Leaving all my loves behind

[keith]

I'm going into the Marines in two years and will be leaving all my cannons, mortars, rifles,projects, friends, (my life as I know it) behind. Well not actually behind I'll need to sell it all.
While working on explosives or weapons I never stop to think that it will soon end. It seems no fun anymore. Now when I get a great idea of something to build I just think to myself whats the point. In two years EVERYTHING in my life will change. I'm leaven everything I love behind, but for something more grand.
Anyone else going to be unable to do the things they most love because of moving or job needs or old age, etc.? What will you do with all the stuff youve made?
I'm not looking for therapy I'm just curious.

[megalomania]

I hope you will still impart to us all the knowledge you will gain. Strategy and tactics, small arms skills, and other military gems still have a place here :)

[keith]

There will still be computer access to me(unless I'm sent to Africa like my cousin Josh was):( If any requests for military suplies were to be made once I'm in the Marines the tooth fairy might mail you it. Find an M16 w/ m203 under your pillow.

[vulture]

once I'm in the Marines the tooth fairy might mail you it. Find an M16 w/ m203 under your pillow.


No thank you.

The tooth fairy might be nice and good, but the sting that's attached to it....

Do you honestly believe you could get away with that??

[PHAID]

I seriously doubt he could.
When i was in the military and any of the weapons, NVD or radio equipment came up missing the entire unit went under lockdown until it was found.
If you were the one who "lost" the item the 100+ pissed off soldiers who want to go party will defenatly convince you to find it.
We had one try the missing M-16 and after the month long lockdown he and his uncle both got 15 years each.


Your best bet is to get in good with your unit armorer/supply seargent.
They can hook you up.

[keith]

Well hearing that....never mind. But I could buy certain things at cheaper prices than civilians. If .50BMG are outlawed I could still get em by the 1000's.

Phaid, 30 day lockdown? How long were you in? Army, Marines, what? What was your job?

[PHAID]

I was in the Army, 82nd Airborne division for 4 years.
I was infantry, that was many years ago though i got out in the late 80's

[keith]

Kool. Ever get sent over seas? I probly will as soon as I'm a basic marine. Alota people I know are being sent. I dont mind at all though.

[vulture]

When I was younger, I ounce thought of getting into the army too.

The problem is, it may all look fun in the beginning, but no training can match the stress and fear of a real battlefield when bullets roar above your head and cut your mates apart.

[Rhadon]

vulture, I'm really surprised to hear that you considered joining the army! For me this has never come into question, for the fact alone that I would have to risk my life or destroy the life of other poeple for what from some nitwit's point of view should be done. It's awful enough to see what happens in the world regarding politics / war and supporting that would be the least thing I wanted to pay for with my life. But don't regard this as an insult, I was just astonished...

[vulture]

Rhadon, this was when I was younger, long before 9/11. I went to a rather bad period in my life and I saw no good alternatives for the future then.
Also, my grandfather once let me fire his airrifle when I was about 12 years old and he thought I had some talent...

That's also the main problem I have with the US army. Most people sign up because they have no future in front of them or the army is an employer of the last resort for them.
The government gets rid of a social problem this way, because those soldiers get a job and will likely die in battle, effectively silencing a part of the desperate.


//this might not make sense because I had a bit too much of some fine italian Velio...

[PHAID]

Yes i have been to several countries.
No i didnt fight in any battles.
I was in europe when the panama hastle started, Which was funny because we had just finished our jungle warfare training there a couple months befor.

[keith]

War and death do not scare me at all.
The only thing that matters in life is an honorable death. I sincerely believe that.
And no man that will not fight and die for his country can give sound reason why he and his family whould be allowed to live freely in that country Rhadon.

[PHAID]

There is nothing wrong with someone making the choice not to serve.
Personaly i think our politicians are morons and 90% of our wars are for their personal agenda and not the country.
Its better to keep your population focused on supposed forign "evil doers" than to have the look and see who is really screwing things up at home.
I chose military because i wanted the training and experiance.
I do have an issue with anti-war protesters who dont have the balls to even find out what they are protesting and that they blame the soldiers for doing their job.
The majority of the people crying are usualy the ones who voted in the fool who started the war.

[Rhadon]

And no man that will not fight and die for his country can give sound reason why he and his family whould be allowed to live freely in that country Rhadon.Well, that sounds like the argument from the text book, it was a little misplaced though: I never dissociated myself from defending, but only when my own judgement is behind it.

