Cash Dispenser

[stanfield]

got to http://www.geocities.com/stanfield999/ (maybe copy & paste) then download my file and give me your opinion...
or open the jpg with a soft like paint shop pro and draw the place of the explosive...

any reply is more than appreciated...

[BrAiNFeVeR]

I'd shuv as much as is humanly possible down the ticket slot:
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/61b828a6/bc/__hr_distrib-300a.jpg?bcQuuW8AAZBmfJzb

I figure, that the money comes from above, so there the major stash must be ... erh, behind the screen or something ?

But these things are probably very well protecte against these things ...

Most people in my country drive a bulldozer in the wall, and drive away with the entire unit, to get the cash out at home or something.

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"Mess with me, and you'll end up with a .44 under your chin and your brains on the ceiling"

[DarkAngel]

"Most people in my country drive a bulldozer in the wall, and drive away with the entire unit, to get the cash out at home or something."

I never thought that most Belgium people would do such things ;)

I think that all the money is kept far behind the the machine i don't think that you can simple blow your way to to the money.
But do you have plans :)?


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ÐarkAngel

For explosives and stuff go to Section1 http://www.section1.f2s.com And http://run.to/section1 (http://www.run.to/section1)
sendtosection1@hotmail.com

[This message has been edited by DarkAngel (edited 12-03-2001).]

[Madog555]

if you were to blow your way in you would probaly have to blow a hole to put more explosives in to blowe a bigger hole. this take to long though. there would be unwanted visitors there by the time u got to the cash

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"To live is to suffer, to survive... well thats to find meaning into suffering." -DMX

[mongo blongo]

If you are going to do what Madog said, use a shaped charge for the first hole.

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AAARRRRRHHH! My beautiful eyes! It burns!
The goggles do nothing!AAARRRRRHHH!

[vulture]

in the town i live in (also in belgium) they tried to blow up the ATM with dynamite, thereby ruining the building.
The only damage to the ATM was that the front panel was blown off, under that was an almost undamaged plate of metal.

Hacking these things might be easier then blowing them up without ruining the money...

How bout weaking it with thermite first and then setting of a heavy charge? Only problem is you'll have to wait for the ATM to cool down a bit to prevent the explosive from blowing up in your face.... or use a "throwable" explosive

[This message has been edited by vulture (edited 12-03-2001).]

[BrAiNFeVeR]

Vulture, could you add me to your icq ?
My number is in my details, or just search for my nick.

Or just give me yours ...

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"Mess with me, and you'll end up with a .44 under your chin and your brains on the ceiling"

[stanfield]

There must be a way to get back the money...
I haven't any bulldozer under the hand for now... :)

is the screen a weak point ? no ?

see ya !

[stanfield]

hey, vulture, do you know how to hack these ATM ?

[vulture]

Well, also in belgium (exciting country!), a russian hacker installed a miniature card reader in the card slot and a video cam on an ATM and he had hundreds of copied cards with the PIN! I don't know the specific procedure, but if you can get the electronics, it wouldn't be too hard.

I think it's more easy to open a restaurant and copy everyone's visa/mastercard....

BTW, a few months ago they also tried to blow up the safe of the furniture store Ikea a few hundred yards from my house...
Damn, dynamite isn't that old crap, my window shutters rattled like hell!

[stanfield]

don't you think that 200g of RDX (C-1) will break the tiny ass of this ATM ? (by positioning the charge where the bucks are given off ?

[vulture]

200g of RDX sounds fun, but you'll have to put something on it to deflect the blast wave to the ATM, cause i saw they use two layers of metal with air in between to tamper blast waves.

Maybe blowing off the plastic coating with a little charge and then throwing a highly concentrated mixture of perchloric, nitric and hydrochloric or sulfuric acid over it? This should attack the metal, and by the time it gets to the money you throw a satured solution of bicarbonate over it...
This will also destroy any fingerprints or DNA that could be used as proof.

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"I just need some tolene...tolyl? How you call that stuff mam, need to help my mother painting..."

[This message has been edited by vulture (edited 12-04-2001).]

[DarkAngel]

Don't you think that the bank is prepared against robbers that whan't to blast the machine open?
If they are refilling it with new money you always see them walk behind the machine to fill it.
vulture you methode sounds a bit kewl to me and IF this would work on metal you will destroy money,and when your still busy the police and other people would already be there.

