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nbk2000
December 25th, 2003, 02:16 AM
Most people are familar with the word "Grinch", being associated with a codgerly green-furred creature that lives in a cave and hates christmas, but that, in the end, comes to love it after being taught the spirit of giving.

Awwwww....touching story...but that's not what a Grinch really is.

Virtually no one knows it, but the author of the Dr. Suess books was a student of old english mythology at Harvard, and that mythology was an inspiration for many of his stories.

The word "Grinch" is actually a contraction of old galech, "Grin 'ach", meaning "Smiling Demon".

While the exact nature of the Grinch isn't known with certainty, it's possible to infer from the large amount of stories in irish and scottish folklore, the countries from which the Grinch seems to have originated from, certain aspects of its behavior.

The green fur commonly mentioned in folklore is likely an evolutionary adaptation to the grassy hills of that region, allowing the Grinch to blend in with it's surroundings. Whether the Grinch's fur is actually green, or a symbiotic coating of green moss as is found in some species of sloths, or whether it is fur at all, is unknown.

From the association of the Grinch with christmas, as well as common references to how the Grinch is only seen during nighttime hours, would imply that the Grinch is a nocturnal creature.

Given how the winter solstice, the longest night of the year, is only a week away from christmas, the association with christmas becomes obvious, as any nocturnal creature would be most frequently active during this time.

Also, unlike the Grinch from the Dr. Suess stories, the Grinch in galech folklore was a decidedly unpleasant creature to encounter, as it was a predator.

Many stories about the Grinch ended with relatives, arriving late for christmas, finding the entire family as piles of bones contained within the sack of their intact skins, hidden around the house in various dark places, such as closets and underneath beds. This is also likely the orgin of such common folklore sayings as "Skeleton in the closet" and "Monsters under the bed".

Some people in old times had come close to the Grinch and survived to pass on what they had seen, as the Grinch apparently only attacks when it is alone with its victim, rather than when in a group as is common during family holidays.

From these few reports, it would seem that the Grinch has the ability to mimic it's previous victims appearance. This would appear impossible, requiring some kind of mimicing ability.

However, when you consider how the skins of victims have been found totally intact, head to toe, the reason for this is obvious...the Grinch takes the skin of its prey as its own.

It would appear that since the bones are still inside the skin, and not expelled, that the Grinch doesn't have a rigid skeleton of it's own, but rather a invertibrate body that allows it to flow into the space left behind inside of the skin once the organs and flesh are devoured.

The people who encountered the Grinch in its disguised form always noticed how the Grinch never spoke words, only imitating the sounds of those around it, such as laughter. This is entirely possible since parrots can imitate even speech, though something as complex as speech is beyond the capability of non-human lifeforms.

Given all these clues, the following scenario would seem plausible to explain these stories:

People would travel by carriage from the city to their family homes in the country for christmas. When they inevitably stopped at some point to relieve themselves, one of the party would be attacked and assimilated by the Grinch, which would assume their appearance.

The Grinch, seeking further prey, would then travel with the others, perhaps laughing when others laughed, but otherwise being silent. This would simply be passed off as a bad mood.

Upon arrival at the home, the Grinch would then simply wait until someone left the safety of the group, whereupon they would be attacked and assimilated, the discarded skin of the previous victim being hidden in a dark place where it'd likely not be quickly discovered, such places being under the bed or a closet.

The newly assimilated Grinch would then return to the group to watch for another opportunity to attack.

The cycle would repeat itself until either the last person was consumed, no doubt wondering where everyone else went to, or the last few people realized something was terribly wrong, at which point the Grinch would either flee (shedding it's disguise) and disappear into the surrounding wilderness, or attack the last few remaining victims and finishing them off.

While no Grinch has ever been found, probably because of it's highly evolved camouflage and unexpected nature, there are a few interesting possibilities that come to mind.

My personal theory is that the Grinch was a highly evolved form of slime mold. Being amorphous, slime mold would be able to flow into the voids of a hollowed-out corpse. This would also explain the green color noted by the few eyewitness accounts that have been attributed to fur.

As a mold, it would be highly vulnerable to damage, so as a predator it would have to attack its prey using stealth to ambush it, minimizing risk to its fragile body.