[Dave Angel]

I agree with PHAID and Rhadon on this one. It's one thing to take up arms (improvised or not) against an invading force, but to attack a country incapable of touching your own, using falsified evidence of "weapons of mass distraction [sic] err destruction" as a reason is out of order. I would never die for such a cause.

[keith]

Why is your own judgement not behind it? Is Germany not a great country?

[Rhadon]

A country and its government can be two different things.

[keith]

Country means its land, the people within, and its government. Take away any one of these and the counrty can not function.
The only country I could have loved with all my heart and died for without a second thought is Nazi Germany. Not for mass murder of Jews or other people Himmler was ordered to kill but because of their military might, victorious tactics, the leadership and control by fear and power of Adolf Hitler, and the system of government they had. By the end of the war Hitler was spending 4 times as much money on gasing the Jews as he was on his military.....pitty

With that country no longer existing, the best country in the world would probably have to be the US(or Sweden)

[Cyclonite]

Im in the Army, only 9 months left out of 4, in getting out. Its not that bad, but I would advise you to seriously consider your options. Iv been in Iraq and Kuwait for the past 11 months and its not fun. I did get to see lots of stuff since iv been here like a couple bodies a shit load of UXOs and Iraqi ordanance. Iv been shot at, its not fun but payback is. The pay on deployments is pretty good, you save alot of cash. If you really like all the disipline poor living conditions and like marching go Marines but I would advise the Airforce, they treat thier people alot better and you get better pay from going TDY most of the time. In the Army you deal with alot of bullshit but its not to bad and you get promotions faster. Best of luck, Oh if you like what you do now go EOD its offered in all the branches. You would need the scores to get in though.

[Guerilla]

With that country no longer existing, the best country in the world would probably have to be the US(or Sweden) Well good for you.. you probably have visited every country of the world and got to known their cultures, in order to end up with that conclusion? :rolleyes:
War and death do not scare me at all.
The only thing that matters in life is an honorable ...
Hell you must be a very tough guy.. as even none of the veterans I have spoken with or read about have boasted like this. And they if who would have the right to it. Im truly thankful to these men who fought suffered and sacrificed their health in the wars and the efforts they gave in rebuilding the country back to its feet. They did not want a war, but when the enemy was knocking on the border and the diplomatics had no more to say, there were no choice but to grab the guns and confront the invader. This is why I will carry out armed service - in case of an ultimate threat, which doesnt include the war on terror or other "precautions defending"...

[vulture]

Soldiers in a war don't WANT to shoot at eachother, they HAVE to.
It's the warchickens in the office that scream "Kill them! Kill them! Or they'll kill you and your family" that makes a soldier kill. Very few soldiers will actually enjoy killing, atleast not when they see their victims up close.

A nice example of this is that on the 24th of December, 1915, allied and german soldiers left their entrenchments to celebrate christmas together. They were sharing drinks, food and smokes untill the officers ordered them to get back or be shot because of desertion.

[Rhadon]

Keith, I wouldn't like to live in Nazi Germany, really not. But I think that I see what your motives are and can understand that you also like the US (government / army). And I've got to agree with the others here that it might be a rude awakening for you when you recognize what you've actually gotten into. Did you already sign?

[Jacks Complete]

keith,

you are young. Young people rarely see the world without a strong set of filters that tend to distort.

Have you ever really thought about the effects of killing someone? On the family you tear apart, the lives you destroy?

Have you ever seen the video to "One" by Metallica, or read the book? What if you don't die, but the amazing skill of the Army surgeons keeps you alive, in a vegetative state for the next 55 years? Living in constant pain because you took a bullet for some idiot in your platoon? Dying inside, each time you see other vet's get abused by those who never went?

A long time ago, I felt like you. It almost seems like another life. I thought about the life of the soldier, not thinking or feeling, just doing, and abdicating my responsibility to the human race, and to my self. I went through some heavy shit at school, for four years. I couldn't take the long view, and I couldn't defend myself, and, eventually, it got to me. Fortunately, as I entered the last two years, the older gangs left, so I could deal with anyone left, and things got better. I realised that the last thing I wanted to do was die for someone with half my IQ. I am glad I realised that.

Anyway, this wasn't meant to be a sermon, or anything. Just think about it hard.

