Iodine

[Cricket]

I read in the Drug Identification Bible (almost a walk through guide of how to ID what pills you just bought and how to make meth, heroin and much more goodies) that many methanphetamine makers get their Iodine by adding H2O2 to the easily available Iodine solution (in alcohol I think). It didn't give any percentages or concentrations. Does anyone have some info on this? BTW, I don't plan to make meth or NI3, just curious.

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"You will not be taught the knowledge you seek, you must teach yourself." - Megalomania

[This message has been edited by Cricket (edited 11-30-2001).]

[Zach]

it was probably referring to a solution of iodine. thats the only way ive seen it sold. the meth makers probably converted it into pure iodine crystals.
b.t.w, do you have that book in pdf format or what? i looked around for it on the web and couldnt find it.

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im sorry, that was redundant and stupid. ive only seen iodine in a solution sold by a local pharmacy under a "no-name" brand.
simply labeled "iodine" and then a percentage (9%????) of iodine, no brand name or anything. i think maybe the store bottled it. i dont know, it was a while ago. sorry again for the first redundant reply.
Z

[This message has been edited by Zach (edited 11-30-2001).]

[nbk2000]

They usually sell it as a "tincture" of iodine.

I believe it's a 9% solution of both potassium iodide and free iodine in ethyl alcohol.

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[ALENGOSVIG1]

2 pint 7% tincture iodine
1 cup of distilled water
4 oz of HCl
6 pints of 3% hydrogen peroxide

all mixed together, shake container, wait 30 minutes, an filter out crystals.

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[J]

You can get 500ml bottles of strong Iodine/K Iodide solution at agricultural places for vetinary purposes. Probably cheaper than buying from the chemist.

J

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[CodeMason]

Hehe, it's true. ALEN got that from a meth site. http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/smile.gif

NaI/KI is usually what's in the iodine tinctures, if not, this can still be bought in large bottles from the pharmacist.

2NaI + 2HCl + H₂O₂ --> I₂ + 2NaCl + 2H₂O

NaI + H₂SO₄ -> HI + NaHSO₄
HI dissociates at higher temperatures to I₂ and H₂. By gently boiling a mixture of tincture and sulfuric acid, and holding a cold plate above it (cooled in the freezer previously), iodine crystals should form on its surface. (Beware, heat and hydrogen vapours are enemies.)

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[Cricket]

Yes, that is what I mean, the addition of H2O2 to the tincture of Iodine. It has no other uses really besides NI3, meth, and fighting infection does it? Thanks. Oh yea, I don't have that book scanned or anything http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/frown.gif. You can buy it here http://www1.ecxmall.com/stores/texastacticalsupply/Search.bok?category=Narcotics+Testing if you really want it. Approx $40 USD. Very good book though.

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"You will not be taught the knowledge you seek, you must teach yourself." - Megalomania

[Lagen]

Its also a good catalyst for making chloroacetic acid (for nitromethane).

[Cricket]

Great, I will look into that later. I have never got to play with Nitromethane http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/frown.gif.

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"You will not be taught the knowledge you seek, you must teach yourself." - Megalomania

[A_W]

(As I hate opening new topics, I posted here since the topic is called "Iodine".) Anyways, I have a 50g glass bottle 1/3 full of solid iodine. It is capped with a plastic screw-cap, but it is the original bottle. I`ve had it standing along with my other chemical bottles for a while, and they got a brownish color. It obviously leaks from the cap. What can I do to prevent this? I`ve tried taping the cap, but it vapourizes right through. Is there something I can put around so that I won`t loose all my iodine? PS: I have a strange feeling that this has been discussed before, but all searches ended with no results.

[nbk2000]

Stick it in the freezer. The extreme cold will greatly eliminate the vaporization.

<small>[ April 14, 2002, 08:50 AM: Message edited by: nbk2000 ]</small>

[RTC]

Just put it into another glass container, with a glass stopper lid, should seal it in pretty well.

[J]

An almost ideal container would be one of those 'old fashioned' sweet jars. They're still sold in touristy shops, and up-market sweet shops.

[VX]

OK earlier on today I was bored. Whilst looking around for something (other than work) to do I saw a half empty 50ml bottle of tincture of iodine I bought a few moths ago. I remembered reading this post and decided to try to make iodine crystals, for particular reason other than to overcome my boredom.

I added the 25ml of tincture of iodine to a beaker, to this I added about an equal amount of H2O2. At this point the mixture started to froth and foam. At first I thought that the tincture of iodine had had a H2O2 catalyst added to it to make it impossible, or at least much harder, to liberate elemental I2 from it. However after a few moments the bubbling slowed down (Once the frothing had subsided I took a sample of the mix, and added some MnO2 to test if their was any H2O2 left, their was.). I added some HCl to this mix and mixed the solution. The solution was very dark red/brown, and looked almost black. Upon holding the beaker to the light I could see thousands of small crystals of iodine falling to the bottom of the beaker. I then left the mixture for half an hour. When I returned to the mixture I was shocked to see not only had the mixture turned colourless but also that their was no iodine crystals left... Where had they gone? Their was actually what appeared to be one tiny I2 crystal left at the bottom of the beaker and this was decomposing the H2O2, as it had a stream of bubbles leaving it.

I based my procedure very roughly on the one that Alen posted however I did not measure my chemicals. Is this why I ended up with no I2. As the solution turned colourless I assume that the elemental iodine that was present to start with reacted and was turned into one of it's compounds. I think that it may be possible that the acid reacted with the KI to liberate HI, but I think that I added less acid than it says, not more.

Has anyone got any ideas?

[a_bab]

Your iodine has obviously passed in solution under some salt form. BUT is you run in the solution a steam of clorine, it should precipitate again.