Being a mold would also explain its nocturnal nature, as sunlight is lethal to molds. Caves, as mentioned in the childrens story, would be a perpetually dark enviroment in which a mold could thrive.

Mold also typically emit noxious odors. This would explain the "Stink, Stank, Stunk" line from the song about the Grinch. Though no mention is made by the eyewitnesses of there being any unusual odors present. Perhaps the odor was being contained by the bag of skin that the Grinch was wearing at the time.

Given the large number of sheep found in the region, it would seem likely that the frequent predation of the sheep could be at least partially explained by a predator other than wolves, a nearly extinct species in that region, a "wolf" that could literally dress in sheeps clothing (skin) and approach a flock without alarming it, picking off the stragglers while all the while living amoungst them.

It's a curious fact that there's almost as many pigs as sheep being raised there, yet there's no reports of consumtion of the pig flesh by a possible Grinch, perhaps because the Grinch considers them too unclean to eat, even though it apparently will kill swine for sport.

How the Grinch transferred its prey model from sheep to humans I'll leave as an exercise for the reader. ;)

If such an intelligent form of predatory slime mold existed, it would require an entirely new classification to describe it.

I would call the newly discovered mold Naturalus B. Killium, to descibe both it's natural (not man-made) orgin, as well as its predatory nature.

+++++++++++++++

Hope you like the above story. I had a horrible nightmare that had me waking up shaking and panting about the above kind of "Grinch", in just the kind of scenario I described, so I thought I'd share it with you. :)

Naturally, being a dream, I lived a whole night with the Grinch as it was picking off my dream family, until I was the only one left, at which point it pounced and started slithering down my throat! :eek: This is the point I woke up gasping. Turns out I had a pillow over my face (I live alone :p), which would explain the gasping part.

Imagine the Grinch as the shape-shifting creature from the movie "The Thing", your home as the antarctic base, and you've got an idea of what I was dreaming about.

I could make one hell of a "Tales from the Crypt" episode out of it, let me tell you, but I think someone would likely sue me if I did. ;)

Notice all the little references I made to "wolf in sheeps clothing", "hiding in plain sight", sheep and pigs, etc. Layers upon layers...

Jacks Complete
January 4th, 2004, 10:15 AM
Brilliant.

And a happy New Year!

xyz
January 4th, 2004, 10:23 AM
NBK, one little question...

How exactly would it fit the flesh of, say, 5 victims into the skin of a single victim? i.e. it eats/kills/absorbs/whatever 5 members of the family and hides their skin and bones, how does it fit into the 6th skin if it contains the volume of 5 people?

Anthony
January 4th, 2004, 01:10 PM
T'would make a good christmas film... Next year maybe?

Hang-Man
January 4th, 2004, 07:45 PM
" The Grinch who stole christmas (And the flesh of the living)" Rated R

Zykaz
January 4th, 2004, 10:21 PM
That would definitely be strange. Imagine that mold devouring your mother on the way home on Christmas Eve, your father is driving the rest of the way home while you try to hold a conversation with your mother, but she can't talk because you are actually talking to the skin of your mother held together by mold. And then later on your left alone with your mother, and the mold seeps out of your mother's poors, and then goes inside your mouth, ears, nose, etc, any way it can get in, and eats your insides while you stand there and look at the skin of your mother on the ground.

Creepy...

If the mold opened its victim's mouth to laugh, when it was mimicing the person, then wouldn't there just be an empty space, or just the mold? Or it could possibly leave the tongue, teeth, and throat intact. But then when the Grinch laughed, the sound would kind of echo up the throat.

Al Koholic
January 4th, 2004, 11:02 PM
With regards to the question by xyz...

I have to imagine that the only way this would be possible would be if the Grinch was able to extract chemical energy from protien, fat, and carbohydrate very rapidly and efficiently. Most of a victim could for example, be reduced to CO2, O2, N2, and H2O and the resulting energy could be used by the Grinches cellular organization to convert a previously partially depleted energy reserv back into an active form. This would be like ATP in "normal" life. All the matter the Grinch really ever would need would already be there and it would just need to be reorganized into more energetic forms every so often. If this process occured rapidly enough, it would mean the Grinch could remain basically the same size.