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ÐarkAngel

For explosives and stuff go to Section1 http://www.section1.f2s.com And http://run.to/section1 (http://www.run.to/section1)
sendtosection1@hotmail.com

[nbk2000]

A bank that I used to have to go to once a month had a modern ATM machine. The back of the machine was visible inside the bank because the lazy bastards never bothered to keep the door closed on it.

The money is stored in a HUGE ass safe. You get it via conveyer. The money is like 5 feet behind the front end that you interact with.

The ATM manufacturers haven't been sitting on their ass while their machines get torched, exploded, towed, etc. They improve these things constantly.

I've got a very short segment of a show on VHS tape that shows the details of a modern ATM. It's only about 15 seconds or so long, but it shows a lot.

So forget trying it with the machines at the bank.

What you CAN do is yank the little ones out of gas stations and grocery stores. The ones that are about the size of a large stereo speaker.

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"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2ooo) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[CragHack]

like NBK2000 suggested, steal a little one from a gas station. Just throw it in the back of a pick up truck (with a cap over the bed to cover the unit) and drive it to a place where you can take your time breaking into it. But make sure you don't get a unit which has a transmiter in it so people can track its location. I have never heard of any ATM having a transmiter but do you homework and check up on the specific make of the machine just to be sure.

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"If you must, do it with intelligent people, at least they know how to talk to the cops."

[This message has been edited by CragHack (edited 12-05-2001).]

[nbk2000]

Even AFTER you steal it, it's going to be a tough nut to crack.

I was at work one day during the day shift when the Brinks people came by to refill the miniATM. The safe is proably inch thick or more of steel. The lock is made by some famous lock company (used to know who) that randomly changes everytime it's unlocked and is all electronic so you ain't going to hack it or break it that way.

Oxyacetylene, burn bar, grinding wheel, or explosives is going to be the tools you'll need. Hammers and crowbars ain't going to do jack shit.

And they're not light either. Figure on 400+ pounds. It'll take several strong people or a ramp and winch to get the bastard into your truck.

DON'T drag it behind you! Some idiots did that and the cops followed the tore up street right to the yahoos who stole one. http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

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"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2ooo) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[stanfield]

This ATM machine is in little town, the fisrt police station is in the next city at 25 Km and, in France, the police is not very agressive (see the informations...)

you think that the only way to get the money back is to attach the ATM to a truck and voila ? no possibility with explosive ?

WARNING, higher and around this ATM, there are homes...I don't want to explose to town like Toulouse...

[Anthony]

Reread NBK's posts.

You need time to open it without damaging the contents. Opening it on the scene is not the way to do it.

I don't think we have "small" ATMs in the UK, they all seem to be the big bastards. Even an inch of steel isn't really a problem, all it takes is time. Put it in your garage, buy a load of hacksaw blades and drill bits and you've got a new hobby to keep you going through the cold season.

[vulture]

Im very sorry Darkangel, but blowing it up sounds more kewl to me then to use something that doesn't make noise!
Besides, i said to keep a bucket of bicarb at hand when it reaches the money to prevent it from destroying it, and by then, most of the acid will have reacted with the metal to form salts.
Please read carefully before calling me a kewl, OK? Kewls don't even know what perchloric acid is....

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"I just need some tolene...tolyl? How you call that stuff mam, need to help my mother painting..."

[Machiavelli]

Well you certainly don't need to know the meaning of a word to use it. After all, anyone can pick up "perchloric acid" somewhere and use it without knowing the oxidation level of the chlorine in this compound or its pKs.
But I don't think that either acids or explosives will do the job.
If you've ever tried etching metall you'll know that it takes quite some time to get trough a thick solid metall block. And before you gain access you'll probably have a lot of acid that flows through small cracks and tiny holes and reaches the money before you. And in the process you'll probably cause enough short circuits and damaged wires to trigger each and every alarm the machine has.
The same goes for explosives which as an added benefit will wake up the whole neighbourhood.
If you can get diagrams of the machine it might be possible to locate drill points where you could defeat the mechanism using power tools and maybe a thermic lance.
Apart from that, just steal the whole thing and disassemble it at home or go for something less protected.

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Give someone a match and he'll feel warm for a few seconds, set him on fire and he'll feel warm for the rest of his life

[nbk2000]

ATMs are usually in the same places as deposit chutes. Rather than robbing the ATM with all the alarms and steel, rob the dude dropping off the days cash from the local store when he stops at it.

