Author Topic: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity  (Read 36043 times)

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Jacked

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #40 on: December 15, 2000, 09:11:00 AM »
[/quote]Perhaps my question got missed, or maybe I only DREAMED I asked, but how about adding some QUALITY to this post by expounding on the QUANTITY your talkin about.

How many drops
Interval between drops
etc



I can tell you what CM seen. He drops a couple and sweril the flask, as soon as the black breaks up and disapates he does it again Maybe 2 min between, add little more Naoh, swerl around abit, start driping 3% H202 again until eather PH starts milking or the black on contact quits, witch ever comes first, most of the time it's the Ph.


Another point of interest, FM will continue adding lye till the whole bottom layer locks up upon cooling. When peroxide was done, the layer became quite thick BUT IT WAS STILL LIQUID!

Quote


Your turn, Tell me what your yield was, & tell me
what the "BUT IT WAS STILL LIQUID" means. I don't understand. (Not a solid would be an assholes remarks) what would yours be FM?



[shit]Http://Gofuckyourself.com[/shit}

Worlock

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #41 on: December 15, 2000, 10:32:00 AM »
XS peroxide will tear up the molecule. It is worse in acidic solution.
The NaoH  is slowly added at a rate that prevents it from shooting out the flask.
The peroxide use is minimal, or dispense with it totally, maybe 10 drops / oz 
Some claim toluene to be superior to naptha.

Re-crystalization done at rapid speeds defeats the whole purpose, which is to form a crystal devoid of trash.
It is the slow digestion, that remodels the crystal and perfects it.
If recrystalized rapidly the crap gets trapped in the matrix of the crystal, and nothing is gained.


The fluids left over from the recrystalizing process are saturated with meth , but also contain high levels of toxins.
I have found that if the fluid is evaporated away, the dry material may be added to the next batch of meth to be steam distilled and this will clean it up.

It seems that steaming the meth is SWIMs standard approach , the purity is great, it takes more time(few hours), requires additional setup of equipment, but the result is well worth it.


Worlockium

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Runway/4986/two/start.html



Jacked

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #42 on: December 16, 2000, 03:18:00 PM »
If starting at 10 pH its not acidic so that's not a factor.
 
 Why do you answer the questian now, I asked it when you first posted this. No responce ?????  

 Why is toulene better, It doesn't even act the same, meth desoliving easer in toulene, never gets the movement through the repair liquid.

 As far as naptha being lazy, Heat makes it work better, I would use toluene if no heat was applyed

 20 or so batches later you answer a questian. I am happy with what I found out doing this on my own.
 
Were does recristalizing enter into this. ????



[shit]Http://Gofuckyourself.com[/shit}

fudgemonkey

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #43 on: December 17, 2000, 12:55:00 AM »
What I meant by "STILL LIQUID" was:

WHen extracting via A/b procedure, monkeys are very free with NAOH and stingy on dope. We heat the whole flask, slowly adding NAOH (dry, 1/4 tsp at a time, stirring till disolved) and looking for the "full indicators". With colemans, that means a thick refraction layer on top, an almost pea soup green color (the wall behind my fun with chemicals set is EXACTLY this shade, heh heh). On the last pull, the aqua layer will be quite obviously oil free (color once again) and THAT is what I was talking about. Upon cooling, the layer will lock up solid with sodium Iodide chrystals. After the same PROCEDURE, BUT ADDING H2O2, the layer remained liquid till I disturbed it, when it went Immediately to lock. I am wondering if this is the reason for the H2O2.

As for the tol being better thing, Monkeys suspect that local supplies have been tampered with. Monky set up with tol from reg supplier, and upon opening can, monkey smelled soething that shouldnt'a been there. Tol also left ash and what looked like tar on foil. bad batch ruled out as two other suppliers showed the same type of impurities.

Anyway, while the idea of adding h202 IS an interesting one, it seems that the reasoning behind this one still remains a mystery. The emulsion free layering is obtainable simply by using better filtration previous to this step.

Step up to the fudgemonkey.

fudgemonkey

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #44 on: December 17, 2000, 01:31:00 AM »
rats, missed a couple in my haste.


& tell me
what the "BUT IT WAS STILL LIQUID" means. I don't understand. (Not a solid would be an assholes remarks) what would yours be FM?


