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nbk2000
December 8th, 2000, 10:19 AM
We get a lot of questions here about hydrazine since it's used to make Astrolite. It's impossible to find it over the counter, and it's expensive as hell to by, but you can make it easily enough.

Now once you've got your hydrazine, you have to make it anhydrous (without water) to use it for astrolite. How you do this is up to you because it's very dangerous and complicated to do. If you've gone far enough to actually make it then you'll go through the effort of researching how to distill it yourself.

Since your interested in getting the hydrazine you'd probably want to skip the acid addition step since this is used to seperate out the hydrazine as a crystalline precipitate.

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HYDRAZINE SULFATE

2 NH3 + NaOCl--> NH2NH2 + H2O + NaCl

Prepared by ROGER ADAMS and B. K. BROWN. Checked by J. B. CONANT
and W. L. HANAWAY.

1. Procedure

A NORMAL solution of sodium hypochlorite is prepared as follows:
in a 5-l. round-bottom flask are placed 1800 g. of sodium
hydroxide solution (300 g. of sodium hydroxide to 1500 g.
of water) and 1500 g. of ice. Chlorine gas is then passed into
the solution until it has gained in weight approximately 213 g.
During this addition, the solution must be kept thoroughly
cooled with ice, in order that chlorates will not be formed.
After all the chlorine has been passed in, it is necessary to be
certain that the mixture is slightly alkaline, since any excess
of free chlorine in the solution prevents the formation of hydrazine.

In a 14-inch evaporating dish are placed 1500 cc.
of c. p. ammonia water (sp. gr. 0.90), 900 cc. of distilled water,
375 cc. of 10 per cent gelatine solution, and 1200 cc.
of the normal sodium hypochlorite solution prepared as above.
This mixture is heated as rapidly as possible and boiled down
until one-third of the original volume is left. This solution
is then cooled thoroughly with ice and filtered with suction,
first through two layers of toweling and then through one
thickness of ordinary filter paper over cloth, in order to remove
finely divided solid impurities. The solution is then placed
in a precipitating jar, and cooled down thoroughly (0'0) with ice
and salt; 10 cc. of concentrated sulfuric acid for each 100 cc.
of solution are gradually added with constant stirring.
A precipitate of hydrazine sulfate (NH2NH2<.>H2SO4) forms.
The mixture is allowed to stand in the cold for a few hours in order
to complete the precipitation, and is then filtered by suction in the
usual way and washed with cold alcohol. The yield varies from 53 g.
to 58 g. per 1500 cc. of ammonia water (34-37 per cent of the
theoretical amount). The product is perfectly white and crystalline,
and satisfactory for almost any purpose. If an absolutely pure
product is desired, it must be recrystallized from water.
For every 21 g. of crude product, 100 g. of boiling water are used.
If the crude hydrazine is brown, it is advisable to use a little
bone-black. After the mixture has been filtered and cooled to 0'0, 19 g.
of pure white crystals are obtained.


2. Notes

In the preparation of the sodium hypochlorite solution it is quite
necessary that the mixture be kept cold and be alkaline to red
litmus paper at the end of the reaction, if good yields of hydrazine
are to be obtained.

Since iron is an anti-catalyzer, it is necesssary{sic} to use
distilled water throughout the process.

As a viscolizer, a substance such as starch, glycerol, glue or
gelatine may be used; the last, however, gives by far the
most satisfactory results.

In order to obtain a pure white hydrazine sulfate as the
first precipitate, it is necessary to cool the hydrazine solution
thoroughly and filter it twice before the sulfuric acid is added.
Moreover, the sulfuric acid must be added slowly and with stirring.
If these conditions are not followed, material containing
brown particles results.

