The Hive => Newbee Forum => Topic started by: grellobanans on January 04, 2004, 09:09:00 PM
Title: TMA-2 Reduction Questions
Post by: grellobanans on January 04, 2004, 09:09:00 PM
Swim was looking at the reduction of nitropropene via Uruishibara Catalyst. Would nickel sulfate be able to take the place of the chloride salt in equimolar amounts? As long as it's soluble right?
Swim also found another reduction involving zinc/formic acid and it looks a lot easier (and better yields). But the writeup uses the tma-2 nitroPROPANE. Is this a typo? can the nitropropene be reduced this way?
and finally, is the nitropropene stable under careful storage for several months?
Edit: Swim is also wondering what the difference is between the Uruishibara Catalyst and raney nickel? They seem very similar...
Title: Nickel sulfate
Post by: Chewbacca on January 05, 2004, 04:20:00 AM
not that im #1 by any means when it comes to nitrostyrene chem, but what what ive read i believe that nickel sulfate could be substituted in a urushibura type reduction. as long as its soluble, yes. you will also require more of the sulfate salt of course because NiSO4 is only about 1/3 its weight in nickel wheras NiCl2 is about 1/2. NiCl2 shouldnt really bee a problem to obtain for you, just visit an electroplating store, NiCl2 is avaliable in crystaline form or in solution.
i believe the nitroproPANE the writer is referring to is the same chemical as your nitroproPENE, it can be reduced in the same fashion the writer describes.
nitropropenes will polymerise after a few weeks of standing, you can extend their life by storing in the freezer.
Title: NiCl2 can be made by dissolving NiO ...
Post by: gruns on January 05, 2004, 07:16:00 AM
NiCl2 can be made by dissolving NiO ****SLOWLY**** in the appropriate amount of muriatic acid. The reaction takes a minute to get going, but it will eventually. I suggest 5ml scoops every 4 or 5 minutes. I dumped something like 40g of NiO in the right amount of 31.45% HCl and got sprayed with foaming green acid for my trouble. Yeeeowch!
Baking off the water also takes a very long time, even at 400F.
Title: Why??
Post by: sYnThOmAtIc on January 05, 2004, 10:27:00 AM
Nickel chloride is a very common salt and has no suspicion attached to it's purchase. I suggest you purchase a small home electroplating system to store alot of your exotic metal salts with. You can buy bags of NiCl2 quite cheap from any electrochem or even lab chem supply without questions.
I was under the impression that nitroalkanes begin to degrade within hours. I wouldn't suggest storing any of it. Just make time to react it all, or don't make so much to begin with. Make what you need store the precursors.
Title: NitropropENE and nitropropANE is not the same...
Post by: josef_k on January 05, 2004, 11:12:00 AM
NitropropENE and nitropropANE is not the same thing. To get the nitropropANE you have to reduce it with NaBH4 first. You can not reduce a nitropropENE with zinc.
Title: squick
Post by: gruns on January 05, 2004, 11:33:00 AM
Yeah, but the pottery supply store didn't ask questions either.
At least, none that I couldn't answer.
Title: Ahhh, I see.
Post by: sYnThOmAtIc on January 05, 2004, 02:06:00 PM
I keep forgetting about them damn pottery stores!!! I need to go have another looksee at mine. I forgot that it is useful for more than just lithium carbonate and celite.
Sorry dude, I thought you were ordering your NiO! I fogot that there was an OTC source for that!
Title: READ
Post by: hest on January 06, 2004, 10:20:00 AM