Aconitine

[Yellow]

Aconitine is a plant poison that has been used for milleniums to poison people. It has some interesting properties, that makes it different from other plant poisons.
Aconitine is found in the roots of Aconitum Napellus, Aconitum Columbianum and Aconitum Feros. It is also present in the rest of the plant, in smaller amounts, so all of the plant should be considered toxic.
Despide the high toxicity of this plant, many companies that sell seeds, will have the seed for acunitum plants. I had no problems finding a supplier on the internet.
The plant will grow in most hot areas, such as the South of the USA.
The plant is most toxic when it starts flowering. It should harwestet at that time.
The roots should be placed in a dry area, until they can be powdered.
To get a crude form of crystal aconitine, the roots should be soaked in alcohol, diethyl ether or cloroform.
The filtered liquid should be allowed to evaporate. The end-product will be a
crude crystaline form of aconitine.
The lethal dosis of pure aconitine is 100 mg.

Aconitine has seen much use in poisoned arrows. The tip of the arrow is
coated with a sticky mixture of aconitine and honey. Even a hit in the hands
or legs by such projectiles will cause death.

Most plant-poisons will be destroyed by fire. But aconitine can be mixed
into an incendiary and evaporated. In the Middelages, an incendiary mixture of black powder and oil ( or honey ) was mixed with the powdered roots.
This mixture created a lethal smoke and was used in many form of devices. Catapults where used to throw clay canisters with this burning mixture into strongholds. Inhalation of the vaporized aconitine caused death in minutes.

If you only want to hit a single person, the crystaline form of Aconitine should be most handy.
For spreading aconitine vapors, the dried roots may simply be mixed into an incendiary. All descriptions of the Medival incendiary devices, only mentions the powdered roots - no attempts to extract the pure stuff. Arrows were also poisened with only the powder from the roots, and a sticky substance like honey.

Safety note: Aconitine will penetrate intact human skin. Avoid ANY contact with this material. Just tuching the roots with bare hands may paralyze the hands for some time.

Litterature: Assorted Nasties, by David Harber, 1993, Desert Publications.

The Rise of CB Weapons, S.I.P.R.I., Humanities Press, N.Y.

[Mr Cool]

I can tell you that germinating the seeds can be difficult - I'm trying to do so now. Maybe fresh seeds would be better - these were collected from a plant that I used to have a year or so ago. The plant died, so I'm trying to grow it again...
I'm going to let a few plants just grow because they're pretty, but would also like to harvest a couple and try to get me some aconitine.
As it happens I've also added a few nightshades to my collection of alkaloid-containing plants (atropa belladonna, mandragora officinarum, hyoscyamus niger, datura metel), when they're big enough I might start a thread on alkaloid extractions using them. IF the damn seeds germinate....

"touching the roots with bare hands may paralyze the hands for some time."

Really? Wow. That's pretty impressive!

[Tuatara]

Do the seeds have a hard shiny outer coat? Germination can be enhanced by carefully pricking the seed coat once with a pin, in these cases. Works wonders on Kowhai seeds, which are otherwise very hard to grow.

Stratification is also needed with some seeds.

[Yellow]

The seeds for the plant are quite small and hard. Problems with germination is best solved by letting the seeds soak in water for about 24 houers before placing them in the soil.

[Dave Angel]

Soaking with chemicals such as acetone or ethanol can also help to break the dormancy of old seeds. It's a process called scarification and makes the seed coating permeable to water/oxygen. Acids also work I believe, as do mechanical methods, such as that Tuatara mentioned.

[Mr Cool]

The seeds don't look like they need scarification. I had to scarify my daturas, and my other nightshades needed stratification. Maybe if they don't germinate I'll put them in the fridge for a few weeks and have another go. Some of them do look like they're doing something - small translucent white patches are appearing at the end of some seeds, all in the same place. This must be a good sign I think.

[MightyQuinn®]

Most seeds from plants you grow need something called cold stratification to help them along.