The mother liquor obtained from the crystallized hydrazine
sulfate contains a small amount of hydrazine. If 200 g.
of copper sulfate are dissolved in water and added to 10 l.
of the filtrates from the above processes, a light-blue crystalline
precipitate of the double salt of copper sulfate and hydrazine
sulfate will be formed after ten hours. This salt, when suspended
in ten times its weight of distilled water and treated with hydrogen
sulfide, decomposes into copper sulfide and hydrazine sulfate.
After the copper salt has been filtered off, the solution
is concentrated until the hydrazine sulfate crystallizes.
The yield of product is small, so that it is hardly advisable
to undertake this recovery in the laboratory.

It is possible for one man, simultaneously evaporating six dishes
of the hydrazine mixture, to turn out from 20 to 25 runs in nine hours.
The time for the evaporation of a solution, such as is mentioned
in the experimental part, with a four-flame Bunsen burner, is two to
three hours; if the evaporation is carried out more slowly than this,
the yield of product is distinctly diminished.


3. Other Methods of Preparation

Hydrazine salts have been prepared by the action of hypochlorites on
ammonia[1] or urea;[2] by the hydrolysis of salts of sulfohydrazimethylene
disulfonic acid;[3] by the hydrolysis of triazoacetic acid;[4] by the
reduction of diazoacetic ester;[5] by the reduction of nitroguanidine
followed by hydrolysis;[6] by the reduction of the nitroso derivatives
of hexamethylene tetramine;[7] by the reduction of nitrates or nitrites
with zinc in neutral solution;[8] by the action of sodium bisulfite
on hyponitrous acid followed by reduction;[1b] by the reduction
of K2SO3N2O2;[2b] by the action of ammonia on dichlorourea;[3b]
by the reduction of nitrosoparaldimin;[4b] by the action of copper
sulfate on ammonia at high temperatures;[5b] by the reduction of
methylene diisonitrosoamine;[6b] by the hydrolysis of the addition
product of diazoacetic ester and fumaric or cinnamic esters.[7b]


[1] D. R. P. 192,783; Chem. Zentr. 1908 (I), 427; Chem. Ztg. 31, 926
(1907); D. R. P. 198,307; Chem. Zentr. 1908 (I), 1957; Eng. Pat.
22,957; C. A. 2, 1999 (1908); U. S. Pat. 910,858; C. A. 3, 1065
(1909); French Pat. 382,357; C. A. 3, 2358 (1909); Ber.
40, 4588 (1907); Laboratory Manual of Inorganic Preparations,
by A. B. Lamb, Harvard University, Cambridge, Mass.

[2] J. Russ. Phys. Chem. Soc. 37, 1 (1905); Chem. Zentr. 1905
(I) 1227; D. R. P. 164,755; Frdl. 8, 53 (1905); French Pat. 329,430;
J. Soc. Chem. Ind. 22, 1063 (1903); Chem. Zentr. 1905 (I) 1227.

[3] D. R. P. 79,885; Frdl. 4, 26 (1895); Ber. 28, 2381 (1895).

[4] Ber. 20, 1632 (1887); Chem. News 55, 288 (1887); D. R. P. 47,600;
Frdl. 2, 554 (1889); J. prakt. Chem. (2) 39, 27 (1889).

[5] Ber. 27, 775 (1894); 28, 1848 (1895); D. R. P. 58,751; Frdl. 3, 16
(1891); D. R. P. 87,131; Frdl. 4, 28 (1896).

[6] Ann. 270, 31 (1892); D. R. P. 59,241; Frdl. 3, 16
(1891); Eng. Pat. 6,786; J. Soc. Chem. Ind. 11, 370 (1892).

[7] D. R. P. 80,466; Frdl. 4, 27 (1895); Ann. 288, 232 (1895).

[8] Eng. Pat. 11, 216; J. Soc. Chem. Ind. 14, 595 (1895). [1b] Ber.
33, 2115 (1900); Ann. 288, 301 (1895).

[2b] Ber. 27, 3498 (1894).

[3b] J. Chem. Soc. 95, 235 (1909); Chem. News 98, 166 (1908).

[4b] Ber. 23, 752 (1890).

[5b] Chem. News 66, 223 (1892).