Additionally, the Grinch, finding an odd-sized victim, could probably decide to consume only part of it if it wasn't large enough at the time to fit. Assuming the Grinch came upon someone too small, perhaps, like a fungus, it could sustain the loss of a portion of its mass however, I doubt this would be profitable for the Grinch and it would be interesting to see if there are reports of a minimum victim size.

I'm just going to guess that the "husks" the Grinch leaves behind aren't as was implied (very clean bags) and are actually filled with considerable "leftovers". Clearly the Grinch does not attack eyes, tongue, repiratory system, etc, etc, otherwise it would be noticed by the other members of the group. Perhaps aunt sally isnt talking sure, but why is her tongue missing and how can she laugh without lungs etc. This brings up another more important point. The Grinch may infact, not immedeatly consume much of it's victim at all. I am now proposing that the Grinch might actually be some form of lesser organized yet still intelligent slime. Upon attacking a host/victim, it would simply enter the body, inhabit some of the spaces in the body and use the body's existing mechanics for locomotion, respiration, heat, moisture, etc. This would imply that the Grinch somehow has the ability to enter and control in an organized fashion, the hosts brain and to some extent, lower cognitive/perceptive capabilities. If this is a slime, it will definetly need the hosts ears to hear and the hosts auditory nerve/brain structures to know when to laugh etc.

All this however, flies in the face of the Grinch actually even having hair at all. I suspect that a possible explanation may sit nicely with the theory I have eleborated on. It is possible that because the Grinch commonly preys on sheep that this is the "shell" it is wearing most frequently when it is seen.

Using a sheep as a means of getting to and fro has benefits for the Grinch. Firstly, it can travel day or night. Secondly, it will go unnoticed and if it were seen, it would likely be picked up and corraled with other sheep...more food. This way, it wouldn't even have to hunt and to some extent, has entered a symbiotic, commensalist relationship with humans that is facilitating its predation of sheep.

Finally, I also theorize that the Grinch, while having the capability to oxidize food verry rapidly, can also let its current host "last a while". By this I mean that the Grinch can either conduct a high speed burn off of its host or can inhabit it for quite some time while either slowly eating it, or just lingering for a while in wait of another. Using the body of another for protection is highly advantageous as the internal environment of a warm-blooded animal is perfect for a fungus. Perhaps sheep are inhabited for a very long time on an occasional basis and the Grinch, traveling all around in the sheep, causes the sheep to get very dirty, not groom itself, wander where sheep shouldn't (caves, swamps, etc) and over this course, the sheep could in fact begin to look green. This degraded sheep would be such a far cry from the way sheep normally look that it would be easy to mistake it for another creature, specifically a green grinch at dusk/night.

This is all making way too much sense for my benefit.

IDTB
January 5th, 2004, 12:36 AM
Originally posted by nbk2000
It's a curious fact that there's almost as many pigs as sheep being raised there, yet there's no reports of consumtion of the pig flesh by a possible Grinch, perhaps because the Grinch considers them too unclean to eat, even though it apparently will kill swine for sport.
Could he possibly be more jewish? ;)

vulture
January 5th, 2004, 11:37 AM
Oh please IDTB, let's not turn this into yet ANOTHER religion/ethnic thread. :mad:

IDTB
January 5th, 2004, 10:57 PM
It was a light-hearted joke, chill out. I'm unaware of any religion/ethnic threads. Perhaps the title turned me off to reading into it, but I'll assure you; I didn't mean anything of it. If you find it necessary the post and the posts relating to my post may very well be deleted.

Jacks Complete
January 6th, 2004, 02:47 PM
I thought Vulture was joking!

Assuming point, though.

nbk2000
January 7th, 2004, 10:58 AM
If we wanted to get X-Files about this, I'd say that the Grinch would rapidly consume the flesh of the victim, converting the tissue into more of itself, and leaving behind all the excess mass as a puddle of digested slop.

When it transferred into a new victim, the Grinch could leave the majority of its newly aquired mass behind inside the "bag o' skin" that was it's prior abode, and transfer only its core (spore) self into the new victim.