Much easier, less time, and risk. Using explosives would escalate a simple burglary (breaking the ATM open by hand) to a major felony, especially in europe since you'd be using RDX, a "terrorist" explosive.

I don't care how far from town you are, if someone calls in an explosion to the police, they'll be there ASAP. Same for a bank alarm.

A technical hack of the ATMs computer is possible, but requires more skill than either I or you possesses.

I HAVE heard of people buying old ATMs and rigging them to record the PINs and card numbers of people who try to use them. The ATM just gives a "Sorry, try again later" message while the "bad" guys make copies of the cards and take them to every ATM in town, draining the accounts. http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

Soundtrack for this post provided courtesy of Pantera.

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"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2ooo) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[CragHack]

You guys (and possibly gals... don't want to offend anyone) are hell bent on using explosives. This is not a viable option unless you really know what you are doing? think about it, how much RDX is it going to take to blow through an inch of steel or more? ALOT! in fact i would assume that (assuming you used enough RDX anyway,) you would be using too much. Explosives are very unpredictable. No need to blow the whole fucking thing up. Use an OXY-ACE torch to carefully remove the plate.

also, does anyone know, after you get past the thick steel plate what is behind it? i am assuming it is not the cash but a bucket, or a thin walled housing used to hold the cash in place right? so you would have to be careful with any type of exposive (you would also have to be careful with the torch, but that is a little mroe controlled). if you use even a little to much RDX (which is the example in this case) bam, there goes the goddies.

Also, does anyone know what types of internal alarms these things have? like if you try and cut through the plate will an alarm sound? that would fucking suck if there was an ear piercing shriek that you couldn't turn off until you got all the way through the plate to rip the fucker out. wow.

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"If you must, do it with intelligent people, at least they know how to talk to the cops."

[stanfield]

what about liquid nitrogen ? (I can buy this stuff in france...) I throw this stuff on the ATM then I heat this one with a blowtorch, the thermal shock is very high and "explode" the metal. No possible noise...

what about this idea ?

[Anthony]

"The money is like 5 feet behind the front end that you interact with"

So you've cracked off the screen/front panel with your LN2. Congrats. Now what about the other 5ft of shit?

I don't know why this needs to be keep being repeated - There is no quick on-the-spot fix to breaking open an ATM!

BTW, If I was oxying the thing open I'd first drill two holes through the safe and feed water into one (the other is to release the air). The money would probably get soaked but it wouldn't get burnt. Dunno how much it'd affect the ability of the torch to melt the metal, but the increased thermal disspipation couldn't be that much.

[Jhonbus]

A few observations I'd like to add:

We do have those "small" ATM's here in England, I have one in my local shop at home. It's about 6' tall and 18" square on floor space, and feels very flimsy. When you take money out, it dials up on a modem to some kind of ATM bank network thing. To me, this smacks of insecurity. Both hacking the system and stealing the whole module (it's not even chained to the floor) would be relatively easy with this kind of thing.

I don't know what kind of ATM it is that sends the money to the faceplate via 5' conveyor, but here in England, in shops and banks, they often have an ATM (full size) on an exterior wall, and the whole box of the ATM can be seen when inside the building. The boxes are maybe 4-5' square on the floor and 5' high. They are very bulky and you would need serious machinery to take away the whole thing. Getting it away from the structure of the building would be difficult too. They are connected permanently to some kind of network, so hacking them would also prove more difficult than the "mini" version. (ie you couldn't hack into the network itself; I don't know how possible it is to make a device like the one owned by John Connor in Terminator 2 :) )

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You must create.

PGP Key ID on MIT server: 0x0ADBA985



[This message has been edited by Jhonbus (edited 12-05-2001).]

[PYRO500]

the device jhon conner used in terminator is bs, the card has to be swiped to write data to it. the only thing way to cheat the thing at the source is to use a cloned card, the card has several things on it that can be reproduced, what several people on the news got caught doing was getting jobs at resturants and swiping the cards in their belt mounted devices before they swioed them for the bill, then they took the device and cloned the cards and used them till they were reported stolen after many K of dollars use, that is why they got caught. I think for door locks you could make a random number genorator and a record head that was small and hold it against the read head of a security door lock, might take a while though. I have herd smart cards are theft proof, sounds like time for a better theift, I bet they can be emulated

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visit my web page at:
[URL=http://www.geocities.com/pyro2000us/]

[Anthony]

Eevn if it does dialup over a regular phone line, it's still going to be at least 128bit encrypted. You'd need the correct protocols to communicate with the ATM too (I assume you'd pretend to be the host).