[keith]

I do feel. I have loving people in my life and I am treated very kindly. I have thought about the feeling of killing someone and I'd do it right now given permission. There is a crack dealer down the street I'd like to put a bullet through with my M40A1 rechambered in .280 Ackely. I have been hunting and shooting my entire life. I can hit a human silhouet at 1000 yards and a pie plate at 750. Furthest animal killed was 625 yards away. The first coyote I shot didnt die. I had but one round left for my rifle so instead of shooting him again and wasting the bullet I put a branch over his neck and stood on it, you figure out the rest. Death neither scares me nor delights me. It's a numb feeling, no feeling. Killing a man is no different than killing a deer, a coyote, a fox, or an elk. I'm not cold hearted. The kids that go around hurting inocent cats and puppies I'd like to fucking tear apart limb by limb, sew them up so as to not let them bleed to death, the kill them by their own insanity by cuting off their eyelids and shouving a glass stir rod up their dick and breaking it with a hammer! I'm a loving person, not like those kinda people. If I take a bullet for some fool, some sheep in my platoon than I will accept the wound or death as it comes. Sheep dogs eventually all die for the sheep sometime, most of the time defending them from a pack of wolves.
If my death is honorable by my defenition then it is a good death, which is far more valuble than a good life. If you cant understand what I'm saying I'm sorry.
It's been my goal since I was about 9yo to be a military sniper. Throught out research Ive decided to join the Marines, go through training, eventually into recon, then force recon, and hopefully after collage I go to a sniper school in Virginia and pass with high scores. I know I have it in me and would honestly rather die while in training rather than fail and drop out. The day I get to hold that Marine Scout/Sniper patch in my hands and mail a spare one home to my father....Almost brings tears to me now. You have no idea of my devotion, my courage, of me.

[tom haggen]

Keith, sounds like you'll do quite well in the marines. Careful though, you don't want to get too brainwashed. I'm related to many marines and they say that School of Infantry is the best part of training. My grandfather parachuted on d-day so I kind of think about joining sometimes. The military just doesn't seem to be as good as it was in the old days. Once I get a degree i'm probably much more likely to join the service.

[SpiffyVision]

Let us know how it goes Keith, I'd be interested.

[keith]

Your grandfather must be a great man. I have thought about getting a degree before joining, it would definetly benefit. To be a sniper you MUST be under a certain age when sniper training begins. I have thought of my options and with the huge possibility of being sent to another country and delaying me for a year or two I do not have the time. I'll get my degree while in Recon though. Recon will be fun and will teach me much of what I will need to be a sniper. I have a rifle competition this summer. It's called Rifles Only. Snipers paradise sponsors it. Many ex-snipers and current military sniper attend this comp so I guess I'll see where I stand. My father will be my Spotter/Secondary Sniper. He has always been better than me and way better than all of his shooting friends who all participate im comps but I am now far surpassing them in ability, athletisism, and even in wisdom. It has really sunk in and has been my life for my entire life. The only thing hindering me is my grades. I'm in the 10th grade and for the past 5 years gotten nothing but C's D's and a few A's. My GPA is some where around 2.0. However this quarter and hopefully for the rest of my educational days I will be getting A's and B's. Im really stepping up to the plate and swinging for the score board now. I wish I had just realized this a few years ago. Although grades help for rank, knowing Romeo and Juliet or what the names of cells parts are will not help me to put a bullet through a mans heart while noticing his wedding ring on. My life outside of school has prepared me for that.
For some reason be it luck, skill, or a delightful mixture of both I have always seemed to beat the odds and excel when needed most. When the pressures on I'm the one to count on. This will show in the military both in training and in combat. My cousin was class leader of his platoon in basic training, he's a leader you can see it in him and leaders are destined to lead.

Does anyone know how much grades matter in the military? My cousin got C's throughout high school and is moving rank faster than anyone else around him. He got a chance to tryout for Recon but denied it as he didnt want to leave his friends and platoon behind.

[Cyclonite]

Grades dont mean shit, when I look aroujnd me its seems like the people that kiss ass get rank faster.....I hate it.. But oh well

[keith]

You are in the Marines? What is your rank? Tell me anything you know about Recon, sniper school, anything please.
Well I'm going to keep tryin like hell to get good grades anyways. I'm pretty good at kissin ass so thats good:)
Are the tests in the Marines hard? What are they on?

[Cyclonite]

I wouldnt kiss ass and keep your self respect. Im in the army....I dont have any first hand info on force recon. Most marines are known as jar heads. They follow orders and dont tend to think out of the box....Tests in the marines are easy, same with army...Iv seen some of the most brain-dead people in my life in the military. Sniper school in the army is mostly mental, staying in the same spot for extended periods of time. rolling over to take and shit and rolling right back where you were. I love shooting and explosives but on my own terms and my own targets, its not as fun when you have to live in some of the scummiest places in the world for months and months eating MREs and worse food.