You can find information about germination here:

http://www3.nf.sympatico.ca/angelgrove/SEED.HTM

It primarily deals with tree seed, however, I have used the method to gather and germinate rose seeds from my rose bushes.

~~SNIP~~

"Cold Stratification" And "Dormancy"
Many tree seeds have what is called an "embryonic dormancy" and generally speaking will not sprout until this dormancy is broken.
In the wild, "seed dormancy" is usually overcome by the seed spending time in the ground through a winter period and having their hard seed coat soften up a bit. By doing so the seed is undergoing a natural form of "cold stratification" or pretreatment. This cold moist period triggers the seed's embryo, its growth and subsequent expansion eventually break through the softened seed coat in its search for sun and nutrients.
In its most basic form, when we control the cold stratification process, the pretreatment amounts to nothing more than subjecting the seeds to storage in a cool (not freezing) and moist environment for a period found to be sufficient for the species in question. This period of time is often and usually found to be somewhere between 1 through 3 months.

~~SNIP~~

[Ropik]

I wonder if this can be used for KNO3/sugar smoke bomb... Smoke can be used as a distraction, most of the "targets" do not mind that there is something nasty vaporized in it :eek: .
On the other hand, i read something like that smoke mixture mentioned above can partially melt the coke can... Would not be this temperamenture too high? KNO3/sorbitol should be used, I think, because it's a bit cooler(anything is relative...).
"Assorted nasties" online, anyone?

[Yellow]

Dear Ropik
The kno3/sugar mix works well for turning aconitine into vapor. However, if mixed with the pulverised roots, it will not ignite as easy as a pure kno3/sugar mix. A small bag of a pure kno3/sugar mix should be used to ignite the kno3-sugar-aconitine mix.
The mixture of Kclo3 and sugar should not be used. This mixture is actualy one of the hottest burning incendiaries. It will destroy almost any organic poison rather than vaporise it. This mixture is best left for some of the more stable synthetic poisons.

[Mr Cool]

I'm quite sure that anything hotter than a smoulder would render most/any organic toxins useless...

[Ropik]

I think so, but black powder/oil mix is also pretty hot, so I am not sure about this task. :confused:

[akinrog]

The lethal dosis of pure aconitine is 100 mg.

Aconitine has seen much use in poisoned arrows. The tip of the arrow is
coated with a sticky mixture of aconitine and honey. Even a hit in the hands
or legs by such projectiles will cause death.

This is not an objection nor a disagreement. I am just curious how a lethal dose of 100 mg pure aconitine can be ingested by the victim's body effectively. I mean, how effective this stuff with respect to a poison dart. In addition how long must pass - in terms of seconds - that the lethal dose is ingested by the victim's body.

In addition, if SWIM would use a poison dart s/he would dope the dart with a powerful fentanyl analogue like MPPP.

[Ropik]

I make clear that it is not so pleasant be in cloud of sugar smoke with aconitine vapors... However, this can be really effective as retreat backing, you simply light bag of mixture and come on you bloody chaser...
Yellow, you looks like that you have Assorted nasties... Keep adding the excerpts, I am (and probably many of us are!) very interested(and I greatly appreciate your effort, of course)!

[Mr Cool]

I'm getting bored with these aconitum seeds. I've put them in the greenhouse where mother can deal with them. They might still germinate, but they were taking up valuable space in my germinating thingy (it's great, it's got heater pads and lights and everything!).
On the bright side, my datura metel's have started to germinate :D. It'll be a while for my other nightshades though...

What I'm really looking for is a way to extract the goodies from rhododendrons. There are three or four closely related chemicals, with oral LD50's right down to 1mg/kg! Also I have a very large rhododendron...

[Ropik]

Yes, germinating seeds is boring. Much more easier and better is extracting alkaloids from "fleshy" parts of plants, such as roots or stem. Or berries, they are best of all, because alkaloids leaves them with delight :) . Yew berries are good for this.
When you must germinate these seeds, gring, chop, cut or pulverize them in any manner. It makes things muchh faster...