Are these mini ATMs filled by the guys that go round in vans collecting money from banks, or are they filled by the shop owner?(I guess it depends whether the ATM is owned by the bank or the shop owner) If it's filled by the owner then that's obviously the weakest link - mug 'im! They probably don't hold nearly as much money as the big ATMs though.

[PYRO500]

The quickie mart near my house has an atm machine inside and it isn't very big maybee 4 1/2 feef back from the wall, and I know it stops there beacuse the building is old and nothing goes beyond it. I may check what cords are hooked to this thing, I think the best bet is to get a small quickie mart like this one and find the tape vcr (for the security cameras) the one that is near where I live has the vcr up front with the cashier, a definite no no, 4 cameras but none of them are gonna make a diffrence if you take the tape. best of all the central office is very close to the site (they control the phones) and the phone junction box is right next to the store, in this case I would go in in the dead of night, cut the phone line, cut the power, take the tape and get the atm out with a dolly, into the back of a truck or something. then bury it in some hole in the ground and wait till after the investigation, I am not sure but I think ATM's have tracking devices, burying it in a 6ft underground hole for a while should let the battery's run out or remove evidence in case of a warrant incase such an ungodly thing happens. I know this sounds complicated but it will be worth it to not go to prision, nothing says I'm a theift than an empty ATM shell, you better ditch it somewhere where it'll never be seen again, for example if you did it in miami you could dump it in the everglades, they had a hard time finding a plane in that mess let alone an atm, the reason I am saying to take it to a secure location is that trying to crack it open on site make you stick around too long, something bad could happen and you could posibly leave evidence behind.

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visit my web page at:
[URL=http://www.geocities.com/pyro2000us/]

[mrloud]

In Australia we have small stand alone type ATMs in shopping centres. I watched while one was installed once. A small forkilft put it into position and then most of the volume of the machine was filled with lead bricks. There must have been about 1/3 of a cubic metre of lead in that thing. At 11.4 metric tonnes per cubic metre, that machine could have weighed around 4 tonnes.
Also, they don't make the machines with convenient carry handles. I missed seeing them get the ATM off the forklift. A few big guys could do it but I think it had jack down feet that are extended and retracted from the inside. One would need to tilt it up on its side to get a block of wood underneath. Once it is on blocks, one could get a fork lift under it or some slings to lift it with a crane.

[stanfield]

you said the money is behind 5 feet of metal ?
5 feet = 1m 50cm no ?
if this is correct, this is impossible, there can't be 1m50 ...

[stanfield]

hey, vulture,
you saw the ATM that they tried to break no ? what was his state ? how much explosive did they use ? which explosive ?

thanx...

[Anthony]

Yes, 5ft is approximately 150cm. Have you not ever seen an ATM installed in glass shop/bank front? They extend back a long way (they're almost "L" shaped) and don't forget that the money likely travels diagonally upto the user end.

[vulture]

Well, only the front panel was damaged, not the screen as far as I could see, but the fuckers tried it from inside, they first broke in to the bank! I think they just threw the explosives near the wall the ATM was standing, because there was a lot of blowout damage (glass sprayed over the street, roof blown upwards...)
They used mining grade dynamite.

I think if you use a well placed (that's the hole point it comes down to) RDX charge of approx. 300g you're gonna blow it to pieces (at least belgian ATMs)

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"I just need some tolene...tolyl? How you call that stuff mam, need to help my mother painting..."

[stanfield]

The ATM is in the bank wall... but lower, there is a mail box (in the same wall). I can pass my arms throug this may box and touch the below of the ATM...
what do you think about it ? (this wall is a big shit this is not ciment, I can break it with a martel or even with my punch&kick...)

any reply is more than appreciated

[vulture]

I suggest you search for any bolts or wall attachments in the mailbox, that are the weak points. You could try to put thermite in it to melt the bottom plate, but you'll probably burn the money IF you get through... Or maybe try the liquid N2 and after that thermite, takes a whole lot of time though i figure...

Does anybody know of which metals armored plates usually are made of?

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"I just need some tolene...tolyl? How you call that stuff mam, need to help my mother painting..."