[nuclearattack]

i'm agree with rhadon and dave angel, i can fight for my family and defend my country but i will never fight for politics, commercial and other motivations. I respect others point of view but i do not agree with what is happening in the world in this days (see iraq war, afghanistan and the past vietnam), it is only a war to control resources of others nations. Democracy doesn't exist for real, it is only a false motivation to control and rule the world.

[keith]

Nuclear attack. Trust me, the USA does not want to control the world! But when we do, Ill see to it that Italy is fucked:) You talk about not wanting to control the world...know who Hitlers allies were? Japan, ITALY, and Sweden. Whethere your country agreed with what he was doing OR was too pussy to fight, you allied him.
The world is only jealous of our freedom, money, and our galliant soldiers.

Well I covertly kiss ass:) and my shit smells good so itll be like a lit candle to me and my spotter:) Ive layed in below freezing weather for an entire day on the day before opening day watching the same fucking deer or the same fucking tree where he is at 600 yards and while watching im setting up my shooting cam and concealment and yes rolling over 3 feet to shit and then back again. After the day is spent and its getting dark the buck will bed down, I will watch him until I see his eyes shut and his breathing slow knowing he's asleep. I will silently go back to camp, get 4 hours of sleep at most before trecking back(nd since its now opening day and I can legaly kill him) I stalk up to my same rest in pitch black hours before first light and wait again. Meanwhile hes been sleeping behind the same god damned bush or pretty close to it. When it is light enough too see across the canyon(600 yards) I find him somehwere on the slope(he moved during the night about 200 yards down the ridge but to my advantage, he is now about 475 yards away. I watch his patterns, wait for the perfect shot, I have it, I squeeze...................BOOM......CRACK! HE goes rolling. YAY! now I have a 100lbs of meat to bring back to the truck:((which is about 3 hours away)
That was last years hunt, all for a dinky lil 2 point. He taste good though. Im in the Arizona record book for a buck I killed when I was only 12. My father is in the world record book(Boone and Crocket) twice for two bucks.

[Guerilla]

know who Hitlers allies were? Japan, ITALY, and Sweden.
dont teach history to others if you arent familiar with it yourself.. :rolleyes:

[Sarevok]

Guerilla, you're obviously jealous of his country's freedom, money, and galliant soldiers!

keith, its your life you're playing with. You should listen to Cyclonite and "serioulsy consider your options". I'm just saying this to appear polite, because I'm sure you aren't going to think about it anyways.

[vulture]

Jealous of your freedom?

I know I could walk out to the street and shout: BUSH IS A GODDAMN FUCKING MORON, SOMEBODY KILL THE HYPOCRITIC BASTARD! without having the feds knocking on my door half an hour later.

It's not because you make a giant fuzz about freedom, that you've actually got it, quite the contrary.

Jealous of it's money?

Let's see, didn't bush turn a healthy government budget into a negative figure of almost 400 million (or billion?) dollars?

Then why did Bush have to put import tax on European steel? Answer: Because the US steel industry is old and crippled, because they never had to modernize because of more strict regulations.

How bout the US power grid? Do I even need to go on?

Americans are right if they say they're living the American dream.

That's all it is. A dream.

Oh, and a newsflash for you: Deer don't shoot back. An enemy sniper would have had your brains sticking to a tree in about 5 minutes.

[Sarevok]

Brazilian steel was taxed too.

Talking about money, on 2003 the USA had a debt of U$ 6,7 trillions (today this debt is around 7 trillions), paying U$ 70 billions of annual interest (9,5%); Brazil, on the other hand, had a debt of U$ 285 billions, paying U$ 50 billions of annual interest (17,5%). Its easy to be rich that way...

[keith]

You look at the few problems wrong with my country and not the huge list of things that are great about it. I don't mean to sound like a war-hungry looser that knows nothing about politics or economics right now so forgive me but....WE'D KICK THE SHIT OUT OF BELGIUM! There, now if the US is soo bad then I guess Belgium is a shit hole right? You only hear about things that YOUR news wants you to hear about. Are you an expert in foreign politics? Have you talked to saddam about the money he gives to terroists? Have you gone to Iraq and seen the terrorists there killing the Jews and there own people for fuck sakes? Would you have the same ignorant opinion if terrorists parked a fucking car bomb with 800lbs of ANNM that Saddam payed for in front of your mothers house? Maybe your just a coward......or you arent willing to defend what you love from anyone....or, maybe you love nothing enough to fight for it.

