The Vespiary

The Hive => Newbee Forum => Topic started by: Plus_four on August 31, 2004, 06:09:00 AM

Title: Rare chemicals???? Could you take a look at this?
Post by: Plus_four on August 31, 2004, 06:09:00 AM
Hello, I am a total stranger to chemistry, but I am aware that many industrial chemicals can be used to make various substances. I have compiled a small list of some available chemicals I can get. Could some one please tell me if any of these is hard to come by or usefull:


-Acetone
-Polyimide
-N-Methyl Pyrrolidinone (NMP)
-Titianium Isopropoxide
-White phosperous powder
-Blue phospherous powder.
-Petroleum Ether.
-N,N Dimethylacetamide.
-Ethyl Hexenol.
-"Penair"


Thanks for any information that could be provided.

Title: Read & UTFSE
Post by: abolt on August 31, 2004, 06:15:00 AM
As a "total stranger" to chemistry, I advise you to touch none of them. Some of those chemicals are deadly, if handled incorrectly.

Title: I handle these chemicals properly everyday, I...
Post by: Plus_four on August 31, 2004, 06:56:00 AM
I handle these chemicals properly everyday, I just do not know if they are valuable for substance making.

Title: ?????
Post by: abolt on August 31, 2004, 07:01:00 AM
You handle White Phosphorous every day (100 mg can kill a person)?

.......are you telling me that you handle P4 everyday in your workplace, and yet you lack the knowledge of what else it can be used for?

Title: either way no one will answer your question,...
Post by: 12cheman12 on August 31, 2004, 09:43:00 AM
either way no one will answer your question, UTFSE.

Title: Ethanole/Shit mix
Post by: DoctorFeelgood on August 31, 2004, 12:14:00 PM
Hi guys! In my country it's not possible to buy methanol without a special license - which i do not want to get, because they will come and look if stored correctly...
Ethanol costs the double price, but there is also a much much cheaper stuff available, which contains mostly ethanole and some other shit (some denaturated alcohol made of some woodshit, extremly bitter), so that an alcofix can not drink it. i thought it might be easy to distill out the ethanol, but i thought maybe first ask some of you guys, if this is an good idea or not. I don't know exactly with what stuff they mix it, so i do not know how this extrashit will react during synthesis. Otherwise no problem, i will spent the extra money for the 98% Ethanol in the pharmacy...
Thanx in advance,
DF
Title: Probabbly Not
Post by: Rasputin on August 31, 2004, 12:23:00 PM
If its a mix of more than one type of alcohol, you wont have much luck distilling, the BP are only a degree or two apart. If it not more than one alcohol, maybe you can, it depends on what the other shit is. I belive you can look-up the number on the side of the can to find out. Depending on what your doing with the alcohol, you might be able to just use the denatured shit(the ethanol is usually denatured with methanol,but sometimes its other shit to).

P.S.  What country do you live in that wont allow you to have Methanol, just curious

Title: :-)
Post by: hest on August 31, 2004, 01:34:00 PM

Blue phospherous powder



That a hard one to get, but iff you doo I would love a picture of it

Title: i guess he means violet phosphorus
Post by: hypo on August 31, 2004, 02:21:00 PM
dunno if you're joking, hest, but violet phosphorus does exist.
from webelements.com (i guess this is violet phosphorus??):
(https://www.thevespiary.org/rhodium/Rhodium/hive/hiveboard/picproxie_docs/000528414-file_axmi.jpg)

Title: blue/violet P??? interesting...
Post by: ApprenticeCook on August 31, 2004, 03:11:00 PM
blue/violet P??? interesting... wonder what it does, may look into that...
i thought there was only white, red and black... cool! Learn somethin every day!
Well as its been said i agree with abolt... dont touch it if you have no idea about chemistry... read books and stay alive! then and only then once you know everything you need try something....

-AC

Title: Where
Post by: Plus_four on August 31, 2004, 05:38:00 PM
I work at the production end of a company, and thus I do not know alot about what I work with. Is there more than one kind of blue or white phospherous powder? Because I defidently have white and blue phospherous powder, and you guys make it sound good. What is the street value of this? They come in white plastic bottles not sure how big maybe around 500ml??

Title: Pviolet structure
Post by: hypo on August 31, 2004, 06:20:00 PM
that's (part of) the structure of violet P:
(https://www.thevespiary.org/rhodium/Rhodium/hive/hiveboard/picproxie_docs/000528414-p.gif)
of course the atoms are Ps and the O is another of those 1D-structures.
(source: wikipedia.de)

Title: Could you maybee post a picture of this blue...
Post by: Lestat on August 31, 2004, 09:42:00 PM
Could you maybee post a picture of this blue phosphorus powder? red, white, violet, scarlet, and black are the usual forms noted, there are several crystalline modifications of red phosphorus.

In addition, I have heard tell of a brown form, and a glassy grey type, although only passing references.