[stanfield]

a friend wrote this e-mail to me :
"You need 1 kg of RDX at least! Probably more. But it´s not gonna blow the entire town, it will only destroy the bank, damage the buildings right across the street and break all the windows within 150 mtrs, that´s all."

What do you think ?
I think 1Kg of C-1 is crazy but not for him... who's right ?

[This message has been edited by stanfield (edited 12-10-2001).]

[Anthony]

I think it's already established that explosives are not the tool for job.

Even if that 1kg of RDX was made into an effective concial shaped charge, the sheer distance between the front panel and the safe would make it ineffective.

[stanfield]

have you read the "mailbox cheat" ?

[nbk2000]

I searched for any book called the "Mailbox Cheat" and found none in the english language.

Is this a french book?

What's the ISBN or publisher?

And what is in regards to? I'm assuming some kind of theft?

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"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2k) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[TheBicher]

Where I live there is one of those speaker-sized ATMs that doesnt look too heavy, once unbolted a job for 2 people. It doesnt seem like too much of a job to get the cash. But how easily is the money traced? I know banks trace their money, so it is probably easily traced. So, i wouldnt go out buying a new Car or big screne TV or something but instead using it on the streets or geting something less expensive. Also, about how much money do you predict is in one of these at a given time?

[nbk2000]

From what Ive heard, they hold between $4,000 and $10,000, all in brand new, sequentially serial numbered $20 bills.

I don't know if they record the serial numbers, but I'd assume so and react accordingly.

------------------
"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2k) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[Neil McCauley]

Ok, finally I'm able to reply (because there's no longer a register stop). The question raised by stanfield is very interesting: how to go about to get the money from an ATM using explosives.
Now, like Vulture already mentioned, in Belgium there was a gang who actually tried this. They were called the Maache gang ("De bende van Maache" in dutch). They started robbing armoured cars but changed to blowing up ATM's because of the increased security of the armoured cars. As far as I know they blew up several ATM's with succes and in the case Vulture refers to they failed because the police showed up and a shoot out resulted and the gang had to flee without the money.
So maybe it is possible to blow up ATM's and get away with the money. But I've got only small pieces of information about the Maache gang and it's not very reliable (maybe Vulture or some other Belgium can help me out here).
What I do know that IF it's possible to blow up the ATM you have to put the explosive against vault to blow a hole in the side or on top of the vault to blow off the screen and get to the opening on top of the vault where the coveyor belt exits. So you have to get inside the building (like the Maache gang did in Vultures city) and you need a lot of explosive.
Actually I doubt that's it's possible but to answer the question we need to know if the Maache gang did try it more than once and if they succeeded (if not so I think it's impossible to blow up modern safes like used with ATM's and would go for the other options mentioned).

[vulture]

Sorry Neil, but the gang who tried to blow up the ATM was not the Maache gang and there was no shoot out with the police.
They also tried to blow up the safe of the ikea which they also failed.

The belgian police rather shit their pants off than shooting at criminals....
In the ikea case, there were 2 explosions with an interval of 10min!
Guess when the piggies showed up: 15min after the last explosion!! But then they had to wait till the bomb squad had checked the building for explosives.....

Really, belgium is the best place for criminals, one of my neighbours had burglars in the house, he calls the police from upstairs:
-"Okay, we'll come right away sir."
15min later the phone rings:
-"Are the burglars gone?..Yes?Okay, we're coming"

hmm, can't get my smilies to work

[This message has been edited by vulture (edited December 14, 2001).]

[nbk2000]

Somehow I suspect that european ATMs are less robust than US ATMs.

After all, everyone knows that the US is full of criminals. :D

I'd make sense that the ATMs here have been attacked more often, in more varied ways, for a longer period of time, than have euro ATMs.

Thus US ATMs are more resistant to attacks. Natural selection at work. The weak perish and the strong survive to reproduce stronger offspring.

While it may or may not be true that the belgium ATMs were blown open, the fact that they had to do it from inside the bank, and apparently failed even then at least once, even after using enough to destroy a sizeable part of the building, shows that 200 grams of RDX is just a spitball against a tank.

Jack 'em when they're resupplying it. Much easier.