[VX]

Yeah, thanks for that a_bab.

I have just been back to the mixture (about 20 hours on) and the solution has gone slightly more iodine coloured again. The colour is not very deep but it is a browny red, although still transparent. Actually thinking about it the colour never completely went, but it was very much more pale than it is now.

Does anyone know why this happened?

[vulture]

Well, if it stood in light for some time, the iodine might have reacted with the water to form hypoiodate, much like chlorine reacts with water.
I&lt;sub&gt;2&lt;/sub&gt; + H&lt;sub&gt;2&lt;/sub&gt;O -&gt; HIO + HI

Bubbling chlorine through the mixture should fix this.

Does anyone know how to display subscript correctly?

<small>[ August 22, 2002, 11:56 AM: Message edited by: vulture ]</small>

[T_Pyro]

Er, my post is a bit late, but...
hypoiodate won't interfere much with the experiment. The concentration of a contrated solution of HOI is 6.4 x 10-6 mol/litre, and the solubility of I2 is 0.0013 mol/litre. If you took a million litres of conc. HOI, you would get about 6.4 moles of HOI!
Further, for the reaction:
I2 + H2O -> 2H+ +2I- +1/2 O2
the free energy change is +105 KJ/mol, which indicates that the reaction is thermodynamically not favoured, and may proceed in the backward direction, yielding iodine. Atmospheric oxygen can oxidise iodide ions to iodine.

[8bawl]

Hey people try this for your iodine crystals.

To 1 pint 7% or 9% tincture of iodine in a gallon jug was added 250ml dH20 and 30ml HCL then stirred. 1 pint of H202 is added slowly(over 7-8 minutes) with continuous gentle stirring until all H202 has been added. Let this solution sit for at least 20mins from the time you started adding the peroxide. After this 20mins the bottom of the jug was full of spiky iodine crystals. The fluid was decanted into another jug while the iodine from the first jug was repeatedly washed, then collected in a cloth filter. It was then compressed and smashed until bled dry of any dH20, wrapped in dry paper and placed in a jar with baked epsom salts to further dry. Now you can return to other jug and collect crystals that have precipitated there and wash, etc. Dilute 35% peroxide to 3% to give you a cleaner drier product.
good luck.

I have used the word Iodine all the way through this post when it should have been I2. Just to save any confusion.

[Mendeleev]

T_Pyro, adding heat favors an endothermic reaction. Subliming is another useful method of iodine purification, I use it for both iodine and paraformaldehyde. Normally I just put a small pyrex bowl full of ice over a 1000 mL beaker and heat it on a hot plate.

[T_Pyro]

Yes, I know that. What I said was that the reaction is thermodynamically unfavourable, which means that under the given circumstances, it's unlikely to take place.
Sublimation is an easy method of purification, but (IMO) somewhat wasteful. If you're using small quantities of iodine, there's no way of ensuring that all the iodine vapours are trapped... Solvent purification would be my choice.

[croc]

More extraction techqunies.
I found a site with pictures purification and all. The only problem is it is a little expensive using potassium permanganate. http://www.frogfot.com/synthesis/iodine.html
The person that made it is a member to this forum.

Reaction.
NaI + H2SO4 = HI + NaHSO4
2HI + H2SO4 = I2 + SO2 + 2H2O

BTW: Can anyone find a MSDS for HI, I can only find it in a solution?

[Pb1]

HI is a gas at STP, boiling at -35.1*C. Here (www.airliquide.com/safety/msds/en/071_AL_EN.pdf) is an MSDS. It's not that hard to find these things. Just type ["Hydrogen Iodide" MSDS] (w/o the brackets) into google.

[lumberjack]

Iodine Crystals are fairly easy to get from mail order chemical companies and their are no hazardous shipping charges (in the US anyway). You can expect to pay $40 to $100 for a pound but usually closer to the $40 mark, just search the web. Keep your orders to a pound or less and buy you some crystals and quit messing with all the bulls**t you have to gather and go through to make your own. They are just to easy to get to take any other route! :rolleyes:

[8bawl]

i just ordered a kilo from the vets as i use it for my race horses' feet when they get hoof rot from standing in the water all day. the price i pay is about 50-60 australian dollars per 100gms. it is readily available, just make sure you have your story straight when they ask why you want it.

[FUTI]

I think that adding exact quantity of acid is crucial. If solution remain basic, base will dissproportionate iodine in iodide and hypoiodate. Try first to acidify your solution if the colour reapears (which happens as you said on standing... CO2 from air is slightly acidic:)) you solved the mistery. You can try adding the base to iodine tincture and see will it start loosing it's coloration to test the kinetic of this process (iodide will make it slower then with pure iodine but you will have an estimate to start with). Only thing that can go wrong except this is that iodide oxidation didn't stop at this stage (iodine) and that it oxidise it to iodate maybe (this will happen with nitric acid for example)... in this case adding little iodide (in acid solution) will produce coloration. I don't know if the last thing can happen with H2O2 (to be honest I'm to tired to go and see the redox potential tables;))... but as you said that bottle is old and tincture (mixture of iodide and iodine) is not chemicaly stable (it will slowly go to iodine) which doesn't change it's use as microbe killer but could mess your stoichiometry. Check did that H2O2 has decompose completly before you start this experiments. For an effective end you can perform a effective experiment in test tube (over the sink please:D)... few drops of iodine tincture, 2ml of soap/detergent solution and 2ml of H2O2. This should produce a funniest soap foam escaping from your tube. This thread give me lot of pleasure since I'm looking for good experiments for kids soo you have my gratitude. BTW I think chlorine is bad idea it can oxidise iodine further... :confused:

[nbk2000]

I always forget something


Like using the RETURN key to make a paragraph?

Read the rules, that's all I'll say till next time.