[6b] Ber. 27, 3292 (1894);

[7b] Ber. 21, 2637 (1888).

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"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"

Go here (http://members.nbci.com/angelo_444/here.html) to download the NBK2000 website PDF.

Bitter
December 8th, 2000, 03:34 PM
.............Right. Got a tiny amount of hydrazine sulphate.....now what do I do with it ? Any suggestions on what to mix it with ?

Agent Blak
December 8th, 2000, 06:46 PM
Mix it with NH4NO3 and Al powder I forget the ratios but the compound I believ is called;
Astrolite A1-5. Astrolite G is supposed to be Rocket fuel from what I have read; It is NH4NO3 and Hydrazine. Isn't Hydrazine Very poisonous?

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A wise man once said:
"It is Better to Die on Your Feet; Than to Live on your Knees "
--Zappata

Agent Blak----OUT!!

Anthony
December 8th, 2000, 07:38 PM
Hydrazine is *very* toxic.

I don't think you want hydrazine sulphate, thats why NBK said to skip the acid addition which precipitates out the hydrazine as hydrazine sulphate. If I understood correctly, you distill the solution as it contains straight hydrazine until it is pure enough to be used as an explosive.

Alchemist
December 8th, 2000, 11:13 PM
Hello to whom it may concern,
As stated this is a very, very dangerous process! Hydrazine (H4N2) is highly toxic by ingestion, inhalation, and skin absoration. Also a strong irritant to skin and eyes. A very severe explosive hazard when exposed to to heat or by reaction to other oxidizing materials. If anyone tries to make this, please use extreme caution! Believe it or not but house wifes have died by mixing Bleach (Sodium Hypochlorite) and Ammonia(NH3)in there bath rooms thinking this would make a better cleaning agent for the toilet.

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CodeMason
December 8th, 2000, 11:27 PM
Dear god! That stuff is so ridiculously toxic, it's not even funny. I would not get within 500 metres of that stuff. In fact, I'd rather down a few mouthfuls of chlorine gas than dying very slowly and painfully from hydrazine poisoning.

Alchemist
December 8th, 2000, 11:28 PM
Hello NBK2000,
Being very interested in chemistry (I hope to be one someday)if you have any of those doc's, papers, notes, etc. that you spoke about on Hydazine salts. I would be very gracious if you could e-mail them to me. alchemist_0@hotmail.com

P.S.1; That is a underscore and a zero not a O!
P.S.2; Please let me know if there's anything your looking for!

Thanks.......................................

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nbk2000
December 9th, 2000, 11:12 AM
I don't have any of the papers referenced in the article. I just found it on the net and copied it out. Any decent college library will have at least a few of them though so check there.

------------------
"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"

Go here (http://members.nbci.com/angelo_444/here.html) to download the NBK2000 website PDF.

jin
December 9th, 2000, 12:39 PM
if you buy some it gives the warning, known carcinogen and highly flamable on the bottle.

Bitter
December 14th, 2000, 02:49 PM
Are you lot sure that ammonium nitrate and hydrazinum sulphate will produce astrolite ? Won't it also produce and acidic sulphuric compound that will make the astrolite dangerously unstable ?

CragHack
December 14th, 2000, 04:01 PM
hydrazine sulfate is used... after a series of steps, to produce anyhydrous hydrazine. THIS is what is used to make astrolite.

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...Æ

megalomania
December 15th, 2000, 07:44 PM
The article is a reprint from Organic Synthesis Collective Volume 1 (which I just happen to have with me) published after WWII, it is itself a collection of articles from the 1920's. Those references are way too old for many libraries to have them (Thats why Organic Synthesis exists, and is still published, it's all that left and is the best available resource).

I have rewritten that article at my website as well, the sulfate part has been omitted.