Please, don't tell me about me going off to another country and dieing because I don't care. You think I havent given it thought? I cant go to sleep without thinking about it, I cant eat diner without thinking about it. Trust me, I have thought about it long and hard and will always think about it. I love life and will miss it when its gone but what good is life if you don't follow your dreams? If my dreams of being a Marine Sniper lands me on a battle feild then.......atleast I tried and gave my life for something great.

[vulture]

I don't mean to sound like a war-hungry looser that knows nothing about politics or economics right now so forgive me but....WE'D KICK THE SHIT OUT OF BELGIUM!

I have no doubt the US army would kick the shit out of the Belgian army. So who cares?

There, now if the US is soo bad then I guess Belgium is a shit hole right?

I'm not really following your reasoning, but I guess you're trying to say that because your army would kick the shit out of our army Belgium is a bad place to live?

Not really. In fact, we have better social security and higher average pays. Also, we don't have as many violent murders a month as you guys do. About 10% IIRC.

Also, we don't have to shit ourselves about WMDs, carbombs and other shit, because we don't rampage through the world and say FUCK YOU to everyone who gets in our way.

Are you an expert in foreign politics? Have you talked to saddam about the money he gives to terroists? Have you gone to Iraq and seen the terrorists there killing the Jews and there own people for fuck sakes?

Have you seen it? Have you been to Iraq, where US soldiers are killing more Iraqis per month than Saddam did? Have you been to Isreal, which is killing innocent Palestinian children with US military material?

Maybe your just a coward

You know, you just sound like Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld, who were accusing Powell of cowardice when he wasn't in favor of the war. Guess who saw a battlefield? Right, Powell.
Who went AWOL? Right, Bush. Nuff Said.

If it is your dream to become a sniper, than by all means, go for it. I'm just warning you that not everything is as shiny on the inside as it is on the outside.

Since when is being afraid of dying something to be ashamed of? It's a natural hardwired reflex to try and prevent your death by evading dangerous situations.

So, since you're not afraid to die, I guess you will be going to battle without flat jacket and helmet?

[keith]

No, Ill have my helmet and flak(not flat) jacket on if the situation calls for it. Meanwhile, youll be hiding under your bed.
Being affraid to die isnt natural when all that you stand for is at risk of being taken away! So I sound like the leaders of the greatest country I the world, you sound like some pot head anti-war protester. Have I seen Iraq? Am I a econamical expert? No, so I listen to those who have and are instead of basing my opinion on nothing but the one-sided news. So we police the world, is there no police in your country? Yea I'd bet sometimes they piss you off but you damn sure know you couldnt live without em!
Maybe we shouldnt have entered WWll. You would have had it that way huh. Let Hitler gas you and burn your children. If we abused the small countries as we saw fit and hid from the bigger wars where we will undoubtably lose many soldiers then I'd agree we are bullies, but that's not the case. We are the ones who stop rogue countries from raping other smaller countries(Vietnam,Korea) We had huge casualties! Our sons, brothers, and Fathers died for none Americans on foreign soil , do you know why, because it was the right thing to do, something your country would never do!

[keith]

You look at the few problems wrong with my country and not the huge list of things that are great about it. I don't mean to sound like a war-hungry looser that knows nothing about politics or economics right now so forgive me but....WE'D KICK THE SHIT OUT OF BELGIUM! There, now if the US is soo bad then I guess Belgium is a shit hole right? You only hear about things that YOUR news wants you to hear about. Are you an expert in foreign politics? Have you talked to saddam about the money he gives to terroists? Have you gone to Iraq and seen the terrorists there killing the Jews and there own people for fuck sakes? Would you have the same ignorant opinion if terrorists parked a fucking car bomb with 800lbs of ANNM that Saddam payed for in front of your mothers house? Maybe your just a coward......or you arent willing to defend what you love from anyone....or, maybe you love nothing enough to fight for it.

Please, Dont tell me about me going off to another country and dieing because I don't care. You think I havent given it thought? I cant go to sleep without thinking about it, I cant eat diner without thinking about it. Trust me, I have thought about it long and hard and will always think about it. I love life and will miss it when its gone but what good is life if you don't follow your dreams? If my dreams land me on a battle feild then.......atleast I tried and gave my life for something good.

[vulture]

So I sound like the leaders of the greatest country I the world, you sound like some pot head anti-war protester.

I have another newsflash for you: You're namecalling. Generally such tactics are not used by people who advocate the unbiased truth. It only weakens your arguments, because namecalling is the emergency break out of a discussion.

Being affraid to die isnt natural when all that you stand for is at risk of being taken away!