Not a solid, of course .... :P

As for yield, monkeys stay in the early 70's on RP/I pretty consistently. Typical yield of 3 Oz + a few monkey treats from 130. Didnt really see a lot of difference in the YIELD, but I think I may be on to something about this one, and I dont think its about yield. Gotta tap the ancient repository of cooking lore. Right down the street from Pop-eye.... hows THAT for coincidence....?

Jacked, e-mail me "myname"@ziplip.com, I got a private 411 for ya'. You DO remember my name, doncha?

Monkey added the perox gradually, didnt count drops, but would estimate  about 70 or 80 (works out around 20 per O)

As stated, you keep adding those drops for a while and it dont look like much is happening. Then you add that final couple drops and BAM! All hell breaks looose and the dope JUMPS into your naptha. It's really quite a show.

Jacked, I'll answer other ? for you in PM.


*  Rollin' , in a stolen,
Five point O. (mustang 'vertible)
Top down LOW-
'cause his homey's got B.O...



copyright 2000, funkymonkey productions


Jacked

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #45 on: December 17, 2000, 02:52:00 PM »
I get it now FM " not a solid " hahaha, the rest was not ment for you but thanks, I do notice the same thing you have so I guess I'm in the groove.
The outcome is cutting the groove, thats for sure.
I'm tyired of this already need to start making bills themselves, no forum for that & its too easy.
 
 


In the beggening there was man, God seen man needed a partener, so God made Speed

SuperAssman

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #46 on: February 14, 2001, 08:50:00 PM »
in reply to:
___________________________________________________
because of the nitrogen =NH they are capable of hydrogen bonding a very strong, ionic bond with water, mediated mostly by the activity of Chlorine, or sulfate,or whatever anion is being used.
___________________________________________________


SWIM is messing about with Pfed sulphate and would like to know if the sulphate moleceule is OK to have in thr rxn.
Most bees using sulphate use the freebase, and SWIM was advised that advise had been given by Worlock in some old thread, not to use sulphate in the rxn.
In the above excerpt from the famous "Kerplunk" tome, Worlock would seem to assume that the sulphate might bee used in the rxn. Is it OK or not??


Aint chemistry FUN?!

Jacked

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #47 on: February 15, 2001, 07:03:00 AM »
H202 kills off the unreacted E and weak broken molecules from the RXN, It obvious does not hurt the meth molecule at a Ph of 9 to 10 because of yields of excellent gear recovered.

Toluene, does not work as well as naphtha, Kids have tried it out, Now the kids do use toluene on the 2en & 3rd. pull because they are done cold afterwards.

I herd that the sulfate ion interferes with the production of HI. I don't know though. I guess you know about A/B'ing and making an Hcl out of it. Its nice to do an A/B with the sulfate, I have never seen a more cleaner, or easer A/B with this stuff sense there is no deterrent added as of yet in this area.


The Underground Hive lives on "UH"

SuperAssman

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #48 on: February 15, 2001, 11:02:00 AM »
in reply to:
_________________________________________________
I guess you know about A/B'ing and making an Hcl out of it. Its nice to do an A/B with the sulfate, I have never seen a more cleaner, or easer A/B with this stuff sense there is no deterrent added as of yet in this area.
________________________________________________

Well yeah, in theory, however SWIM has never had satisfactory results when A/B'ing Pfed. Probably just the small scale he does things on.
Anyway, SWIM wonders if the HCl salt could bee formed directly from the sulphate by adding Calcium Chloride to aqueous Pfed sulphate?

Would the sulphate bond with the Calcium and crash out as insoluble Gypsum?

Would the HCl salt of Pfed then form in the solution?

And if so, would the same processes take place when done in methanol?


Aint chemistry FUN?!

mr_pyrex

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #49 on: February 15, 2001, 12:23:00 PM »
The following is only a educated guess and may not be entirely correct, but I am fairly sure that wouldn't work...re-Calcium Chloride, etc..  You can use any form of Psuedoephedrine as a source for your precursor,in the case of Sulfate...neutralize the sulfate salt by dissolving in H20 and then bring up the ph and extract and lastly reform the HCl salt by your preferred method.  And to answer the question as to whether or not you could use sulfate in the rxn....If it is a reaction involving HI as in push/pull....NO it can't be used in that reaction, if you want a successful reaction.  I don't remember the exact scientific explanation, but I can defintely remember that it WILL NOT work.  But you can gather pfed from any beginning source and then just use the freebase form or form the HCl salt.  Pyrex out

