Anfo-k

[Viper III]

Last summer a blew up 2,3 kg Anfo-k (K for katalysator) and the result was amazing.. it rained earth for 10 seconds and there was a really big hole ,...i digged it in vor 20 cm under the surface.

here is the Vid:

http://rapidshare.de/files/11086618/2_3kg_anfo-k__1_5kg_kas-diesel_prills.MOV.html


and a pic, 2 weeks after the detonation...the crater was filled with water:


http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/3521/23kganfokkraternach2wochen0ms.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

I think Anfo.k is a really cheap low explosive which produces a lot of gas, so its perfekt to make big holes =)

[me234]

Hey Viper, I was wondering, when you say "k" is for catalyst, what exactly do you use as a catalyst?
Or is the diesal fuel the "k"?
Anyway, nice hole! It's fun seeing the results isn't it? He, he.

[simply RED]

Very nice video also!

I have a few questions.

- What was the detonator?
- What was the diameter of the charge?
- What was the charge itself? %NH4NO3, %diesel, %kat (what kind of "katalysator" was used?)

[Viper III]

as catalysist i take "brownstone" MnO2.

You can destroy some kinds of batteries. But this MnO2 ist not very clean so you put it into a plastic can oder something else and put boiling water on it....then let it dry.

The best mixture is:

1000g AN
30g MnO2
60g Diesel or engine oil.

As booster you can take 50g APAN...but ANNM,Ammonal is better.

Here is a picture where 500g anfo-k detonated:

http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/4580/krater500gschaufel3rb.png (http://imageshack.us)

[simply RED]

I have to report for another success with AN explosives.

750g NH4NO3 (agricultural grade)
30ml Pine Te(u)rpentine (pine oil used for paint solvent)
50g Al powder (form paint)

All AN used - well dried and powdered with coffee grinder.
Diameter 8-10 cm, 1mm steel casing enforced with duct tape , [150g AN + 40g HMTD] - booster.
Detonator - 3g HMTD pressed in medical syringe.
The device was created with the simplest ingredients possible.
Gives sharp detonation with slight smoke.

Pine turpentine contains unsaturated monoterpenes (C10). One of the most reactive and energetic reducing agent available.

[Viper III]

is it also possible to make just a mixture of An + terpentine and blow it up with 20g ammonal ?

[simply RED]

is it also possible to make just a mixture of An + terpentine and blow it up with 20g ammonal ?

If the ammonal (AN + Al (+TNT-optional) goes off, the charge should detonate too...
Anyway, I never tried as low quantity as 20 grams AN + Al.

[Viper III]

i just want to know if AN + Terpentine is a sekundär charge like ammonal,annm,dynamits....or if it need a stronger booster charge like anfo.k
if this explosiv is strong like ammonal it would be great
i think I will buy tommorow terpentine =)

[simply RED]

It is a secondary charge but theory suggests it is less sensitive than powdered TNT. Maybe 10-20% more powerful than ANFO (especially with Al added).
I noted tha lack of dense white smoke (which anfo always gived off) . This indicates better burning.
I made it only 2 times . Both times about 830 grams (in a tin can from corn). Both times with especially strong boosters. (Both charges were used to knock down a tree (30-40 cm). The tree fall after the second blast.
I don't know exactly how sensitive the mix is.

[Viper III]

hm the problem is that I won`t use AL powder because then i also could make Ammonal B , and AL powder is for me difficult to get

[simply RED]

Use only terpentine and you still have 10-15% more powerful and 30-40% more sensitive expolosive than normal anfo.
(you could compare AN-terpentine and ANFO-K experimentally)

[Viper III]

" (you could compare AN-terpentine and ANFO-K experimentally) "

good idea ^^

when its not cold anymore i will make some kg pure AN and test it 2kg of both explosives 30cm under the earth

how would be the right mixture in % of terpentine to AN (not with al)

[simply RED]

6% Terpentine - 94% AN. The mix with alluminium was brizant enough to cut down a tree (with a big piece of concrete for counterweight the second blast), it is interesting to compare the brizance of the charges too.

