bags filled with water are placed on the charge.This also serves to significantly reduce the noise level of the explosion.This type of explosive technique will usually penetrate 3-4 inches of steel,so obviously a great amount of damage is done to the safe.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-19-2001 10:19 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Any modern safe would not open to an explosive attack against the lock. As soon as the lock is seperated from the safe door, spring loaded relockers kick into place, sealing the safe.
Better safes have a tempered glass backing that will shatter upon any serious shock to the safe.
------------------
"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"
Go here to download the NBK2000 website PDF.
Go here to download the NBK2000 videos.
shady mutha
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-20-2001 01:43 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is another method listed in that book,it is the same as the paladin press video'A to Z of B and E Vol 2'.Basicly the safeman drills a hole in the safe,fills it completely with water and inserts a pencil shaped explosive and detonates it,he says water does not compress,so the safe comes open.In the video which I also have it shows the bloke drilling the hole,its doesn't show what they put in but you do see him putting money in the safe-Boom-the safe was turned into dust and tennis ball sized chunks,the metal covering of the safe is still in one piece,the bloke gets the money out.
Machiavelli
Frequent Poster
Posts: 281
From: Germany
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-20-2001 05:08 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Do you have a scanner? Or a tv-card?
shady mutha
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-20-2001 07:40 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah,got a scanner,but my computer skills are very poor.I have many books that I would like to publish on the net,but the fact is I don't know how.If anyone knows a reasonably easy way to do it I will give it a go.
I tried to send a member a book threw hotmail attachments and it was a fuck up.My scanner is very slow.about 3-5 mins per page.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-20-2001 10:31 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have a video that shows a cast iron shell rupturing after it's been filled with water and placed in a freezing mix.
Water, being incompressible, and expanding when frozen, exerts incredible pressure that will rupture almost anything.
I've thought that, if someone stole a safe during winter in a cold region, rather than trying to break it open on site, just remove to somewhere safe and drill a hole in it and fill completely with water. Tap the hole and seal. Leave it outside and the water will freeze overnight and bust the safe.
This all assumes that you can move the safe and that what's inside won't be destroyed by the pressure. If it's just money than there'd be no problem. But if there's jewelry or guns, the pressure will crush them.
------------------
"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"
Go here to download the NBK2000 website PDF.
Go here to download the NBK2000 videos.
Machiavelli
Frequent Poster
Posts: 281
From: Germany
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-21-2001 03:56 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If the attacker already managed to drill the safe, there are much better techniques to use.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-21-2001 10:56 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Perhaps if one could pour a supersaturated solution that would freeze and expand when a crystal or some other activator was added. Then you could break a safe on the spot without any freezing.
------------------
"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"
Go here to download the NBK2000 website PDF.
Go here to download the NBK2000 videos.
blackadder
Frequent Poster
Posts: 313
From: London
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 04-21-2001 11:31 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If one could drill into the safe, then couldn't one just drill a series of holes in the shape of a square or circle, and then punch out the square or circle.
Sounds rather easy to me.
Machiavelli
Frequent Poster
Posts: 281
From: Germany
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-21-2001 01:30 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
blackadder:
If you're trying to drill a series of holes in a real safe (anti-burglar, not anti-fire) you'll need a lot of time and a lot of good drill bits. You'll be going against hardened steel, carbide plates and some other fun stuff. Good luck.
Drilling safes means making one or a few holes that allow you to either manipulate the locking mechanism of the door or use an endoscope to look at the discpack of the safelock.
And if you're going against a fire-protection "safe" you'd be better off using a disc grinder to chop it.
Shady Mutha:
Using mail attachments is pretty hopeless for this stuff. You need to use ftp or maybe a webdrive. Maybe I'll start a thread on this tomorrow, don't have the time right now.
shady mutha
Frequent Poster
Posts: 149
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 04-21-2001 06:05 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I once tried to get into a large safe,anyone who has done'breaks'knows cracking safes is easier said than done.Anyway we rocked up with heaps of tools, it took half the night just getting in the place,waiting to see if the anyone showed after cutting the alarm.Some alarms run off mobile phones so even if you cut the phone lines the message may still get through so you have to wait.Anyway my mate is much stronger than me so I got him to start drilling.The safe was a fucking monster and demoralized us on the spot,we fucked up by not drilling a leader hole (I think)anyway the drill wouldn't bite,and after half an hour we left without so much as a dent in the safe.