I DID hear mentioned in passing, of blue phosphorus, and also to a green modification made by supercooling white P vapour at a very high temperature to about -200 in liquid nitrogen.

(I need not add, do not try this at home folks :) )

Title: *ll*
Post by: hest on August 31, 2004, 10:26:00 PM
Funny how a post can turn into something different when somone try to be smart (red me).

Guess i Own  Plus_four a anser
Title: What this "rare" chemicals are.....
Post by: java on September 01, 2004, 12:14:00 AM
Well read the info on each one and judge for yourself as to their use and potential for harm if mis-used......java

Acetone.....

http://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/chemicals/chem_profiles/acetone/basic_ace.html?print (http://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/chemicals/chem_profiles/acetone/basic_ace.html?print)



Polyimide...

http://www.efunda.com/materials/polymers/properties/polymer_cat.cfm?MajorID=PI (http://www.efunda.com/materials/polymers/properties/polymer_cat.cfm?MajorID=PI)



N-Methyl Pyrrolidinone....

http://www.kemi.se/kemamne_eng/nmetyl2p_eng.htm (http://www.kemi.se/kemamne_eng/nmetyl2p_eng.htm)



Titianium Isopropoxide.......how it's used no info on goggle

Polymer-assisted deposition of metal-oxide films

Q. X. Jia, T. M. McCleskey, A. K. Burrell, Y. Lin, G. E. Collis, H. Wang, A. D. Q. Li, S. R. Foltyn
SUMMARY: Metal oxides are emerging as important materials for their versatile properties such as high-temperature superconductivity, ferroelectricity, ferromagnetism, piezoelectricity and semiconductivity. Metal-oxide films are conventionally...
CONTEXT: ...the solution during processing, although the hydrolysis can be slowed down by introducing acetylacetone into titanium isopropoxide. Even more challenging for sol–gel processing of complex metal-oxides is the identification of a......
Nature Materials3,  529  - 532  (01 Aug 2004) Letters

White Phosphorus.....

http://pearl1.lanl.gov/periodic/elements/15.html (http://pearl1.lanl.gov/periodic/elements/15.html)



Blue Phosphorous...(blue is a variationof black and violet )

http://pearl1.lanl.gov/periodic/elements/15.html (http://pearl1.lanl.gov/periodic/elements/15.html)



Petroleum Ether....

http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem99/chem99515.html (http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem99/chem99515.html)



N,N-DIMETHYLACETAMIDE....

http://www.itcilo.it/actrav/actrav-english/telearn/osh/ic/127195.htm (http://www.itcilo.it/actrav/actrav-english/telearn/osh/ic/127195.htm)



Ethyl Hexenol.....Aroma chemical, organic synthesis feedstock

Penair.......

http://www.setonresourcecenter.com/msds/docs/wcd00031/wcd031d2.htm (http://www.setonresourcecenter.com/msds/docs/wcd00031/wcd031d2.htm)



Title: Here is an extensive list allthough not ...
Post by: Lestat on September 01, 2004, 12:28:00 AM
Here is an extensive list allthough not complete, asto the allotropes of phosphorus, there is next to no information on some of these forms on google though. Credit goes to one of the members of sciencemadness, although I can't remember who, but credit to the person that did upload this to scimadness :)

(https://www.thevespiary.org/rhodium/Rhodium/hive/hiveboard/picproxie_docs/000528414-P_allotropes.jpg)

Title: ammonium phosphate i think its called
Post by: Plus_four on September 01, 2004, 07:05:00 AM
ammonium phosphate i think its called

Title: Ammonium phosphate is better known as ...
Post by: Lestat on September 01, 2004, 07:17:00 AM
Ammonium phosphate is better known as fertilizer, AFAIK its useful for fertilizing, and shit all else, you mentioned white P, WP can be converted to red P by prolonged heating, just was RP can be made into WP by the same heating.

Bee carefull if you try though, it needs to be heated for a day or so in a hot flame, in a sealed borosillicate glass container, remember WP has a lethal dosage of around 50 mg, and if you use a metal container, the metal could react with the WP to form phosphides that liberate EXTREMELY toxic phosphine gas (PH3) on contact with moisture.

Title: huh?
Post by: hypo on September 01, 2004, 09:25:00 AM
> (blue is a variationof black and violet )

http://pearl1.lanl.gov/periodic/elements/15.html (http://pearl1.lanl.gov/periodic/elements/15.html)



this site says nothing about blue phosphorus?
and i wonder why all english publications treat violet phosphorus as a variation of the
black form? they are quite different!

Title: I think violet phosphorus is made by ...
Post by: Lestat on September 01, 2004, 04:07:00 PM
I think violet phosphorus is made by recrystallising white P slowly out of molten lead with a trace amount of sodium,

I think that is the way to make violet P, although it leads to scarlet phosphorus if I remember it correctly.

Title: Titanium isopropoxide
Post by: yei on September 07, 2004, 10:47:00 PM
I think is used, perhaps with aluminum alkyls, to produce a polymerization catalyst for plastics manufacture.