[KLuuppo]

I'm not sure whether this should be in picric acid topic or here but I'm asking it anyway. I have about 1kg of AN and some fuel oil and I probably can manage to get my hands on some manganese oxide. I've been planning something like 1-2kg ANFO -k (now that I red about it) and detonating it with picric acid which would be detonated with few grams of HMTD or AP. The question is, how much do you think will be enough of picric acid to detonate the ANFO -k? And happens anyone to know what amount of HMTD or AP is needed for picric acid to go off. (Yes I know that last question isn't in right place, but I suppose it isn't worth of posting as own)

[Viper III]

Here a new video of 1kg anfo.k in a little "lake" it is just the 2,3kg anfo.k crater full with water...

http://rapidshare.de/files/16367987/1kg_Anfo.k_Underwater.mpg.html

[1-more-urban-pyr0000]

Newbies need to make their first postings here something more substantial than "LOL, Me2!"-type responses.

You can do that later, after you've proven yourself a contributing member, but dead weight we don't need. Contribute to the discussion or leave.

[Viper III]

this time I used expensive motor engine oil from my motobycicle...

and yess, i think it works better than diesel


and the cam electronic is damaged because of the shockwave....

[wulli]

hi folks ,

I hope that you won´t get angry about my answer in this pretty old thread

I did some research with a friend [he calls himself "rasmus" ] 3 or 4 years ago and we found out that MnO2 ist a good catalyst for the decomposition of NH4NO3 to n2 h2o nox nh3...


I´m just writing it down because I´m amazed how popular the mixture "anfo-k" became in the past 2 years , the most german pyros are using it cause the "critical mass" is reduced to <75g and it needn´t to be buried to get an complete detonation


here is a small vid :

3kg anfok [maincharge]
100gr annm [just used to get sure that the detonation got complete]
150gr ammonal-b [ i found it by tiding up my little laboratory]
15gr PETN [booster]

ini : 0.2gr Pb(N3)2 [ß-type]

http://home.arcor.de/technikertreff/videos/3kg.avi

wish you a nice weekend.

[NoltaiR]

It is very good to see someone is actually putting some work into their research ;)

While this forum is technically supposed to be discussion of theory, it is easy to see that in these past few years where little or no experimentation has been done, the discussion has come to a halt.

And with the addition of media such as the video and pictures provided, it makes this whole experience (that we call theForum) a lot more amusing.

Having that said, I must add that Viper III, you should really reconsider posting photos like the one you have near the middle that has a portion of a person in it. In a time where science of this nature has come under such scrutiny, it is wise to leave as little human interaction viewable.

ANFO has always been one of my favorites. The chemicals for this secondary explosive are relatively easy to attain, it is quite safe to work with, and usually leaves not much of a mess to clean up later (other than the giant holes in the ground).

And by "easy to attain".. I mean a trip down to your local Wal-Mart.

The only real downside of this explosive is that it has such a low brisance. Even in your video at the slow motion replay, there is no visible shockwave. However when taping an experiment of something that does have a high level of brisance (even well packed black powder charges) you have a noticeable halo that dispells quickly from ground zero.. and is quite fun to watch!

Lastly in the discussion of a "catalyst" as you call it... Your secondary obviously requires a primary to detonate it. If you have your ANFO contained very well, you really shouldn't need a third compound in there to help the reaction. Any of your VERY common primaries (by common I mean easy to produce) like APAN or my legendary APrc should condense the secondary to the critical mass required for detonation to occur. If there is still a problem with that, then make a small shaped charge out of your primary.. that should easily do the trick.

[NoltaiR]

I have one more thing to add.

I noticed the guy that posted before me, was making his first post.

To my pleasure, he used phrases like "I did some research.." and even posted a video to help facilitate the discussion!!!