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For the most comprehensive and informative web site on explosives and related topics, go to Megalomania's Explosives and Stuff at http://surf.to/megalomania

Mr Cool
January 5th, 2001, 08:49 AM
I've got instructions somewhere for making lead azide from (mainly) hydrazine, isopropyl nitrite, sodium hydroxide and lead nitrate (good if, like me, you can't get sodium azide OTC!).
If anyone's interested I'll try and find them and post them here. Just let me know.

sadsakjoel
February 13th, 2001, 03:14 AM
I would not go near hydrazine sulfate, not even for money! I have just finished reading a story in the newspaper about compensation for the families of all those dead, poisened people.

nbk2000
February 13th, 2001, 12:36 PM
I've read in OMNI and PENTHOUSE magazine s (both owned by Guccioni) that HS is very good for treating the wasting caused by cancer and AIDS.

It supposedly adds years to a persons life by enabling them to keep eating normally, instead of barfing up everything they take in which makes them weaker, sicker, etc.

Guccionis wife died of cancer, but she started taking HS when she got sick, and she got much better and lived normally up until almost the very end.

HS treatment is supressed because doctors don't want people using something that you can buy OTC for $20 a kilo instead of their $1,000 a treatment, hospitalization required chemo that makes you sick as death.

------------------
"The knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them"

Go here (http://members.nbci.com/angelo_444/dload.html) to download the NBK2000 website PDF.

MacCleod
February 13th, 2001, 11:59 PM
I read an article about that several years ago in I believe "Omni/Longevity",didn't know the med was HS though.It said the M.D. who discovered the cancer treatment benefits of it was stonewalled,harrassed,and legally blocked by the medical industry,drug companies from marketing it for this use.They had too much to lose,mainly the billion+ per year (profit) cancer hospices and the many thousands of people employed by them,who'd be out of work!.Didn't these people take an oath to help ease human suffering?.I guess only if it doesn't interfere with thier paychecks!.

sadsakjoel
February 14th, 2001, 03:04 AM
I read it in penthouse too. April 98 or something

Bitter
February 14th, 2001, 02:04 PM
I still have that small amount of HS available...should anyone come down with anything.

simply RED
February 15th, 2001, 09:01 AM
Some articles claim that astrolyte is solution of hydrazine and NH4NO3. This is FALSE! Astrolyte is solution of hydrazine and NH2NH3NO3-HYDRAZINE NITRATE...When you add the ammonium nitrate to the hydrazine nitrate and NH3 are produced, the some NH3 dissolves in the astrolyte making it easily initiatble!

simply RED
February 15th, 2001, 09:03 AM
syntax error! .....when you add the ammonium nitrate to the hydrazine, hydranine nirate and NH3....

PHILOU Zrealone
February 19th, 2001, 11:45 AM
I have about 500g NH2NH4SO4 at home and about 50ml left of NH2NH3OH (80% NH2-NH2 solution) and they are as safe as NH4 salts or 33% NH3 solution- just don't breath it too long nor put it in your eyes or on your skin.
Anyway with dry NH2-NH4SO4 you can make a mix with:
* Ca(OH)2 (s) to get the NH2-NH3-OH
*Ca(NO3)2 (s) to get the NH2-NH3-NO3
*Ca(ClO4)2(s) to get the NH2-NH3-ClO4
All those giving some unsoluble plaster CaSO4 when washed with hot water; filter and keep the solution (hydrazinium hydroxyde); cristallise the explosives salts (Hydrazinium nitrate or perchlorate)...they are pretty hygroscopic more than NH4NO3!!!!

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"Life that deadly disease sexually transmitted".
"Chemistry is all what stinks and explode; Physic is all what never works! ;-p :-) :o)"

Mr Cool
February 19th, 2001, 05:01 PM
Hey Philou: Is the NH2NH3NO3 useful as an explosive at all? How much experience have you had with it? I'd have thought it'd be similar to NH4NO3 but more powerful due to it's better oxygen balance, and maybe a bit more sensitive.
Please give me any information you can.

FadeToBlackened
March 13th, 2001, 12:02 AM
Hey Mr Cool could you post that procedure for lead azide from hydrazine, NaOH, etc..?