In fact, the Grinch could actually be quite small, as it would be more like an infection, in being self-replicating, transforming the mass of it's host into more of itself and, when needed (no more flesh to feed on), excreting a "spore" that can survive exposure outside of a host body and that has limited mobility.

As for sensorium, it wouldn't need to hijack the hosts sensory organs, which would likely be impossible for such a rudimentary life form to assimilate the information supplied by such evolved senors as human eyes, as very simple senses could by used to aquire more prey. Movement, light/dark contrast, vibrations, smell, etc, are all quite rudimentary in insect and even fungal life forms, and would be more than adequate to the task.

The spore could lay semi-dormant inside of a host, using a kind of mind control through the secretion of narcotic or endorphin analogs into its host to keep it in a dazed state of euphoria. This would account for the common state around christmas of unnaturally cheerful behavior. Also, by narcotizing the host, the pain that would otherwise be causing it to contort into a death rictus as its innards were being consumed, is negated.

The host body would continue to run on automatic pilot, as it were, as the higher brain functions died off from the lack of nutrients/oxygen as the Grinch used it all for it's own survival. Only the most primitive parts of the brain, that concerned with maintaining respiration and heartbeat, would survive the reduction of bodily support, much as how brain-dead coma victims can still breath on their own, so too would Grinch victims still be "alive" even if they are brain-dead.

Al Koholic, your theory of sheep being a reservoir for the Grinch parasite would be well in keeping with the reports.

The finding of rotted sheep carcasses in swampy areas would naturally be assumed to be from the natural decomposition of a sheep that wandered off, got stuck in the mire, and died. The reality may be that the sheep was already dead, and decomposing, when the Grinch finally took off its sheep coat, having found a suitable enviroment in which to exist without a host animal.

It may also be that the Grinch has tranferred its prey model to humans in more recent times, not due to bestiality committed by lonely sheep herders, but due to the extermination of its usual host because of recent hoof and mouth disease purges in western european countries.

With the mass extermination of sheep, there'd be no sheep for the Grinch to survive in, with the only mammals big enough to host it in rural areas being humans.

The existance of a Grinch parasite would also explain the outbreaks of human "Living Dead" that have occasionally been reported.

Cemetarys are perfect enviroments for fungus to survive in, being moist and dark, and constantly warm in certain parts of the world, or if it's in a sun-heated crypt.

The Grinch would remain dormant in such places until such time as a fresh body comes in contact with it, having been placed in a crypt or shallow grave. Given how most bodies are not embalmed in third-world countries and in poorer regions of western nations, it would provide a source of food for the sporant form of the Grinch, allowing it to become active again.

The now active form of Grinch would then likely seek to reproduce itself, having been dormant for so long, and so would use it's host body to mobilitate itself about looking for fresh prey.

Because the body was already dead when the Grinch took it over, the neurological
connections of the brain and nervous system would have been degraded, which means that the Grinch would need a source of new neurotransmitter chemicals in order to properly control the host body.

This fits in perfectly with the reported behaviour of the "Living Dead": Staggering, uncoordinated movement, rigidity of the arms and legs, and (most tellingly) eating of brain tissue in their victims (to aquire neurotransmitters).

There are conflicting reports as to whether those who are bitten, in turn, die and become "Living Dead", or whether the freshly killed and brain-eaten remain dead. Either one could be true, depending on the state of the Grinch's reproduction cycle at the time of the victims death.

The existance of the Grinch could, in fact, be a key to explaining much of the phenomena that is currently unexplainable by science and called "quack science", while having entirely natural and explainable origins in a naturally occuring mold/fungus.

IDTB, it may be that the Grinch was orginally of middle-eastern orgin, as sheep were not a naturally occuring animal in the wales/scotland region, having been imported by the Romans during their occupation of the british isles. So it is entirely possible that the Grinch originated from the area of palestine, where even the bible makes many references to the existance of sheep. Oi! :p

Efraim_barkbit
January 7th, 2004, 07:12 PM
The documentary movie "resident evil", wich has been released in a slightly edited version, is telling the story of an incident in a secret research facility a couple of years ago, where the US governement breeds grinches, as a part of a new type of biological weapon.
The behaviour of large number of grinches can be observed, and the symptoms mentioned by nbk, wich the host animals, in this case humans, experience is clearly seen, such as "Staggering, uncoordinated movement", basicly appearing as "living dead".
unfortunately, they have not managed to videotape the host changing procedure, and the scientists who where involved in those particular experiments tragically did not survive the "incident", wich led to the making of the documentary.
in fact, nobody did.
thats yet another very good example of the supreme predatory skills possessed by the grinch.