Why can't all the new guys be like this?!? And good job wulli!

One more thing.. I just noticed this guy has been a member since 2003. Well we do advise that you be a reader first before a poster ;)

[Viper III]

hello wulli..

this board is a little bit better thand kranky board or the german explosive board isnt it ? ^^


I hope I am able to walk in the next 6 weeks...because i had an motobike accident...and then I am looking forward to set of a 10kg anfo.k charge...should be funny ^^

[NoltaiR]

If I may ask, where are you getting all your AN from? Surely if you are making charges of that size, you aren't breaking open a ton of those little cold packs...

[Viper III]

I have 100kg KAS fertilizer.. (80% AN 20% lime)

its a nasty job do clean the AN from the lime..but i have no other way to geht AN...

we payed for 100kg KAS 26€ i think...so its really cheap

[NoltaiR]

Well it is safe to say that I am jealous ;)

There was a guy here a while back that was getting AN in the big bags like that and had some videos that he posted of 50kg charges. That was amazing...

[Viper III]

where are the links to the vids of the 50kg charges ????!!!!! holy shit:eek:


Another positiv aspect of anfo.k is that it isnt very loud compared to ammonal for example, and it also helps a lot to digg in the charge for a few cm.... and the crater would also be bigger.....hmm, ich like raining earth:p

[knowledgehungry]

A member named spydamonkee did some 10 kg charges. He was talking about doing larger ones but I don't think he ever posted any thing on them.

The thread with the video is http://www.roguesci.org/theforum/high-explosives/206-got-5m-crater.html

Pretty cool stuff.

[Viper III]

thanks...

I also made 11kg CANFO-K (also with catalysator!!!!) last sommer

As booster i took 200g APAN.....und burried it a little bit....but just around 1,5kg detonated....shit-house-tour....

But this guy took 1kg APAN...maybe this was the trick.....I have a new projekt for this sommer :D

[Kleng]

If you can get hold of some Nitromethane a booster of 1kg ANNM would really kick ass!

[The_Duke]

As booster i took 200g APAN.....und burried it a little bit....but just around 1,5kg detonated....shit-house-tour....

But this guy took 1kg APAN...maybe this was the trick.....I have a new projekt for this sommer :D

Making 200g of APAN is just plain stupid and kewlish...:rolleyes:

Making 1kg APAN is insane!:eek:

[Viper III]

@ the duke

I know, i know....but had no Al anymore vor ammonal, but know I have 3,5 litres Nitromethane = )

[Kleng]

Make some videos of ANNM then. In addition you can use it as booster for some really big ANFO-charges. Just buy a sack of cheap NH4NO3...

[Viper III]

the problem is I really get no clean NH4NO3 here,,....just fertilizer with 20% lime in it...so to make 10kg pure AN I need arount 20 hours work time...

this would be no problem for me...but I live by my parents..and my father is a cop..and so its a little bit a problem...because it would be a little bit eye catching if I boil the AN liquid in the garage and dry the AN in the oven....

[Kleng]

Can't you get hold of some instant ice-packs? They are filled with clean AN:) And by the way, last time I made ANNM, I dried my AN in the sun. It would only work on a sunny day though. If it is rainy, probalbly some kind of strong lamp would work?

[zajcek01]

Sorry for my off topic, but a word of advice:

Viper III, my father is also a cop, and my mother is laboratory assistant in school.
I used to hide my experiments from my parents, so I had to work very fast, the result was a lot of spills and broken glassware :(
USE
It is better to tell the truth what are you doing, because if something goes wrong, they know what were you doing... Let's say for example you go in the garage and play around with your freshly generated chlorine, or your newly bought cyanide and told your parents what will you going to do in garage, they will know how to get proper help if they will find you lying unconscious on the garage floor. And the best thing about telling them the truth is, that you can go together somewhere and test your new explosives, maybe they will even buy you some "not dangerous" chemicals.
PARAGRAPH
Before we moved all my neighbors knew what am I doing. I once blew up an old couch and everyone ran over to see if I am OK. I was lucky to have such nice neighbors. They never complained about explosions,smoke bombs ,not even about loud music late at night when my parents were away. Now I experiment in abandoned barn and detonate explosives in old siloses.
My point is: It's better to tell the people around you what are you doing, so they can help you if something goes wrong.
BREAKS
p.s. sorry for my English, I'm still learning...the "Check Spelling" thing relay comes in handy!