------------------
"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2k) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[Neil McCauley]

Ok, maybe it was not the Maache gang in this particular case, but I know the Maache gang tried to blow up an ATM in Rocour, which ended up in a shoot out with the police and one gangster was injured to the head. They brought him to a hospital were he later was arrested. In the article about this event it was said that the Maache gang tried blowing up ATM´s before (and probably with succes) because the armoured cars they used to rob became to difficult with the increased security. And with later arrests they seized kilo's of explosives and heavy weapons.
Of course it´s easier to ask for the money when they refill the machine http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/wink.gif but the question is IF it is possible to get the money out of the ATM with the use of explosives, and the answer will be revealed if someone can get some more information about the Maache gang and their actions.
Personally I´m a bit sceptic. Maybe if you would use some heavy linear shaped charges put on the side wall of the safe you can cut a hole in the safe but to get through a couple of inches safedoor seems impossible.
By the way, NBK you said you had a video showing details of an ATM, can put some pictures of it on the forum? (I have never seen the inside of those ATM´s and I am just curiuos).

[nbk2000]

I've been looking for it (sort of) but it's only about 20 seconds worth amongest a half-dozen 6 hour tapes. So go figure how many times 1/3 of a minute goes into almost 36 hours of video. Equals a lot. I'll eventually run across it and post it, even if it is a week or month down the line.

Anything is possible if you put enough research and effort into it. So, if you were hell-bent on it, you could eventually figure out a way to blast into an ATM. But with all that effort, you could have taken down easier, and more lucrative, targets.

Precious metals dealers, gem wholesalers, coin collectors, rich people with valuable collections, whatever.

To paraphrase Sun Tzu (and just plain common sense) "Do not attack where the enemy is strongest".

Being a smart criminal means attacking the soft underbelly, not the toughened hide, of the beast. Why do you think ATMs are so hard nowadays? Because the early ones were easy to break, thus every time they got broken into, the banks improved the design, making it harder and harder till only experts have a chance now.

Be innovative, creative, and original. That's how all the great heists are done. Otherwise, you're just another petty crook.

BTW, stanfield, we don't participate in criminal conspiracies here like ATM theft. We are a place of theoretical discussions and speculations about security breaches and failures for the betterment of society. http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/smile.gif

If someone takes that knowledge and perverts it for evil intentions, then there's really nothing we can do to stop them. http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/frown.gif

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"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2k) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[stanfield]

I never said I'm going to REALLY blow some ATM in France http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/smile.gif this just an exercice on how to place the explosive for maximum effect ...

When you beat (moderatively) the metal plate where the buck are given off, it sounds empty !! that's the reason why I though "If some gangster attack this big shit, they have all the chance to suceed !"

I really think that french ATM is a whole shit ! seriously...

[Teck]

I think this has been mentioned somewhere.
Try plugging all the holes with putty, then try filling the thing with water. Drill a hole for a charge where you have most of the water and try detonating the charge. I think it should work, at least it works for safes.

[FragmentedSanity]

Lo all :)

I just have ti ask if anyone has actually got anything worhtwhile out of this thread?

NO offence intended Stanfield... but do you have any idea about what your asking?
"can I use explosives to get the money from an ATM"
"No"
"but could I use them this way"
"No"
"but what about.."
"No"
"I know - what about liquid nitrogen"
"No"
etc etc ad nauseam

now if you still want to beat off over some flight of fancy involving kilograms of RDX themite and liquid nitrogen that all fit neatly down the card slot - be my guest, Go grab some mayo and do a propper job of it (thanks for the Tip NBK) BUt do you really need to fill the board with your rediculas prattle.
I have to wonder why this thread is still even open - are we just trying to see how k3Wl these people will make themselves look?
hmmm.. maybe offence was intended.
anyways - later all.
FS

[nbk2000]

ATMs have drain holes to prevent idiots from damaging the machine by pouring water into them. Also in case of rain leakage.

What you might try, would be injection of a foaming explosive that would expand to fill the cavity and not leak out through the drain holes.

Don't drill or torch a hole through it though, because either the heat or vibration sensor will be activated.


Instead, use ECM (ElectroChemical Machining). This is simply done by using a car battery as a power source, a hollow copper tube as the "drill", and a pump to maintain a constant flow of salt water flowing through the tube onto the target plate. You can recirculate the salt water by catching it with a funnel back to a resorvoir.

I believe the copper has the + hook up, the plate the - .

The electrical current erodes away the metal, leaving a hole.

Found this on a site about disarming UXOs and mines. Things like this are found by randomly hopping around the net.