Since when am I at risk being taken away? Oooh, I forgot, we don't have a color coded terror chart over here! Geez, Belgium really sucks, doesn't it?

So we police the world, is there no police in your country?

Yes, we have police. Only, the police here arrests every criminal, not only the ones with toys that the police officers would like to have.

Maybe we shouldnt have entered WWll. You would have had it that way huh. Let Hitler gas you and burn your children.

There we go again. First of all, Hitler gassed jews. Not every European. Also, life generally continued in the occupied countries, because Hitlers army just rolled in and took us without very much resistance. That meant not much destruction and death.

Hitler didn't bomb our cities to dust and then expected us to welcome his soldiers as liberators. :rolleyes:

If we abused the small countries as we saw fit and hid from the bigger wars where we will undoubtably lose many soldiers then I'd agree we are bullies, but that's not the case.

Really? Then why aren't you attacking North Korea. They admitted they have launch capable WMDs. Your boys are still digging in the sand in Iraq whilst finding nothing but oil. They won't find oil if they go digging in North Korea though.

That leads me to another interesting point. Do you know who sold the nuclear reactors to North Korea in the first place? Rumsfelds company. Who's company was punished for doing bussiness with Iraq in 1998? Dick Cheney's. Who supplied Iraq with WMD precursors in the 80's?

[keith]

Well there were several things in that post as in the other one that was incorrect and I could comment on but instead Ill just say this....It takes all kinds to make the world go around, your kind, their kind, even my kind. We all balance everything out.
Say for a moment you are right about us. Maybe Bush only wants oil, maybe he'd rather we had the oil rather than a terror based nation. If we are big and powerful enough to take something from someone than fine. Really, fine. Is Belgium going to stop us? No I think not. Will other countries try to stop us? No probably not because it would be both our deaths. If you are affraid of us taking most of the oil in the world, then move here. By all means come on over. You can live in my guest room for a while if needed.
Im sick of arguing and that is not what this thread was created for. Please, dont post in it any more. Good day to you sir.

[Rhadon]

keith:
Im sick of arguing and that is not what this thread was created for. Please, dont post in it any more. You're the last one to tell people when they have to stop posting. You're here since October 2003 and think you can give orders to senior members?
Let Hitler gas you and burn your children.
I seriously considered banning you for that one. Posting in the Water Cooler doesn't save you from getting banned if you insult other members. Say something remotely that stupid and I'll make it true.

[keith]

Sorry I didnt mean to do that about him not being able to post but we werent getting anywhere, just arguing. I didnt tell him he couldnt, only asked him not too.
The thing about Hitler, well, it made sence in the actually post but when it's quoted like that it looks quite mean. Again sorry.
You will have no more trouble from me.

[Rhadon]

I really hope so.

[Flake2m]

Keith: SHUT THE FUCK UP you have already had enough input into this thread.
Maybe by joining the Marines learn some:
Discipline - open your mouth and they'll make you do 200 push-ups in the rain, answer back and you'll do another 200.
A purpose - your purpose is to do what your commanding officer tells you to do. You are to not think individually but to listen and obey to only the voice of your commanding officer.
Skills - You learn how to shoot, how to survive. How to kill. In the mean time, a profile is being built up of abilities and personal traits.

[keith]

Flake2m, I should hope I have enough into this thread...I started it. I didnt just open my mouth, I was defending the name of the great country I live in from a person that was putting it down. I said some things I shouldn't have and it will not happen again, sir. 400 push ups? You got it. No they dont want you to just be a mindles zombie unless your a grunt....Much of my family is in the military, I have a pretty good idea of how it works.
Well it was nice discussing much of the things I have with most of the people in this thread. Bye all and good day.

[EP]

I'm not going to get too far into this, but keith, I know you think you are a big, brave, tough guy, and want some action. You probably won't enjoy it once you have to kill somebody and have somebody try to kill you:

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3868907/

Hope it goes ok for you, but you need to open your eyes a bit.

[Anthony]

I have to agree with EP.

In a way, I admire your faith, the big, powerful thing you are part of. But realistically, you sound brainwashed. The old lie - dulce et decorum est pro patria mori. No ones' life is worth your own, not the scum stealing your car, no politician, no jumped up, clueless officer. Arguably, the only exception is sacrificing your life to allow a loved one to continue theirs. That person loves you back, they gave you a lot during your life, so in a way you've both earnt each others sacrifice. Your country will never love you like that. Look at all the war vets who get practically spat on every day.