[Viper III]

I don`t have to say my neighbours what I am doing...Now everybody knows it since new Year :D

My father is strictly against everything..also normal, undangerous chemical expieriments...because he saw some of my HE movies...(typically cop....) and if he sees tiny white powder particles in my room, he knows whats going on...

I have to sent all my chems which i bye in the internet to a friend...


That sucks, but its the most fun making hobby i know... :D

[Kleng]

I'm using the same tactic as zajcek01 and it works great. The problem was when I first time detonated ANFO. Then the BANG was a bit too loud and about the whole island I live on heard it. Thererfor I haven't blow up something for about one month. The only thing I've done in the last time is to chemically destroy brown snails in our garden with conc. HNO3 ;)

[aikon]

...The only thing I've done in the last time is to chemically destroy brown snails in our garden with conc. HNO3 ;)

What a waste of precious nitric acid! :eek:

[Kleng]

What a waste of precious nitric acid! :eek:

Not if you got 25 liters and can get a lot more! I can buy a can of 25 litres for about 25 USD.

I would like to destill it to make som RDX, but it looks very scary.

[Viper III]

making PETN should also work with a mixture of 65% HNO3 and hico. H2SO4

but now back to topic....

I don`t know where I should buy these instant Cold packs...I have never heared of them...I am shure they are quite expensive..

[nbk2000]

Pharamacies, drug-stores, sporting goods stores, and first-aid/medical suppliers are places where you could buy instant cold packs. Also, in these departments at large retailers like Wal-Mart (which you likely don't have).

Though you have to test it to make sure that it IS Ammonium Nitrate, as some cold packs use Urea, instead.

[Kleng]

I buy mine Instant-Cold Packs from a Sport Shop. They cost about 2 USD. You should read on them first, just to be sure that they contains AN. But if the contains Urea, you just make som Urea Nitrate. When this AN is grounded, it works perfect for APAN, ANNM and ANFO. It's only that I've used it for.

[live4ever]

I'm pretty sure the instant cold packs that contain ammonium nitrate are required to state that they contain ammonium nitrate, if not on the box, then on the pack itself, usually somewhere under the first aid section.

If you can't find anywhere on the box or pack that says it contains ammonium nitrate and water, then save yourself the money and don't buy it.

[c.Tech]

I'm pretty sure the instant cold packs that contain ammonium nitrate are required to state that they contain ammonium nitrate, if not on the box, then on the pack itself, usually somewhere under the first aid section.

If you can't find anywhere on the box or pack that says it contains ammonium nitrate and water, then save yourself the money and don't buy it.

It also depends in which country/state you live in, laws may be different depending on where you are.

I did a quick google search and found that most endothermic reactions (cold reactions) in instant cold packs contain ammonium nitrate. It would be rare to find other chems although others can be used.

http://www.visionlearning.com/library/module_viewer.php?mid=54&l=&c3
A good example of an endothermic reaction is that which takes place inside of an instant '"cold pack." Commercial cold packs usually consist of two compounds - urea and ammonium chloride in separate containers within a plastic bag. When the bag is bent and the inside containers are broken, the two compounds mix together and begin to react. Because the reaction is endothermic, it absorbs heat from the surrounding environment and the bag gets cold.

http://www.faqfarm.com/Q/What_kind_of_liquid_is_in_instant_cold_packs
A waterbag activates a chemical inside an outter pack, usually Ammonium Nitrate. However, because of its potential danger, a Urea Based pack with non-toxic addatives has become the norm to create a icy sensation. I believe only one company manufactures this specific composition, called the InstaKool by Nortech.
I have not been able to locate an instant cold pack that doesn't use amonium nitrate...