Anyways, cut several such holes in different spots, pump in your foam, prime for simultaneous detonation and let rip.

Or, if you prefer speed to stealth, several small shaped charges to punch holes in the ATM for the foam. But this will take a minute or two off of the time you have to stay on the scene because you lose the stealth element. The alarm will start before you've even started with the foam.

------------------
"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2k) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[stanfield]

hey, FragmentedSanity,
is it stupid to ask ?

[FragmentedSanity]

well stanfield - that all depends on how stupid the asking makes you sound.

[stanfield]

And you, if you are stronger than everyone on this forum with you 24 posts, what would you do for this ATM ?

asking is not a fault...

[Neil McCauley]

The question if it is possible to get the money from an ATM using explosives is not yet answered!
I agree there's a lot of cheap talk and bullshit on the forum and people seem not really interested in getting answers to the questions asked. It seems to satisfy them just talking about explosives. As long as therms like "RDX" and "blowing up" are mentioned they think they are "participating" in the discussion. I guess it makes them feel cool or special just talking (bullshit) about explosives. If they are just kids I can understand that in a way but nevertheless they should go elsewhere.
Now, back to the topic. I am seriuosly interested in the topic and like I said the answer to the question can be found if some more information is found about the Maache gang, who actually did blow up ATM's in Belgium (and maybe France) some years ago.
So anyone really interested (and preferably Belgium) please help us out. And the rest shut up.

[nbk2000]

As you can imagine, details about security measures for ATMs isn't something readily available on the internet. This is all I found after several hours on the net.

http://www.newswire.ca/releases/April2001/17/c5162.html

"The system uses a range of internally-mounted sensors that have been carefully developed to detect any brute force, cutting, or explosive attack while providing a high degree of stability against false alarms. Any genuine attack will set off the note degradation system housed on the ATM dispenser, permanently marking the cash with indelible ink. Other parts of the ATM are not affected and the machine can be put into service following an attack."

Not even really of any value, is it?

And I'm certainly not a newbie to searching either.

What is more productive is searching patents for security devices that could be integrated into ATMs.

I'll try that later tonight.

I tried a search on the Maache. I got a couple dozen hits, all in belgium. So that didn't do me any good. Nothing in english about it.

Perhaps a search of usenet might yeild some stories.

Yes, there are some people who like to spout big words, but after several years of hearing it, I guess I've become desensitized to it. Sort of just background noise.

Given enough time, these people either come in line with the norm here and learn, or leave because no-one bites into their bullshit.

------------------
"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2k) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[This message has been edited by nbk2000 (edited December 16, 2001).]

[stanfield]

hey, Neil McCauley, If you have some Kalashnikov, why don't you come with me in France ? We could do the job a become rich http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/smile.gif

In these ATM, There are 100 000 $ when they are full and I know the When the Brink's guys come...

[Anthony]

Please provide actual examples of all the bullshit spoken on this forum.

Yes, of course it is possible to get the money from an ATM with explosives and is probably quite easy if you don't mind it in extra fine confetti form. Given enough knowledge, time and practise it could probably be done effectively. But success first go would be extremely lucky.

BTW No one has mentioned whether or not this Maache gang actually recovered the money successfully.

Now, I am not "really interested" in this idea, mainly because I think it is impractical. So are you going to tell me shut up? You've got a lot of brass for a guy with 3 posts.

[nbk2000]

What I want to know, stanfield, is why the words on the ATM keypad in the picture you posted AREN'T in french?

Amazing how much detail can be extracted out of a picture when I use the high end photo analysis software at my disposal.

As Anthony has stated, if you have enough practice, you'll get good at anything.

The question is, though, will you stay out of prison long enough to get the required practice? Because your first time could also be your last time if you get caught, which is always a very real possibility.

And the money isn't going to be right at the front. It comes through a conveyer from the HUGE safe several feet behind the front end that you interact with.

If you get access to that, then you've got a chance.

But even then, as noted in my above post, there may be a trick waiting to spoil all your work.

Also, have you ever thought of using this energy on a much more easier target like the change machines at laundermats and car washes? You'll get several thousand dollars in untracable bills. Just wait till the red "out of change" light comes on and attack then.

Quick hint, drill a small hole first and fill it with fire extinguisher foam first. Prevents the money from catching on fire. Learned this from a guy who torched change machines open for a "living". http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/smile.gif

------------------
"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2k) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[nbk2000]

What I want to know, stanfield, is why the words on the ATM keypad in the picture you posted AREN'T in french?