Bitter
March 13th, 2001, 10:24 AM
Yeah, that would be good. If it's possible, that is.

Mr Cool
March 13th, 2001, 01:45 PM
OK, here it is, copied straight from FEMFEP. Not very simple and probably not worth the effort, but interesting. It is a lot safer than peroxide primaries.


Lead Azide



Preparation of Hydrazinium sulfate.

2NH3 + NaOCl + H2SO4 ---> N2H4*H2SO4 + NaCl + H2O


One-hundred-forty-one ml of Chlorox bleach (5.25 percent NaOCl) was added
to 200 ml of 20 percent ammonium hydroxide and 5 ml of 1 percent limewater
Ca(OH)2 in one liter Erlenmeyer flask. The mixture was rapidly heated to
boiling and maintained until the volume was reduced to about half, which
required about one-half hour. The solution was rapidly cooled and dilute
sulfuric acid was added until a pH of 7-8 has attained and the precipitate
that formed was separated by filtration. The cold filtrate was strongly
acidified with 40 percent sulfuric acid. The white precipitate was
filtered, washed with methanol and air dried. Melting point 254 degrees C
(lit. 254 degrees C).

Preparation of Isopropyl Nitrite

A mixture of 45 ml concentrated sulfuric acid, 30 ml water and 110 ml
isopropyl alcohol, previously cooled to 0 centigrades, was added to an ice
cold solution of 114 grams of sodium nitrite in 450 ml of H2O. Slow
addition required about two hours in order to maintain a temperature around
0 centigrades. The upper oily layer was separated and washed three times
with 30 ml portions of 5 gram 100 ml sodium bicarbonate solution and 22
grams NaCl 100 ml solution respectively.

Preparation of Sodium Azide

N2H4*H2O + NaOH + C4H9ONO2 ---> NaN3 + C4H9OH + 3H2O


Five grams of caustic soda (NaOH) was dissolved in 50 ml if ethyl alcohol
(3A), and the clear portion was decanted in a 100 ml distilling flask
containing 6 ml of hydrazine hydrate. After adding one ml of butyl nitrite
(or isopropyl nitrite) the mixture was heated on a steam bath to initiate
the reaction. Twelve ml more of the nitrite was slowly added in such a
manner that the mixture refluxed slowly. Addition required about one hour
and the mixture was heated an additional fifteen minutes. The reaction
flask was cooled and the solid product collected on a filter. The product
was washed with alcohol and air dried. Recrystallization from water yielded
white crystalline material.

Preparation of Lead Azide

The following solutions were prepared:

Solution A: 0.20 g of sodium azide
0.006 g of sodium hydroxide
7 ml water

Solution B: 0.96 g Pb(NO3)2
0.04 g Dextrin
9 ml water

Solution B was brought to a pH of 5 by adding dilute NaOH.

Solution B was brought to 60 centigrades and solution A was slowly added
with stirring. The mixture was allowed to stir till ambient temperature was
attained and the solid azide collected on a filter. After washing with
water and air drying the product weighed 0.4 grams. This product was found
capable of initiating RDX when incorporated in a No. 6 blasting cap.

SMAG 12B/E5
March 14th, 2001, 01:11 AM
nbk2000, not wanting to sound like a "brown noser" but want I thank you for the excellent post on hydrazine sulphate. I have not run across that process and was about to search for a method as a precurser for azide. Thanks!!!

PHILOU Zrealone
March 15th, 2001, 10:06 AM
He Mr Cool:
Hydrazine nitrate is a very good explosive, more sensitive than ammonium nitrate and also much more powerful; the intriguishing part is its VOD near 8900m/s yes it is higher than every mix of AN even with nitroglycerine. But very very hygroscopic!
I have played once with it in a pipe of 1.5cm diameter and 20cm long for 5mm wall thickness and set off by a detonator made of silver acetylide nitrate/nickel nitrate hydrazinate (50/50)3g in a copper pipe (0.5mmdiameter,1 mm thickness wall on 4cm long) lighted by a fuse....it worked perfectly well what a BOOOOM...I heard the two screw caps making a SSSSsssssssss noise when turning fast while passing over our heads. I had put concrete blocks arround and over to prevent schrapnels and the upper block (20*20*20*50cm/5kg)was pulled over the ground at 1.5m and was broken in three parts....great stuff indeed but expensive to by or to do!!!