SuperAssman

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #50 on: February 15, 2001, 01:16:00 PM »
in reply to:
_____________________________________________
neutralize the sulfate salt by dissolving in H20 and then bring up the ph and extract and lastly reform the HCl salt by your preferred method.
____________________________________________

Erm, yeah, SWIM knows about A/B'ing, but like I said he just ain't very good at it with pfed at his scale.

in reply to:
___________________________________________
whether or not you could use sulfate in the rxn....If it is a reaction involving HI as in push/pull....NO it can't be used
___________________________________________


Yes, this is SWIM's predispostion too, the thought of rotten egg gas etc. However SWIM's curiousity was piqued by Worlock mentioning sulphate in the Kerplunk text in the context of originating from Pfed sulphate.
Searching the archives for info on this matter would bee a mammoth task, maybee Worlock could clear this issue up?

Oh, and regarding the CaCl2 precipitation of the sulphate/formation of the HCl, SWIM is confident enough to give this a go. His interest in this method was initiated by an old post by Osmium where it was stated that mixing CaCl2 with Copper Sulphate in solution would precipitate CaSO4 and create Copper Chloride.
SWIM is still reaerching this a bit but thinks it would would happen as a metathesis reaction.
Shall keep you updated.


Aint chemistry FUN?!

SuperAssman

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #51 on: February 15, 2001, 01:57:00 PM »
Update:
Haven't done experiment yet but SWIM is now 99% certain it will work. He went to www.chemindustry.com and searched for Metathesis.
Yippee, all the info in the links are singing the right tune so far. ;D


Aint chemistry FUN?!

mr_pyrex

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #52 on: February 15, 2001, 10:17:00 PM »
Well if indeed it does, just goes to show ya that there is always room for improvement to one's knowledge.  By one's knowledge I do mean myself.  But I just couldn't see any kind of reaction with just those varibles mentioned.  I'll be interested to see if things do work out, good luck.  Pyrex out of knowledge

PVnRT_NC8

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #53 on: February 15, 2001, 10:29:00 PM »
well most excellent posts this is worthy of a print out first though I shall study all this data thankyou this all looks very very helpfull, I ma very very pleased with the direction this thread is most worthy of some study' man if we could get to this point every time we could start selling moon plots to developers?  GOOD WORK ALL!!!! ;D 6-1221


Amethystium

PVnRT_NC8

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #54 on: February 17, 2001, 11:08:00 AM »
Allrighty have comprehended the dir of the thread......um this bee uses um dexsulfate um pharmo ussually sticking to the thirty mg reaction per ussual, this he does um ussing no water ussing instead meoh tone and white gas he thinks there is something in this gas to mainly copper and some ammonia making this gas look bluish, other than this there may in fact be added to this whit gas some a largish amount of co it seems this also will turn to a bluish hue.  Anyways ussing most dry salt mainly cacl the idea is to basicially issolate the amine from the garbage binders etc to create the cl ssalt if this even be possible.  Now upon reading he dare not differ from the advice or recomendation only to say hoho is used in very small amounts not big ammounts rembering this is a small reaction 30mg in about four cup reaction vessel.  thus anyways he starts to do a basic "CURE" prewashing the junk, then and this be done hot, accidently sometimes the other solvent is used on ocassion.  Anyways the is rinsed in hot meoh then hot tone sometimes these are used rather together to keep the amine from going into the meoh, anyways the dex sulphate is supoprisingly insoluable in just about anything and alas a new easy water extraction is perfected more on that later.....anywas then hot gas is ussed to rinse, um all this is saved in threee bottles, and further use is sometimes used rectcled the dirt is removed by freezing the stuff a wax like shit comes out and also simply letting it sit then some crap sometimes falls out simply pouring of the top seem to clean it up[the solvent] anyways it is desicated dry crackling dry a few times, it never is done the same way twice

so there is a mixture of tone and meoh to this is seem to be added a bit of lye maybe a few grains mostly though threre is a goodly amount of cacl added throughout even durring washing steps, anyways it is heated up until it does in fact snow down from the np layer in nice snow flakes, then it is allowed to cool and slight swirling seem to lap up the good stuff into rocks, there is before this final stage, it the entire reaction is cooled before the final addation of a few grains of naoh, what happens in this prefinal stage is that the entire is gassed per foil and cacl and salt/muratic thus it the stuff is gasses and allowed to stand overnight, this is when the milky layer results it is semi solid looking milky and smeels different sweetish, this heavy solvent is "loaded" then anyways it is reheated up a bit of lye or most preferably I hate "lye" I prefer to use washing soda made from baking soda thankyou!

