Strength of several pyrotechnic (and HE) comps

[Newman]

Found this chart while digging through an article from the journal Propellants, Explosives, and Pyrotechnics. Several of the pyro comps seem strange to be listed as so, especially the three that are more powerful than TNT. Flash seems to have more than enough punch for breaking shells and its other uses, so the more powerful comps seem uncalled for. Unless that is, they are more stable and/or smaller quantities could be used to fulfill the same purpose, or they could be used for breaking shells without drowning out the colors of stars like flash does.

Is anyone familiar with any of these other powerful comps? The two that use AN and guanidine nitrate probably wouldnt be practical due to the complications involved with buying them, but ammonium perchlorate is relatively available. Since these are listed at pyro comps, is it safe to assume that they deflagrate and not detonate, so could be ignited without a blasting cap?

I've searched all over this board and the internet for any mention of them, but couldnt find any info. If nothing else, I hope the chart is interesting to some others as well.

[Jacks Complete]

You'll not be able to attach the chart. Probably best to stick it on a free host then link it in this thread, now I've approved it. Even if the link doesn't come up, one of the mods will sort it out for you.

As for the things you mention, there are several different threads on each of them. If you want to start playing with perchlorates, be very careful of metallic contamination. That's a starter for ten.

[megalomania]

When I saw this yesterday I didn't even see the link to anything, I let it molder in the queue hoping someone would figure this out. I attached it for you Newman.

It would be helpful to see the context of the article if you could provide the citation for which volume, issue, date, page number, author, and title this article is from. You can copy and paste the info from the abstract page at the publishers website:
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/26213/home

[Newman]

Propellants, Explosives, Pyrotechnics 15 , 115-120 (1990)
Pyrotechnic Flash Compositions

I could host the entire file somewhere if thats kosher, since you need to have an account to view the articles through that website.

Sorry about the attachment, I wasnt sure how they worked for new accounts. And not to be a total leech, but could someone with better search skills link any of the threads regarding these pyro comps? I was unable to find anything about explosives using ammonium perc as the oxidant, other than one article where it was mentioned offhand regarding flash.

[ChippedHammer]

I could host the entire file somewhere if thats kosher, since you need to have an account to view the articles through that website.

Mediafire is pretty good (http://www.mediafire.com/)

Avoid RapidShit (http://rapidshare.com/) if possible.

[Newman]

http://www.mediafire.com/?l5szm5xjsyt

Here is the link, the article is mostly about flash and dosent make any mention of the comps I was interested in other than in the chart I posted above.

[Charles Owlen Picket]

The problem with these tables are they don't give background test elements. I'm to believe that some composition with a oxidizer and aluminum is going to provide LB expansion greater than an established HE?

Yea, perhaps if you are comparing at gram-level or an enclosed deflagerant initiated with a cap. But generally, without test variables being documented, the tables are misleading.

[-=HeX=-]

Well... Maybe I have a theory...

Flash has a lower VOD than TNT. TNT releases all its energy in one go, very fast. At its VOD (6000m/s approx). That produces instant LB expansion. Flash, on the other hand, releases its energy slower. At approx 1500m/s. It produces a longer 'pressure wave', maybe causing more expansion, simply because the block is expanding for a longer time.

That theory is just an idea off the top of my head. It is probably wrong. I just thought i would throw it in for debate. Feel free to shoot it down.

[Bert]

See Tenney Davis COPAE for an observation regarding explosives with very high heats of explosion (such as Aluminized explosives) giving misleading results in Lead block tests.

[Setharier]

About the topic. I was thinking could one use pyrotechnic stuff to detonate sensitive HE like ETN and PETN? I am talking about ex. potassium chlorate mixed with 1000mesh al powder. That thing at least gives loud and sharp report. That way could it be used as primer material for ex. for cast ETN charge with mixture of 35:35:30 KClO3:Al:ETN powder as detonator?

[Lewis]

cast ETN charge with mixture of 35:35:30 KClO3:Al:ETN powder as detonator?

I've heard of "flash powders" using ETN before (usually with a quantity of powdered metal way above and beyond a good oxygen balance for an HE)

I assume you would like to use this composition to make a fuse sensitive primary, but I have my doubts about it. Still, try it out. (there was some debate about using conventional flash in detonators in the ETN thread, and the idea was generally shot down long before it could gather much momentum)

[funky monk]

As a rule flash isn't really used in dets, it doesn't have the power to initiate things like TNT reliably.

I wouldn't advise making chlorate flash and trying to make a cap out of it because of the extreme sensitivity of the mix, I would just stick with HMTD and AP like most people.

[Hinckleyforpresident]

As a rule flash isn't really used in dets, it doesn't have the power to initiate things like TNT reliably.

The purpose here is to discuss the properties of HE/LE compositions, and their potential use in blasting caps.

I wouldn't advise making chlorate flash and trying to make a cap out of it because of the extreme sensitivity of the mix, I would just stick with HMTD and AP like most people.

AP and HMTD are just as bad as chlorate/Al flash powder in terms of sensitivity.

[funky monk]

AP and HMTD are just as bad as chlorate/Al flash powder in terms of sensitivity. I'm aware of that, it's just that nine times out of ten the mix won't go off by hitting it so it can lure you into thinking that it is not as sensitive as people make out. I know that people who think these sorts of things shouldn't even be using this sort of stuff but they do anyway, it's better for them to find out straight away that something is sensitive and not to be messed with than to find out later.

Most people in their right mind will test a small sample of their mix to test it, if it is flash though chances are that they will end up with a bad result and think it is safe. I've seen people do it before and end up loosing fingers from it, what us "people" on the internet say means nothing to some people so I think it is best for them to have something which they know the inherent dangers of right from the start.

These are just my views, some may think otherwise