[Jumala]

Here is an old post about aconitin including pic.


http://www.roguesci.org/theforum/showpost.php?p=39354&postcount=27

[Mr Cool]

US2521805 gives a simple extraction. It's a typical alkaloid extraction, but it's good to know for certain that it works and gives quite pure aconitine. If you just tried a generic extraction you would not know purity, so this is a nice reassurance.

[Ropik]

One question: are you really sure that aconitine is impervirous to heat? I read the Assorted nasties recently and nothing like this is mentioned there, not even in the article about poison smoke grenade. I googled around for this feature of aconitine and nothing turned out.

[FUTI]

This is off topic so I apologise at start, it looks a good thread to ask anyway. Since you are involved with seed germination...I'm looking to find a seeds of Datura inoxia to work with...nothing to do with alkaloids, weapons etc. just some fine chemistry. Any help is welcome!

[rolynd]

I found something on aconitines melting point which is between 183°C and 186,5°C. And up to 198°C at finest quality.That makes it in my opinion not the very best candidate to be dispersed by burning substances. A KNO3/Sugar mix will definitively destroy it.
Here is a small Excerpt on Aconitine:

Preparation, History, and Chemical Composition.—Wright's process is as follows: Exhaust powdered aconite root with alcohol, in which has been dissolved 0.5 per cent of tartaric acid. Distill the alcohol to complete evaporation at a low heat or in vacuo. Dilute the extract so obtained with a like quantity of water, remove the oil and resin by filtration, add ether or petroleum naphtha to remove the remaining resin, and precipitate with excess of salt of tartar. Dissolve the precipitate in ether, mix again with petroleum naphtha and evaporate. This process will yield a crystalline aconitine, having, however, a small amount of adherent amorphous product, not wholly separated by the potassium carbonate. Other methods, in which sulphuric acid and ammonia water are chiefly employed, yield an amorphous product. The chemistry of aconite and aconitine has been the subject of much controversy. That the mineral acids produce the amorphous form, and that tartaric acid does not decompose aconitine, were first shown by Duquesnel, in 1872. Groves first obtained it in crystalline form. Wright (1875-1880) showed that aconitine could be resolved by heat or by saponification with an alkali into benzoic acid and aconine (C26H39NO11), an amorphous body, identical with acolyctine and napelline, and having a bitter, non-acrid taste. Aconine dissolves freely in water, alcohol, and chloroform, but is nearly insoluble in ether. Wright assigned to aconitine the formula C33H43NO12, and found its fusing point to be 183° C. (361.4° F.). Subsequently Dunstan and Ince, in 1891, gave it the formula C33H45NO12; fusing point 186.5° C. (367.7° F.). In 1894 and 1895, Freund and Beck pronounced aconitine to be an acetyl-benzoyl derivative of aconine, establishing for the latter alkaloid the formula C25H41NO9; hence, for the pure aconitine C34H47NO11, having a fusing point at 197-198° C. (386.6-388.4° F.). The results obtained by Dr. Freund seem now to be generally adopted as correct. Commercial aconitine has repeatedly been shown to be of various degrees of strength, and is a mixture of the foregoing alkaloids, together with pseudaconitine (C36H49NO12) and picraconitine (C31H45NO10), the former being capable of conversion into dimethyl-protocatechuic acid (veratric acid) (C9H10NO4) and pseudaconine (C27H41NO9). [For a recent investigation in this direction, see Dohme, Proc. Am. Ph. A., 1895, p. 206].

[IronMongrel]

Just tuching the roots with bare hands may paralyze the hands for some time.


I think Mr Harber might exagerate slightly

This is what PFAF says

Simple skin contact with the plant has caused numbness in some people

and

Externally, it is applied to unbroken skin in the treatment of rheumatism, painful bruises, neuralgia etc

This is a really good site for info on medicinal or usefull plants
has all the info you need for cultivation

http://www.pfaf.org/database/plants.php?Aconitum+napellus

[FullMetalJacket]

Hmm, could've sworn is was 'aconite'.