You accuse vulture of not knowing what he's talking about, but how could you be any different? Is the media somehow more truthful in the US?

[vulture]

World War II's psychologists termed it battle fatigue, and Vietnam's shrinks coined the terms traumatic stress and posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Today, the preferred term is combat stress, and the military has an official policy for dealing with it—in the field, as close as possible to the fighting.


See keith, even the military thinks it's normal for soldiers to be afraid of dying and have fear.

A healthy dose of fear will have you survive longer than blind rampaging braveness.

At 58, he's also a Vietnam veteran himself, a rarity among troops in Iraq. "There's a lot of macho attitude here," he says. Among the Vietnam vets he sees back home, some "took 15 years to deal with their feelings about killing somebody," he says. "We have vets who for years said 'counseling is not for me' and then had to eat humble pie."

You do respect your vets, don't you?

EDIT: Keith, I'm not in favor for banning you and I can take alot of abuse in a discussion. Nevertheless, you should consider spending a little more time on your posts and thinking them over. Like I said before, namecalling only weakens your point.

I wish you good luck in your military career and may you return from battle safely.

You see, I think every dead soldier is one too many, even if they're fighting against me or against my cause.

[kingspaz]

keith, after skimming over this thread i'm quite disgusted that you are such a cunt. lets look at the big picture:
1. how many people who aren't american like america. not a great deal. obviously because you think its so great and most of the world doesn't think it is you HAVE to be right because millions of people are all wrong.
2. as has been stated, you sound like a typical brainwashed american. at the end of the day nobody gives a shit if you die. bush doesn't give a shit. everybody in america part from you family doesn't give a shit. your death would be meaningless and fruitless. i can see it now, keith recieves the order to charge out from behind the side of the APC whilst under enemy fire. adrenaline is pumping, hearts racing. he sprints out straight onto a landmine. BOOM! legs blasted off. now what? keith dies and is forgotten just like everybody who dies is. the sad part of the story isn't his death but the fact he died thinking it was a help. its not a help unless your country is under direct attack.
3. what makes your country so great? because you think it doesn't make it so.
4. you will die at someone elses hands under someone elses terms. if thats what you want go for it.

i advise you to try and think of the bigger picture and try a taste of reality instead of the dumbed down distorted view are used to being fed. if you're being FORCE fed its for a reason...

if you EVER insult somebody intentionally again then let a noose be placed around your neck you will hang immortalised in the BFL section.

[keith]

You can't even start your sentences with capital letters......
Ever live in America? How can you judge it or me? Thats your problem, you "skim".

It seems everyone here is mad at me so this will be my last post. If anyone cares, I'm the one that had been talking about the new cannon in the improvised weapons forum in the cannons, mortars, and howitzers thread. I tested the cannon today and it was everything I had hoped. I shot it six times at 4 feet, 50 yards, 100 yards, 200 yards, 300 yards, and 1500 yards. I only used 40 grams of pyrodex in this cannon. It would have easily withstood more than 100 grams of pyrodex with 50 grams of DBSP(AANo.7) but 40 grams is enough just to have some fun with. I also tested a brick charge of NG/NC 30g/40g. I had no dets so I taped it to a tree and shot it with a .22. It detonated first shot, made a big fireball and shook the ground alittle. It did little damage to the tree(big tree)

I Wont have much time to build weapons or HE's anymore. I need to concentrate on school, sports, shooting, the rest of my life. I live in the great state of AZ, if anyone lives here I'm going to be selling my cannons and stuff at the next gun show in Phoenix if you want a great deal on fuse, cannon peices(the small ones), and some gunsmithing tools.

Well heres where I get banned.
Bye and good day:)
Oh BTW, look for me in the Rifles Only competition in the summer of 05. I talked to the couple that owns the ranch in Texas and hosts the comp. There is no age groups or age requirements:)

Oh hey King-Spaz, stay away from the horazontal and the vertical;)

[Hang-Man]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and quote Mr. Cool.
Keith,
"You're a COCK! Go away!"

There's my two cents.

Edit- I saw you're origional post, which consisted of you're first sentence:
You can't even your sentences with capital letters......
You on the other hand, can't even form a coherent sentence

[irish]

That last post will get an interesting response when a Mod next has a look :D . At least the wanker has gone away now :rolleyes: .

Edit= I am referring to the last post by Keith not Hang-Man
;) .

[Cyclonite]

This thread should be locked.....

