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Nails
June 26th, 2006, 11:20 PM
I'm performing a chemical reaction involving LAH, and require a method to perform it in an inert atmosphere outside of a full chem lab. Can anyone help me with a link to a commercial inert atmosphere chamber or a method to create one?

Much appreciated

Alexires
June 27th, 2006, 12:11 PM
Depends how much cash you have and a few other things.

You could build your own chamber capable of reduced pressure, then vaccuum it and fill it with nitrogen, vaccuum it again, fill with nitrogen, then vaccuum it again and fill it with nitrogen.

Or, if you can't do that, just pump nitrogen into your reaction vessel. Hopefully, it will expell all the air, and you'll have an unreactive environment (for as long as your nitrogen lasts)

Otherwise

http://www.inorganic-chemistry.net/kmpages/inert.html
http://www.ilpi.com/inorganic/glassware/glovebox.html
http://www.181engineering.com/workstations/glovebox.htm

Google is your friend.

deadman
June 27th, 2006, 12:41 PM
Instead of vacuuming and replacing repeatedly, you could use water displacement. This really shouldn't be all too difficult.

Jacks Complete
June 27th, 2006, 07:53 PM
You probably don't want to use water displacement, as the water is anything but non-reactive, and you will end up with lots of water vapour.

I'd probably go for something like a CO2 atmosphere, or nitrogen.

You can get nitrogen for near free, dead easy, either by allowing liquid nitrogen to warm slowly and pumping the air out repeatedly, or by using a nitrogen laser feed system. This burns most of the oxygen, then bubbles through something to remove the CO2 and the last of the O2.

I don't know how reactive LAH is (or even what it is) but CO2 + N2 might be enough. You can do that with a candle to take out the majority of the O2, and then by reacting something like sodium with the remaining oxygen in your sealed chamber, no pump required.

nbk2000
June 27th, 2006, 11:33 PM
Water vapor from displacement would cause auto-ignition. Fail for that suggestion.

Carbon Dioxide might be useful, but the MSDS says not to use it for fire-fighting, and also says that contact of LAH with acids can cause ignition. Carbon Dioxide is a mild acid in contact with moisture, so if absolutely anhydrous, it might be useable, but maybe not.

Nitrogen is ideal, and available from welding suppliers cheap. Drying using a very poweful dissicant like sulphuric acid bubbler would be necessary.

Look up a copy of 'The Scientific American Book of Projects for The Amateur Scientist' by C. L. Stong. There's an article in there about cultivating bacteria that includes building a glove box.

A clear plastic trash bag, with a stick frame inside it, can be used as a simple glovebox. This is known as a 'glove bag'. Google it.

Though you don't need an inert atmosphere to handle LAH, just a very dry one.

Alexires
June 28th, 2006, 11:32 AM
I don't know how reactive LAH is (or even what it is) but CO2 + N2 might be enough.

LAH - I'm assuming Nails is talking about Lithium Aluminium Hydride. I know I've heard of it somewhere (drug related). Water is a bad idea.

If I remember correctly, it is formed under ether and is pyrophoric, so having it catch on fire would be VERY bad.

Here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_aluminum_hydride) for more info on LAH.

Get a glove box, or flood the area with nitrogen. They are probably your two best bets.

Bugger
June 29th, 2006, 08:36 AM
You probably don't want to use water displacement, as the water is anything but non-reactive, and you will end up with lots of water vapour. I'd probably go for something like a CO2 atmosphere, or nitrogen.
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I don't know how reactive LAH is (or even what it is) but CO2 + N2 might be enough. You can do that with a candle to take out the majority of the O2, and then by reacting something like sodium with the remaining oxygen in your sealed chamber, no pump required.
You cannot do that! Sodium burns in pure nitrogen, to form the nitride, Na3N. It may also reduce the CO2, at least to CO. The best choice of all would be argon.