Amazing how much detail can be extracted out of a picture when I use the high end photo analysis software at my disposal.

At least you're getting the idea about the brinks guys and AK's, instead of the ATM.

As Anthony has stated, if you have enough practice, you'll get good at anything, even blowing up ATMs.

(BTW Anthony, he doesn't have two like the rest of us, but rather 3. And they're big and shiny brass 'uns too. http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/wink.gif)

The question is, though, will you stay out of prison long enough to get the required practice? Because your first time could also be your last time if you get caught, which is always a very real possibility.

And the money isn't going to be right at the front. It comes through a conveyer from the HUGE safe several feet behind the front end that you interact with.

If you get access to that, then you've got a chance.

But even then, as noted in my above post, there may be a trick waiting to spoil all your work.

Also, have you ever thought of using this energy on a much more easier target like the change machines at laundermats and car washes? You'll get several thousand dollars in untracable bills. Just wait till the red "out of change" light comes on and attack then.

Quick hint, drill a small hole first and fill it with fire extinguisher foam first. Prevents the money from catching on fire. Learned this from a guy who torched change machines open for a "living". http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/smile.gif

Neil, chill out dude. If and when we (the mods) decide it's appropriate, we'll close or delete this thread as needed. If you don't wish to participate, don't.

Also, this IS an explosives forum, so naturally there's going to be a lot of posts where explosives are mentioned. Just as if you went to a gun forum it's going to be guns, or computers on a hacker site.

If you wish to learn more about whether the ATM thing is possible, I'd suggest helping this topic along by finding some information to share here yourself.

We have had over the years (YES, we've been around since before '98, despite several moves and crashes, in one incarnation or another) numerous snooty people with bad attitudes who haven't contributed anything themselves, all while denigrating others who do, no matter how slight that contribution may be.

You seem like a fairly intelligent person, so don't fuck yourself off by getting on our bad side before you've established enough of a rep here to allow you to rip into others.

Seeing as how you're a newbie yourself here.

------------------
"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2k) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[Neil McCauley]

A lot of questions to be answered. First of all, I didn´t want to insult the wrong people, I am just annoyed that some aren´t at all interested in the topic and getting an answer to the question. And they are messing the whole thing up with their bullshit remarks for the people who are interested. And although I am new to this forum with only 3 posts and should be modest in my comments I think my critcism is just.
Now, of course I did an extensive search on the topic (the Maache gang, ATM´s, et.), but I didn´t find much. What I found is basically what I already told you guys. So I can´t enhance the topic further. That´s why I called in and hoped for the help of the Belgiums (where are you?).
Because the answer of the question asked by Stanfield (do you really want to know it or not?) can be found if someone can tell us more about the Maache gang.
And about the sensors dying the money red and render it useless when the ATM is attacked (with drills, explosives, other tools) is apparently not widely used (at least not (yet) in Europe) because it´s still possible to take the whole machine/safe with you and open the thing in the comfort of your own home http://theforum.virtualave.net/ubb/smilies/smile.gif (imagine how that must feel, I mean when find the safe full of money. What it feels when it´s empty because you choose thr wrong day I don´t even want begin to imagine how that feels).
Well that´s all I have to say right now. Hopefully I didn´t forget anything.

[nbk2000]

Vulture, Neil McCauley, and FragmentedSanity.

You three need to learn to play nicely with the other children, otherwise you can go to the HED room and sit in the corner by yourself, FOREVER!.

Obviously I can't leave for a minute without a flamewar breaking out.

Since nothing more is to be gained by this thread, it's being locked.

------------------
"I have begun evil, I shall end evil. That is the end that awaits me."

Go here (http://briefcase.yahoo.com/nbk2k) to download the NBK2000 files and videos.

[Argy]

There is something almost impossible to find but...

I saw some laser which can cut steel in a fraction of second, it don't make noise and it isn't big as you can think... so if you can find it, then you can probably use it (but the main problem is electricity, if you don't have an electric post close then i don't know where you can take enough electricity.

[nbk2000]

What an incredibly UNINFORMATIVE post you just made.

Absolutely no information whatsoever. Not where, when, who, why, or how you came about this startlingly revelation.

:rolleyes:

Back to the watercooler for you. In a week or so, you might be allowed back into the forum proper...if I remember to restore you.