[Blackhawk]

I have been to New Zealand, Many places in Aus, the US, Britain, Dublin, China, Honk Kong and Singapore and I have to say out of all those places I would only ever live in Australia, and perhaps some parts of London. Quite simply I thought the US was ok but several things struck me:
-In LA the polloution was so thick I could barely see a kilometer, it was horrible, that and there was trash basically lining the freeways. Also a majority of vehicles on the freeways were huge petrol eating monsters that were only fucking the environment more. I was walking down some street in LA and looking at shops that I couldn't afford to enter, which was a pretty harsh contrast to the slums I past on the bus from the airport.
-While watching TV I noticed that there was NOTHING there that delt with international politics, I only ever saw domestic issues, most of which were total crap anyway. In fact I was lucky to see our Prime Minister on TV there, but only when he was talking about how much he supported the US like the spinless bootlick he is.
-In and around NY, expecially time square people just walk across the road, while the lights arn't even green, they just walk across whenever they feel like it as a pack, not hard to see why people don't want to see international news on TV when they don't want even to look where they are walking.
-I never saw ONE white person doing a menial job in NY or LA, I made sure to have a look at every McDonalds worker I saw in each of those two cities I went to and they were all Black. My friend and I made a game of spotting the first black person in a suit as we were driving past wall street, I lost when he spotted one, after about a half hour of driving.

I'm not saying that Australia is perfect, but I can't understand how Americans can be so patriotic when they clearly don't get much of a look at the world, have you ever been to Aus? and yet I can imagine that if I asked you if you would rather live in the US than Aus I know what you would say. I can understand love for ones country, but that is really meaningless unless you have good reason to love it. Travel a bit and see what you like before putting your heart behind something that you have been told your entire life to love simply because you have nothing else to judge it on.

[Rhadon]

That's the end of keith's short visit. I should have banned him at once when he fucked up for the first time but that's how he appreciates leniency. Hopefully he enjoyed it, because he won't get it in real life...

I'll leave the presentation of the rest of the banning ceremony to kingspaz :D.

[vulture]

Quite typical how people who strongly support Bush and the other neoconservative hawks always bail out of a discussion by namecalling and kicking around when they're being confronted by reasonable arguments...

I guess that's just coincedence though...:rolleyes:

[kingspaz]

well, lets hope he will one day get to give bush head. he so wants to. seriously though, wait, i was being serious, as i've already stated he WILL die and nobody will give a shit. the amusing part is he thinks they will :D

oh yer, i found a pic of keith after he tries to stop the great number of countries and 'terrorists' who are trying to take over the US.

http://www.suicidemethods.net/pix/roadkill.gif

[EP]

I know keith is gone now, but I'll post this anyway:

http://abcnews.go.com/wire/World/ap20040114_2047.html

More tough guy stuff...

[tmp]

Blackhawk, the next time you're in the U.S. look more at our countryside. Most large
U.S. cities are shitholes. That's why I avoid them. My great uncle visited Australia
many years ago and had nothing but disparaging remarks about it. I won't take his
word for it as I've never been there and my uncle usually bitched about everything
anyway. I want to see it for myself ! As for Keith, it's apparent that he's young and
inexperienced. I hope he doesn't learn about life the hard way. Keith needs to
understand that people have a right to their opinions and shouldn't be insulted for
expressing them. It's true that Vulture and I would probably disagree on just about
all political issues, particularly those concerning George Bush, but I respect his
opinion in any event.

[vulture]

It's true that Vulture and I would probably disagree on just about
all political issues, particularly those concerning George Bush, but I respect his
opinion in any event.


Goddamn! You completely flabbergasted me with that statement! I thought I'd never met a person who supported GWB who'd actually be capable of a intelligent discussion without namecalling.

You're a refreshing change. Thank you.

[Blackhawk]

tmp: Yes when I was there I was a bit dissapointed but I assumed that it was because I was only ever in big cities, I think the only way I would get a realistic look at what it would be like to LIVE there is if I stayed for a few weeks at a realatives house or similar. You should take a holiday down here some time :D I try not to pass judgements on places I haven't been too, so I tend to travel a lot.

[tmp]

Yes, I want to travel to other places in the world. In particular, I want to
visit the lands of my ancestors. For me that's France, Germany, Ireland,
Scotland, and Spain if I'm reading the family trees correctly. My travel
won't be limited to these places however. I've wanted to visit places like
Australia and New Zealand especially after seeing some of the beautiful
photography of these countries.

I live between Baltimore, Maryland and Washington D.C. - 2 of the biggest shitholes in the United States.

As for Keith, he really needs to grow up. Maybe the Marines will kick his
ass hard in boot camp and he'll learn some respect for other people.