Instead of never buying the product get company’s number down (or track them through their address, which should be on the box) and ask if it has ammonium nitrate because you want to know if you can use it as a fertilizer after use ;) then go back and buy the cheapest one :D (Is my background Jewish?;)).

[fiknet]

I'm in Western Australia and I have been to several different stores in different areas.

The first one was a discount health chain called "Priceline" I purchased the Medi-Pak Instant Ice Pack and it contained pure Ammonium Nitrate.

For the second I went back to the same store and got the same brand however it appears the company have changed to Urea as I also tried another Priceline store in another area and it also contained Urea.

The others were pharmacies ( I believe Amcol it was called and another one I'm not sure of the name ) in several areas and they all stocked the brand Surgi-Pack ( I think that's the name, look for a white box.) Instant Ice Packs and they contained CALAM which is 80% AN and 20% Limestone which is easy to seperate. They had an average cost of 7.95$

Always make sure to open the box and look on the packet to see what it contains.

My question is that is it alright to use the CALAM or will the 20% impurity result in a major power decline.

[c.Tech]

is it alright to use the CALAM or will the 20% impurity result in a major power decline.

If you use 80% it probably would be much harder to detonate. Instead of risking it just separate the limestone like you said.

As limestone contains nearly all if not all insoluble substances, just dissolve the AN in water, filter and evaporate (unless of course the limestone is separated from the AN and you just have to pick out the AN granules from the limestone.)

You probably already know this but make sure you AN is very dry, you could try using calcium chloride sold at Bunning’s under the name dampsorb for absorbing excess moisture in the bathroom.

What would be the purpose of limestone in instant cold packs anyway?

[Diabolique]

c.Tech, I suspect that the lime is there to make it difficult for people like us to use it for fun things. I have also heard that some prills are being coated with a material to keep the fuel oil from absorbing into the AN prills. I have heard stearic acid mentioned for this, but there are likely other materials as well. (Spoil sports).

In highschool, we combined AN with MnO2 (the black powder inside carbon batteries) in a test tube, and heated it to produce nitrous oxide. The MnO2 acted as a catylyst. Possibly the same is happening here.

MnO2 boiled into raw linseed oil is 1/2 of the dryer mixture used for spontaneous combustion mixtures - the other half is litharge (lead oxide) boiled into linseed oil. Mixed and soaked into cotton cloth, and you have fire in a few hours. Makes one wonder what would happen if the dryers were mixed with AN instead?

[Bert]

have also heard that some prills are being coated with a material to keep the fuel oil from absorbing into the AN prills. I have heard stearic acid mentioned for this, but there are likely other materials as well.
Stearic acid and Aluminum added to Amomium nitrate is described in COPAE as "French Amonal". If they're really doing this, they're making it EASIER to use the AN for explosives...

[c.Tech]

c.Tech, I suspect that the lime is there to make it difficult for people like us to use it for fun things. I have also heard that some prills are being coated with a material to keep the fuel oil from absorbing into the AN prills. I have heard stearic acid mentioned for this, but there are likely other materials as well. (Spoil sports).

Even if they do that there will always be a way to get around it.

I believe that stearic acid is soluble in ethanol, and if other coating ingredients are used the AN could just be crushed.

But if the water has to contact the AN to cause a endothermic reaction. This means that the coating layer would have to water soluble too, Because of the extremely high solubility and low melting point of ammonium nitrate it should be easier to separate than you think.

I also think they are doing to avoid the so-called 'threat of terrorism' and make our people 'safer'.