------------------
"Life that deadly disease sexually transmitted".
"Chemistry is all what stinks and explode; Physic is all what never works! ;-p :-) :o)"

Mr Cool
March 15th, 2001, 04:18 PM
That sounds very good!
Hopefully I'll try it this weekend. I haven't before because I didn't think it'd be worth it, but now I've changed my mind!

Microtek
August 18th, 2001, 02:14 PM
This is a quote from the website of a company called Syracuse Cancer Research Institute:

"Hydrazine sulfate has been demonstrated to produce only few and transient side effects. There have been no instances of bone-marrow, heart, lung, kidney or immune system toxicity, or death, reported. Hydrazine sulfate has never been demonstrated to be carcinogenic in humans. "

So the question is how toxic hydrazine nitrate is. Has anyone got information on this ?
And I don't mean hearsay or speculation only referenced info or personal experience.

Ezikiel
August 18th, 2001, 11:35 PM
One question ....
Can Hydrazinium Sulfate be prepared from Bleach and Household Ammonia soln. and Battery acid.
And can this NH2NHSO4 be converted to NH2NHNO3 useing fertilizer grade Ca(NO3)2 as I live in Canada so I can't buy much without being labeled as a "suspicious character".

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"Go out in a BLAZE OF GLORY"

Ezikiel
August 18th, 2001, 11:40 PM
Or do I need pure, the specified concentration reagents ?

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"Go out in a BLAZE OF GLORY"

cutefix
August 22nd, 2001, 08:48 AM
I think that you better re-read the heading of this topic and think about it,how to prepare this hydrazine sulphate.Try reading again Mr. Cools post in the same topic the procedure from FEMPEP.Think carefully how can you apply this info to your problem.Regarding Hydrazine nitrate that is the reaction if I mixed Hydrazine with ammonium nitrate.There are info about it somewhere in the forum archives,kindly check it again.......

Microtek
August 22nd, 2001, 01:26 PM
Has anyone managed to find a decent source of info on HN ? I'm mostly thinking of incompatibles and health data, and it seems that all the MSDS that I find, simply list the health data of straight hydrazine.
In particular, I'm interested in knowing about the compatibilities with metals and other explosives.
Also, I've noticed that there is quite a gap between melting point and boiling point. This could imply that HN could be cast, ideally with other explosives that could take advantage of the oxygen surplus.

cutefix
August 23rd, 2001, 01:48 AM
Well, there are few additional information in the net regarding hydrazine.You should check written literature about it.When I used it long ago I only know limited information about it.I just looked its properties in the chemist handbook and other chemical literature from suppliers . Anyhow it did not prevent me from using in liquid explosives experiments.I used the liquid form.I just took extreme care about its handling considering the fact of its extreme flammability , reducing ability(anhydrous diamine) and notorious toxicity.Somehow I was maybe lucky that I did not encounter accidents ,or not poisoned with it..Indeed it is a well known fact about its myriad incompatibilities,and this is what I considered in manipulating this unique material.I always use immaculately clean glassware in containing and blending things with it.For persons who may not be familiar with its properties check this out:
http://www.asi.org/adb/04/03/09/hydrazine-info.html
http://www.jtbaker.com/msds/h3557.htm

http://www.powerup.com.au/~draymond/space/umdh.htm
http://www.appbv.nl/hnf.html
www.unece.org/trans/main/dgdb/dgsubc/c3doc/9868c3.pdf (http://www.unece.org/trans/main/dgdb/dgsubc/c3doc/9868c3.pdf)

http://edetonator.hyperlink.cz/Astrolit.htm