Author Topic: 5-HTP-->5HT?  (Read 7136 times)

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Synergetic

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5-HTP-->5HT?
« on: August 08, 2004, 10:32:00 AM »
Hello Everybody,
Swim would like to know whether or not serotonin can be successfully synthed in a flask? Now, Im sure this has been done before, in research laboratories, perhaps swim should have asked whether it was possible to synth in a clandestine lab, utilisng fairly basic equipment.
Say if one were able to extract 5-HTP from Griffonia Simplicifolia seeds, (which wouldnt be easy to isolate due to various indole derivatives present in seeds) then wouldnt it be theoretically possible to decarboxylate the 5-HTP into 5HT(Serotonin)? Perhaps a mannich reaction would be sufficient to achieve this, perhaps not? If not, then im sure there must be another way to decarboxylate, in a flask.
Of course, if it is possible to synth, how would one go about administering the serotonin to the body...it is harmful to ingest and inhale, plus it is irritating to the skin.
These faults however, are nothing compared to the side effects possible from increased levels of serotonin in the brain. Swim assumes the process would be more of a 'fun' experiment, rather than a business venture!  :P
Of course, the thought of having 'psychedelic essence' available is far too seductive indeed, so delivery routes would make good conversation as well as ideas pertaining to the initial synthesis. To all a good night, speak your mind!


phenethyl_man

  • Guest
Your post is very puzzling to me, since you...
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2004, 12:36:00 PM »
Your post is very puzzling to me, since you seem to have some chemistry knowledge yet seem to lack common sense; although that's not to say that one implies the other.  The answer to your question is yes, it is easily done, but my question for you is "why?"

First and foremost, this is far from novel and perhaps you should do some more searching around before posting.

In addition, why in the world would you extract 5-HTP from seeds when it's already available in almost pure form from about any health food store; even if you live in a third-world country obviously you have internet access and that should be enough..

That being said, 5-HT doesn't cross the blood-brain barrier, so let's just say the delivery route would involve a needle overcoming this little road block for you.  Of course, serotonin has no need to do such a thing on it's own, since the reaction you are referring to already takes place inside your brain.. so why the burning desire to perform it externally "in a flask?" (why you put so much emphasis on this is beyond me.)

Besides, simply raising serotonin levels in your brain would be far from a psychedelic experience.. why do you think SSRI's are not all that fun?  Hallucinogen's work by *selectively* activating *certain* 5-HT receptors in the brain.  FYI, there are also receptors on serotonin-releasing neurons which are called "autoreceptors" or "presynaptic receptors", which are activated by serotonin itself, and thus, when agonized, will actually decrease serotonergic transmission in the brain.  They act primarily as a feedback mechanism for maintaining the homeostasis of transmitter levels.  You see?  Your brain is smarter than you think!
Well, maybe...

My suggestion if you want a little 'psychedelic essence,' is the following;  once you figure out your synthesis of serotonin, do some more research and devise a synthesis, "in a flask" of course, that adds two little carbon atoms onto that nitrogen (the one at the end of the aliphatic chain of course!)  After that, inject a grams worth into your arm, I promise it won't even irritate your skin!


PharmDelight

  • Guest
5HT = Cannot pass through the blood-brain barrier
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2004, 09:50:00 PM »
5-HT = Cannot pass through the blood-brain barrier; hence the use of 5-HTP => 5-HT.  You can bang 5-HT until you have tracks, it won't go where is needs to be - in the brain.

Synergetic

  • Guest
So i see...
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2004, 01:14:00 PM »
Well i guess that rules out self-administration, not a big issue though as the primary focus is obtaining serotonin in the first place, think of it as something to do.
I was aware that 5-HTP was available commercially, but the seeds are more interesting in my opinion. Neurotransmitter from nature, kinda has a nice ring to it, wouldnt you say?
Just FYI, Phenethyl_man, the reason emphasis was put on 'flask' was because the majority of 5-HTP->5HT decarboxylation procedures i saw, were indeed completed inside the brain. I found no mention of 5HT being synthesized in a flask, nor did i find literature indicating whether or not 5HT would make it past the BBB. For the record though, underneath the thick layer of sarcasm, i did find your post rather informative and for that i thank you. Ironic isnt it!
Okay then, i wont waste anymore time, I have gathered all i need for now, so i will retreat back to my den and see what i can come up with. Good night.


phenethyl_man

  • Guest
I apologize if I came off as an asshole in...
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2004, 07:04:00 AM »
I apologize if I came off as an asshole in that post (I'm sure I did, I was having a bad night.)  If you really wish to pursue this, here is a link to several decarboxylation procedures of tryptophan to tryptamine, and they should work just as well for producing 5-HO-tryptamine (serotonin) as far as I know:

../rhodium/chemistry
/tryptophan.html

.  The copper chelate process is extremely easy and uses nothing that can't be found over-the-counter.. Good luck..