Chemicals that should be stocked up

[iHME]

I have been more on the weapons side of E&W and I'd like to equip my lab for the future experiments and synths of the E. But These days sources for chemicals get smaller all the time. I'd like to know what chemicals should be stocked up to be certain that I will have them when I need them.

This thread could also then be used as a reference for other people on what should be stocked up. Also precursors for needed chemicals could be listed. It would also be useful to have a lab while studying as I'll probably end up as a chemical or electrical engineer. So what would one need for prolonged experimenting without the need to stock up?

My current shopping list is is pretty short (not in any particular order).

Sulphuric Acid
Sodium bicarbonate
Acetone
Sodium hydroxide
Ethytritol (the sweetener thats turned into ETN)
Phosphoric Acid
Nitric Acid (If able to aquire)
Citric Acid
Ammonium Nitrate
Potassium Nitrate
Nitromethane
Aluminum dust
Hexamine

And what glassware should be bought to get started?

[Alexires]

iHME - I would personally get the precursors to the major chemicals. So for instance, I would buy sulphur in bulk, potassium chloride, sodium chloride.

See, that way, you can always make HCl, H2SO4, HNO3 (from air), KNO3 (as long as you have electricity).

Glassware, I would get various distillation rigs as a start, various vessels you can do reactions in. Also, get a soxlet extractor so you can reprocess those solvents. That will be a must. If you are going to make what you have last, you will need to recover every little bit you can.

Also, I would recommend things such as carbon rods, PbO2, and other anode material (Pt/Ir if you can afford it), because you might not be able to get your hands on it later. With this, copper wire to use as winding, magnets, and other necessaries to generate power for use in reactions. Even if the world falls into darkness, you will have the means to make electricity (even if it is with a hamster wheel) and be able to use your precursors.

[-=HeX=-]

I reckon that the following should be stocked up on: Propylene Glycol, Ethylene Glycol, Hexamine, Sodium Azide, Sulphuric acid, Nitric acid, Hydrochloric acid, aspirin, ethyl and methyl alcohol, acetone, lead nitrate, a variety of other nitrates, nitro methane, glycerin, potassium permanganate, nitric acid, ammonium nitrate, erythritol, penterythrite (sp), high concentration peroxide, metal powders and (per)chlorates.

I would advise to get good distillation kit, lots of flasks and beakers of different sizes, scales, funnels, filter paper, separatory funnel, addition funnel, droppers, graduated cylinders, and reflux apparatus as well as a gazillion test tubes. I would also advise a gas mask and goggles.

[megalomania]

If you do plan to make your own basic chemicals at some future point, obtaining certain metals that are useful as catalysts, or that can be made into catalysts should be a priority. Platinum, palladium, nickel, tin, magnesium, tungsten, manganese, silver, zinc, cobalt, etc. These metals, and compounds of these metals, comprise the bulk of the most versatile catalytic substances. Obtaining these metals now will save on the future problems of getting them from nature.

I know nothing of geology, but I always wondered if it would be feasible to get some elements from my own backyard (metaphorically speaking). I doubt I can get every element, but I wonder what elements I do have available nearby in abundance. Now that backyard metalcasting and DIY high temperature furnaces seem to be coming into vogue, it is not so far fetched to plan for some DIY refining.

All chemicals come from the ground in one way or another, so it is not a completely far fetched idea. It will require a few pioneers to gather the basic knowledge and conduct the initial experiments to act as the spark to ignite other peoples interests. I never imagined you could melt metal in a microwave until I found a website that shows how to do just that, and now I am determined to improve on that line of research.

The rise of biotechnology is also something worth keeping a close eye on. It is a wonderful thing when a flask full of microbes can crank out sophisticated molecules with greater efficiency than a chemical factory. Fermenting ethanol is just the tip of the iceberg.

I see certain strains of algae produce algae oil that can be processed into petroleum compounds; indeed oil originates from ancient algae. The rising interest in alternative energy is pushing our society to develop smaller, cheaper, and efficient chemical processes that have the potential to put many difficult to obtain chemicals in the hands of ordinary citizens. These technologies have to be tested on the small scale first before being commercialized, so we can directly benefit from the simpler processes that are applicable for individual needs.

We have to guard against those who seek to take away our access to the knowledge of this technology. We independent experimenters especially need to embrace the new technology, we need to do things with it "they" never imagined possible. We still scramble around trying to piece together scraps of information from 19th century sources while the far superior 21st century knowledge is locked away from our eyes.

We have unprecedented access to tools and technologies not available to chemists even a few decades ago. We have a duty and a right to experiment with chemicals in any way we choose, and we need to exploit these new tools to our advantage.

Yes, a dark day is coming when we will no longer be able to purchase almost all chemicals, legal or otherwise. However, there is a glimmer of light that necessity will push us to develop new ways of making all of our chemicals. We must make the tools of the professional chemist affordable, accessible, and understandable to everyone. We must return to our pioneer roots, like the ancient scientists who had no chemical supply companies, they had to make everything themselves. Unlike the ancient scientists, we have tools and resources far beyond anything they could have conceived of. It is time for us to evolve.

[Alexires]

Certainly Mega has the right of it. Keeping up to date with the "cutting edge" as well as embracing the old techniques is definitely the way we are going to forge a bright new future for ourselves, or at least keep the darkness and social decay that oppression will bring.

To add to that list, you might want to think about stocking up on basic metals as ingots. They keep better than powders, and can be turned into powders later if necessary.