Anyways upon reheating the soup maybe adding a bit of fresh solvent, the stuff like laps up into the non polar layer the emmulsion clears the stuff the bottomerost layer mixxing compleatly the phases begin to become one solid phase except for a tiny film that being mostly salt on the bottom and a tiny film of oily looking stuff upon that on the bottom the rest basicially bubbles and compleatly mixed it is now that it is turned off removed from heat this is stirred by hand to....now swirling the entire it happens just like a commet smashing to earth, slam the stuff heavy stuff the clorosolvent hits heavy laden with salt first, as this heavy solvent hits the amine can be see popping out flating boyant upon the clorosolvent looking like popcorn, or wax like, yes it grows clumping together like a magnet attracts metal fillings, never the less the lower layer gets biger and bigger not turning milky cause it is hot still, ya add cacl untill it is saturated hot, maybe adding a bit of naoh to salt it out I think not shure, it is not a fussy procedure to figure out it will though take at minimium ten times to perfect to any degree of perdictiabality]
good luck!


Amethystium

SuperAssman

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #55 on: February 18, 2001, 03:32:00 AM »
in reply to:
______________________________________________
add cacl untill it is saturated hot, maybe adding a bit of naoh to salt it out
______________________________________________


Damn, it's hard to decipher your posts FMan.
Anyway, SWIM did a little experiment with Pfed Sulphate and Calcium Chloride. He did a water pull of the Pfed pills and added DampRid(Calcium Chloride). Problem was, he was a bit "tired"(like 3 days tired) and made slight molar miscalculation of amount of CaCl needed. He added about 100 times too much!
Precipitation of presumably Calcium Sulphate was observed. This was filtered out and certainly exhibited the physical properties of Gypsum.
SWIM knew at this point that he had overdone the CaCl, so he decided to do an A/B to remove excess CaCl.
When NaOH was added massive amounts of fluffy white marshmallow stuff precipitated. He assumes this was Calcium Hydroxide. This really glugged things up, so SWIM abandoned things at this point.
SWIM will try again with correct amounts of chems when he gets a chance.


Aint chemistry FUN?!

GED

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #56 on: July 27, 2001, 05:24:00 PM »
For the Bee looking for "Ker Plunking", here it is.
Shit Howdy, Everyone :-)

readyeddie

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #57 on: July 27, 2001, 09:26:00 PM »
Swim would have to agree with placebo.If the starting material was clean and pure to start with why mess with something else that would not be needed.Swim steam distills his pseudo in his hydrodistillation setup.The end results is no gakk when extracting the meth base only a mirror image everytime.The yeild and the quality of the product is outstanding.The answer to the gakk problem is steam distilling the pseudo nobody likes adulterated product.

The only way three people can keep a secret is if two of them are dead!

Jacked

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #58 on: July 28, 2001, 12:57:00 AM »
It's the answer to more than meats the eye.....

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Jacked

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Re: Ker Plunking for quality and quantity
« Reply #59 on: July 28, 2001, 09:04:00 PM »

If the starting material was clean and pure to start with why mess with something else that would not be needed.Swim steam distills his pseudo in his hydrodistillation setup.The end results is no gakk when extracting the meth base only a mirror image everytime.The yeild and the quality of the product is outstanding.The answer to the gakk problem is steam distilling the pseudo nobody likes adulterated product.




No one likes shitty yields either, You must be doing pretty good with steaming pseudo, what's your yields and maybe a method of steaming, Last I knew there were 5 or 6 good bees working on steaming pseudo with, In my openion not satisfactory results.. One more thing were do you think one using this presedure is getting an adulterated product, 
I'll put it like this. SWIM is getting 70% from pill extraction that is clean but not that clean, Now SWIM could A/B after that with an 85% recovery of the 70% mind you. After that get a 60% return after the RXN "STEAMING" I might add...
As it stands SWIM starts with his 70% and after the RXN and this method of extracting gets as of yesterday 73% return, The product is METH, nothing else nothing adulterated, Just plane old product, You can agree with anyone you like, But don't sit there and tell me I have an adulterated product when you have never even tryed the process out. That's just plane stupid, I know you are smarter than that.


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