[Diabolique]

Where there is a will, there is a way (or is it a dead body?). The simplest way I know of to recover AN is to dissolve it in water, filter out the solids, and evaporate it to a solid. It may be necessary to heat it to melting to drive off all of the water, and grinding it to a powder in a humidity free room. A lot of work.

When even the expensive and poor quality sources of AN are gone, we can buy ammonium sulfate and react it with calcium nitrate (now you know what to do with spent nitric acid from RDX production). It may be worth while to compile info on making/purifying AN from alternate sources.

[Viper III]

OK guys, the next time I will work on a little bomb, that means a lot of work hours.

1kg ANNM booster +5kg ANFO-K + 10kg CANFO, that should be a huge ass explosion which should get famous.

I will need around 6 weeks because my parents shouldn't see when I cook the AN solution and dry it in the oven.

The most important thing is that I also have to find a good location to set off this charge.

I don't really know how deep I should dig it in to silence most of the noise.

++++++++++++=

Grammar is your friend. :) NBK

[Lewis]

Is it just me, or does Viper seem like on of those men of action that tends to deliver great entertainment for all of us at the forums, yet has a decent chance of winding up dead?

The user Phone comes to mind. I believe he was talking about waiting for is parents to leave his house before he began making his explosives.

[nbk2000]

The 'Phone' line is dead.

There's no dial tone on that 'Phone'.

The jokes write themselves! :D

[deadman]

Well I was going to try to think of some more phone jokes, but my brain farted out.

Everyone who is starting out in high explosive remember the lesson of phone. He definitley was a kewl, but as any kewl he thought he was smarter than those who advise against making AP without proper respect or technique.

If you are not familiar with phone's story make sure you take a look.
http://www.roguesci.org/theforum/water-cooler/2311-storing-acetone-peroxide.html#post56999

The piles of AP that killed him(originally posted by al93535):
http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/0402/23/NYHETER-23s11pulver_368.jpg

+++++++++

If you're going to copy/paste a link, make sure you do it properly, by right click/'Copy Link Location', as copying the text of the link with ... in it is NOT going to work. NBK

[simply RED]

Is it completely sure phone was the guy from the newspaper story?

[Viper III]

why is there so much spam ???

Did i say that i want to make 16kg AP ???
So where is the problem ?

[Lewis]

I wasn't trying to flame you or attack your credibility, Viper, just a reminder to be careful.

{Phone just received a collect call from his Maker}

[Viper III]

we all have helmets, 150m cabel, and store the ini cap away from the sek. charge..

believe me, i know how i handle explosives...



PS: sorry for my bad english

[deadman]

Viper, what exactly do you use as your initiation system? Other than a 150meter cable.

BTW: Try not to apologize for your english, just do your best and if there is a problem understanding it will be addressed. Not trying to put you down, but it is looked down upon.

[Viper III]

initiaton system ? 1 gramm HMTD ? a strong battery ? BP-pill with a iron fiber in it ?

[deadman]

Sorry I wasn't clear in my question. I just meant do you use an actual flip switch, or push button box to send the electric current to initiate your primary? From your post I am guessing you just complete the circuit of a "strong battery."

[c.Tech]

Sorry delate this post, it somehow went in the wrong thread.

[Viper III]

my friend is electritian , at the moment he builds a new box : 3 safty flip switch + push button with green and red LEDs....

[Kleng]

Nice ViperIII:)

Me and my friend is also going to build a box just like the one you describe. Could you upload a picture and a short explanation to it when it's done?

[Viper III]

Yess of course,...i hope my friend is not too lazy to do it how i want.

I changed my plan: just 10kg CANFO + 40g AL per kg and 1kg annmal booster...

@ the moment 2kg of CANFO-K are ready and in a few days i should get 2kg AL powder 70µ
Cleaning the CAN is too much work ^^

+++++++

How did you manage to get it right at the beginning of the second sentence, and fail so miserably the rest of the posting? NBK