Aluminium, Magnesium as well as some old mini engine block parts (Magnalium) would certainly be a place to start. You would probably want to go for copper, iron, nickel, lead and other base metals. With this, you can make various metal salts as well as iron oxide for thermite if you ever need it, various flash compounds and lead compounds.

[Charles Owlen Picket]

In addition to the type of chemicals, one should also consider the manner & place of storage. If you can get a proper vessel such as a carboy to store your acids in a shed, that would be ideal as the manner of storage will affect longevity.

IMO - To determine what will be eliminated simply look at what is being dealt with at the moment....The efforts of the CPSC are strong because they underwrite what HS believes. Powdered metals simply won't be available in the next few years: neither will chlorate or perchlorate. Those who have perfected electrolytic processes for chlorate actually have a continual supply for a basic energetic. Sulfuric acid was eliminated from drain cleaner at the behest of Home Depot from a (near) house brand as Home Depot leads a small scale "Beware America" campaign within it's stores (shop at Lowes & fuck 'em!). If you can obtain ammonium nitrate and KNO3 in real bulk...do it NOW. The switch to calcium nitrate in bags and (AN) delivery only in truck-sized bulk has been completed. Because idiots have found out that ETN synthesis is simple we may actually see that sweetener off the market. Don't be surprised if it's pulled!

If however you do stock up remember a few VERY important rules. ALWAYS store chemicals safely to the point of compulsion. Learn what to store with what and what procedures are used in conventional labs. Certain materials are not to be stored together for specific reasons. Beware the fire could rage out of control from a small one contacting certain materials! Take care that children & pets are not exposed to any, even mildly toxic materials as over time even some low-toxicity salts could be life threatening.

Do NOT tell people about the materials or show them what a wonderful job you've done storing them....you will buy a nut-jacket so damn fast you'd think you've combed your hair with human waste. Use a degree of aplomb and taste when you do something of that nature. Consider others who may live with you or people who may stay with you. Panties and lead styphnate don't mix.

[Logic Probe]

Indeed, Charles, I had no idea how many inquiries I would get about why I have sandbags all around a couple of 30 gallon metal trash cans in my back yard. Well, where else would you store your oxidizers? And what if your fuses and stars and lifting charges got a spark in them? Yes, discretion is the better part of valor. Safe storage of battery acid and reloading powders has provided effective cover, so far. They just think I'm a safety nut, rather than a dangerous nut, so far.

[Charles Owlen Picket]

Because of the nature of this discussion, it's best to carry on specifics via a PM so that [by mere glance] no one does a disservice to an innocent attempt at maintaining perfectly legal materials, etc.

There are some pretty good, inexpensive ideas out there. Mostly it depends on what volume of solids or liquids one needs to store. If a fellow was a real pyro hobbyist and put together pro-grade shells, etc - that volume of oxidizer should be pretty large. There is also a trade off between concealment and access that IS a damn good open discussion.

The idea of concealment here is (in my mind certainly) not designed to "thwart oxidizer-cops" but to efficiently use space, protect them and the community or home, pets, etc. Concealment is a good idea for quite a few reasons. No one wants ammonium perchlorate in Rover's chow.

[SonnyDetox]

Yes, a dark day is coming when we will no longer be able to purchase almost all chemicals, legal or otherwise. However, there is a glimmer of light that necessity will push us to develop new ways of making all of our chemicals. We must make the tools of the professional chemist affordable, accessible, and understandable to everyone. We must return to our pioneer roots, like the ancient scientists who had no chemical supply companies, they had to make everything themselves. Unlike the ancient scientists, we have tools and resources far beyond anything they could have conceived of. It is time for us to evolve.

Amen brother :D The dark time is ahead (but we have so much more access to information now that its almost overwhelming at times). Necessity is the mother of all invention.I believe 100% that almost everything if not everything can be OTC. We need more forums like this one which isn't registered with search engines.

+++++++++++++

Please do not quote whole posts - The_Duke

[Jome skanish]

My bet for the future is there'll be a "line of succession" where useful chems are gradually replaced with less useful ones, and so it goes. Like how sulfuric acid drain cleaner here in Sweden turned into NaHSO4 which turned into Na2CO3... It can happen to you too!

With S and KNO3 you can make H2SO4 and HNO3, provided that you can improvise an inert chamber for the lead chamber process, and you have access to a still.

Without S, the even harder to outlaw CaSO4 would suffice in producing SO2, which would be turned into H2SO4. The only problem is, for each step the synthesis of what you need turns more into a bitch and you need more equipment to succeed. Thats why some chems today considered "easy and cheap" would be included in my list as "bulk chemicals"

Glassware is pretty damn hard to improvise so I'd put most of the money on that, then divide eqally between bulk and spec. chems.

Bulk chemicals would include S, NaOH/KOH, Na2CO3, K2CO3, KNO3, KCl, NH4NO3, Pb, Cu, Zn, Fe, Cr2O3, MnO2, LiCO3, CaC2, EtOH, toluene... Anything that is cheap and easily available with no questions asked and that could be useful in synthesising other stuff.

Less general chemicals worth storing would be bromides, iodides, iodine, phosphorus, salts of rare metals, palladium, platinum, tungsten...

Keeping everything secret? You'd need a villa out in the countryside and use it's cellar or an outhouse. As everyone have seen as of recently you can hide quite a lot in cellars.