Gollum
Frequent Poster
Posts: 92
From:
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 05-11-2001 04:23 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you don't really care about what's inside the safe (I make that assumption because you're using explosives anyways), you could use a shape charge or a drill to make a hole in a wall of it. Then you would fill the hole with a high det. velocity explosive and detonate it. It should make a nice big circle (Depending on the metal's crystal patterns).
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-11-2001 08:50 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Surely the idea of going to the trouble of getting into the safe is to take what is inside?
Unless it contained evidence incriminating you?
PYRO500
Moderator
Posts: 1465
From: somewhere in florida
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-11-2001 11:54 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
how about a hollow thermal lance with o2 pumped through it? or better yet a backpack oxy acetelene torch? or even thermite. I looked at the bank in town's safe and I looked at the back, they have a plate glass slab over some springloaded devices that will lock it into place on all four sides, I dont think it takes much to break that glass so on big safes I think lock disableing is out of the question even drilling the lock might break the glass. I say melt the dam safe full of water, that way not too much damage comes to the stuff inside, just if you use thermite you still may have problems.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1096
From: Guess
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-12-2001 10:32 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Perhaps explosive rupturing from the inside would work.
The key would be to use the explosive in such a way that the contents aren't destroyed.
If the safe contains precious metals like silver coins or gold bullion, than a straight explosive could be used because the contents won't change from the heat or pressure.
Gemstones might shatter from a brisant charge so something with high gas volume but low brisance would be better. (azide pellets)
Paper documents can't take any heat without burning, but they're immune from shock. So filling the safe with water before blowing the charge would keep it safe.
Remember, safes are designed to keep people out, not explosive pressures in. The stronger the safe the more pressure will be needed. For this purpose, total gas volume in the most important factor because it's the internal overpressure that's going to cause a rupture.
Perhaps the azide pellets from an airbag (or several) could be inserted inside a tube which then passes through into the safe via hole.
The pellets are formulated to release a very large amount of nitrogen in almost instantly. And the gas is cooler than papers ignition point because of the additives mixed with the azide to keep people getting burned by it.
The glass relocker may be a problem or not, depending. If the explosive pressure is high enough, it'll rupture the case regardless. If not, the relocker will be activated.
A possible way to defeat it would be to drill 2 small holes in the safe door. One at the top, one at the bottom. Thread both holes for bolts. Then inject quick hardening foam inside the door from the bottom.
As it expands and hardens, the pressure will be relieved out the top hole until foam comes out.
Once it's all hardened, put in the bolts. Now the relockers are frozen in place by the foam, unable to activate in time to prevent the door from blowing open.
------------------
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Pyro
Frequent Poster
Posts: 104
From: Danbury,CT,U.S.A
Registered: MAR 2001
posted 05-12-2001 04:23 PM
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Well, if your serious about getting one of the fuckers open then I don't see why you can't by the same safe(If buying the safe is cost effective, if not, this isn't such a good idea)and then make a batch or two of thermite and see how much thermite it takes to melt through the top so as not to damage the valuables inside.Once you know the exact amount of thermite then hit your mark and burn a huge hole right through the safe.I'm no expert on safes, it just seems like this is a relatively easy way to get into a safe but albeit there's some unspoken rule about not using thermite on safes and I'm gonna get whacked.-Pyro
DarkAngel
Frequent Poster
Posts: 592
From: ?
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-17-2001 05:43 PM
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Talking about short of cash you will probable
all know those machines in supermarkets where you can putt your empty coke/beer bottles in in order to get the receipt and exchange it to money,
How do these things work and is there away to fool these thing's?
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DarkAngel
For explosives and stuff go to Section1 http://www.section1.f2s.com And http://run.to/section1
sendtosection1@hotmail.com
sealsix6
Frequent Poster
Posts: 154
From: NYC,NYC,USA
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 05-17-2001 05:57 PM
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I dont know if you have the same kind of can ones by me but they look like 2 rollers that roll and it pushes the can in well what you do is you put your finger in the can and let it go in and pull it out with your finger and let it go in again and pull it back out (I once saw a bum do it)
DarkAngel
Frequent Poster
Posts: 592
From: ?
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 05-18-2001 02:52 AM
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No that isn't possible here because they made a corner in the machine so you can't pull them back
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DarkAngel
For explosives and stuff go to Section1 http://www.section1.f2s.com And http://run.to/section1
sendtosection1@hotmail.com
CodeMason
Frequent Poster
Posts: 383
From: Your Nightmares
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 05-19-2001 09:07 PM
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Uncle Fester's book on explosives does indeed suck royally. But his book on synthetic drug manufacture, Secrets of Methamphetamine Manufacture, contains some pretty good "recipes".