As documented in said film, When an animal(human) is bitten by a grinch infected host, it continues to function normally for a period of time, before it to starts shoving symptomes.
By this, one can assume that the grinches keep a "supply" of fertile eggs, or spores, wich when entering a fresh host, hatches, and due to well evolved instincts, it makes its way to the hosts brain, where it takes controll. after infection, but before the juvenile grinch has taken full controll, the victim can experience spasmic movement of limbs, as well as severe headaches. at this stage, it is almost certainly beyond rescue.

It is very hard to kill a grinch, and I do not think that there is an effective method for it, however, some strong cytotoxins is reported to at least be able to disable its ability to effectively transfer into a new host.
It can also be used as a "antidote" when a person has been bitten, but it has to be injected into the blood stream before the juvenile grinch has reached the brain, most likely within 1-3 hours after the bite.
The most used, and reliable way to stop a grinchcontrolled host is by severe brain trauma, wich is most safely achieved with a well placed gunshot.


EDIT: made a clarification. (read more in my next post in this thread)

chemwarrior
January 7th, 2004, 07:56 PM
Ive never heard of Reisdent Evil being a documentary of anything.....

Who knows? Maybe its yet another cover up story...

*Cue X-Files music*

xyz
January 8th, 2004, 12:02 AM
Resident evil had nothing to do with grinches...

It was based on a videogame series of the same name and it is a mutagenic virus that causes the "zombies", not grinches...

They were supposedly working on the virus to bring people back from the dead but it was accidentally released inside the facility before they had all the kinks worked out.

Efraim_barkbit
January 8th, 2004, 07:13 AM
Thats what you think xyz, but no, the actual incident involved grinches, but, because the US governement didnīt want to cause panic, and be forced to admitt the existence of their secret bioweapons program, they made the movie company to edit it, and they halted itīs release a couple of years.
The version released was the edited version, and that is probably the version the majority of you have seen.

The reason the movie was released at all is to undermine the credability of eventuall future facts about the incident that might get picked up by movie makers over the years, as well as the credibility of eventuall witnesses.

Because one of the makers of the documentary kept a copy of the original, He was able to upload it on to a private server, before he "disappeared", together with the rest of the film team. It is possible to get it, if you have the right connections. otherwise, I would say it is almost impossible to get the complete film, however, pieces of it is awailible with a little bit of hard searching.

Dureing the delay of the release of the documentary, The US governement had time to hire a company to make a video game, with the same theme as the upcoming documentary, to undermine itīs credibility even more. People would just pass it on as yet another "zombie movie", and the "real" movie, if it ever got out, would be looked upon with sceptisism.

McGyver
January 8th, 2004, 07:55 PM
This story is reminiscent to Stephen King's "Dreamcatcher"

festergrump
December 16th, 2004, 08:51 PM
The real Grinch NBK spoke of sounds somewhat close some description in a book I read about a "Djinn" (also "djinni" or "djini") in Germany. It was so long ago I can not for the life of me remember the title of the book or most of the plot. I remember some similar features and habits, though. It was rather creepy... as is NBK's depiction of the grinch in his dreams.

Anyway, it's that time of year again so I thought I'd bring this back to surface.

Festergrinch says: Read the original post in this thread to your kids before they go to bed on Christmas eve! They won't be too sure about waking you and the misses up at 4:30 AM to see what Santa brought them. More than likely you'll have to pry them from bed to show them it's ok to go downstairs and that Santa's body won't be a pile of skin and bones beneath their stockings...with you being silent and merely smiling. :D

Ropik
December 17th, 2004, 01:39 PM
Efraim_barkbit, have you seen the non-edited video or do you know where to find it? I would like to see this...