Iso-safrole question, and Safrole freezing info

[technology]

Hi bees,

Secret Squirrel decided to freeze her Sassafras one sunny day. The sassafras SS decided to freeze was Sassafrass Albidium. O.k SS froze 500ml than another 500ml Sassafras Albidium SS thinks is 85-90% safrole. SS froze all in two sections and ended up with a much lighter piss color than the original piss color (darker).. SS decided to refreeze to see if she could get the pissy looking color more like water clear etc.. however upon refreezing and then defrosting the color stayed the same.. so SS thinks that it is at its purist form already, and the only way to get purer is to distill which SS will do..to be sure of purity. SS has got just over 900ml Safrole she thinks which is much lighter than the ~100ml of dark piss.. so SS thinks that the Sassafras Albidium is in fact ~90% safrole. which would correlate with the 85-90% purity of the natural oil.

SS is fairly sure that she has the goods, but would just like confirmation from fellow bees.

the crystals formed were axactly the same as those on the posted previously on the hive..shards long, sorta like those from supermans home..the movie.

what do you bees think.. also the smell is no where near as strong as the dark piss stuff, this smell is really mild.

i thank those for the imput.. as this may help other bees also with their freezing. i am aware that someone previously post a sim post, but i does not answer SS ?

Also SS noticed as she tried to freeze the remains the crystals got much smaller in size therefore she thinks that this is a sign of lesser purity?

O.K bare with her this is no ordinary nut collection..

SS has another quesiton, why would you use Iso-safrole instead of Safrole..why is this so? does it increase yeild? SS is concerned as she wants the best nut collection out there...

Secret Squirrel appreciates all the help.. and thanks thoses that help..

SS has also conducted many searchs and has come up with nothing that is relevant to her search for prize winning nuts..

once again thanx BEES"

[Rhodium]

SS decided to refreeze to see if she could get the pissy looking color more like water clear etc.. however upon refreezing and then defrosting the color stayed the same.. so SS thinks that it is at its purist form already, and the only way to get purer is to distill which SS will do..to be sure of purity.

Really pure safrole (from fractional distillation) is practically colorless, and has a high index of refraction (tends to act as a rainbow prism at the liquid/glass and liquid/air interfaces.

the crystals formed were axactly the same as those on the posted previously on the hive..shards long

Correct.

also the smell is no where near as strong as the dark piss stuff, this smell is really mild.

Correct. The smell is also "purer" and more pleasant.

Also SS noticed as she tried to freeze the remains the crystals got much smaller in size therefore she thinks that this is a sign of lesser purity?

That is probably a correct observation.

SS has another quesiton, why would you use Iso-safrole instead of Safrole..why is this so? does it increase yeild?

Huh? It is as simple as that some syntheses require safrole as the starting material (such as the Wacker oxidation) and some require isosafrole (Peracid oxidation/Pinacol rearrangement) for the procedures to yield MDP2P - if you would use the wrong isomer in any of the procedures you would get zero or very low yield of the desired product, and mostly unwanted byproducts.

[technology]

thanks for the info Chief BEE.

much appreciated

[abolt]

The remaining "piss colored" solution, that is left over from a double freezing process of "Sassafras Albidum", has a strong Camphor smell.

P.S. Always define Sassafras, Safrole, Isosafrole by gram weights and not mls.

[abolt]

does any BEE get safrole that refracts light

YES!.............._{or so I'm reliably told}

[technology]

i mean from frezzzing, safrole that refracts from freezing

sorry

[Rhodium]

The answers to the questions you ask are so blatantly obvious that I'm not sure that you actually ARE asking what you seem to be asking...

1) Of course safrole refracts light, as does any translucent liquid.

2) Safrole has a relatively high index of refraction, so by purifying it (for example by crystallization), you will end up with a very refractive liquid...

Was that all?

[technology]

i am aware that Safrole freezes, but i was unsure that whether it would fefract light from just the freezing process..whether it would be pure enough, obviously not as SS found out just form freezing.. and is now aware that you must also distil..me thinks for better purity..

i am merely making sure that SS has all the information correct...

2) Safrole has a relatively high index of refraction, so by purifying it (for example by crystallization), you will end up with a very refractive liquid...

Rhodium' i SS did not end up with shit that refracts form freezing even though it looks exact to the pics on the hive..as SS said, she thought that she would refreeze to get better purity, and upon doing the second freeze there was no change in color.. so SS thinks, that it is at its best already, and the only way to get the safrole to refract is to distil..

thanks for the help, Rhodium

[pooky]

was a quite good post on freezing & crystals in the last week or so.And if in doubt,distill.

[methyl_ethyl]

Let's not get too carried away with refraction, If you think your safrole is impure, distill it.  The refractive index of safrole is not something you can just judge with your eye alone.  So let's just keep things simple.

     If you have a substance that you think is purified safrole, and does not refract light at all, either you are not exactly sure what refraction means, or what you have is not safrole.  If your substance that you think is safrole did not refract light at all what you are saying is that it was almost opaque, (ie. visible light did not pass through it at all).  Is this what you are saying?

     Sorry I am not understanding your question very well...

[technology]

SS was concered with the purity level, as SS decided to refreeze and defrost the color remained the same.. a light piss color compared to the dark piss color of the oringial oil..'

SS thinks refract means that light will bounce of the liquid.. though this may be wrong...

perhaps SS better go look it up somewhere..

thanks bees

[methyl_ethyl]

SS thinks refract means that light will bounce of the liquid.. though this may be wrong...

     What you described would be reflection.



     What we are talking about is refraction.  Here is a definition and a picture.

Main Entry:   refraction
Pronunciation:   ri-'frak-sh&n
Function:   noun
Date:   1603
1 : deflection from a straight path undergone by a light ray or energy wave in passing obliquely from one medium (as air) into another (as glass) in which its velocity is different
2 : the change in the apparent position of a celestial body due to bending of the light rays emanating from it as they pass through the atmosphere; also : the correction to be applied to the apparent position of a body because of this bending
3 : the action of distorting an image by viewing through a medium; also : an instance of this

Main Entry:   index of refraction
Date:   1829
: the ratio of the speed of radiation (as light) in one medium (as a vacuum) to that in another medium

     The refractive index of safrole at 20C is 1.5363-1.5385

[technology]

Cheers, M_Ethyl'

much thanks to you, SWIM will go back and have another looky to see..

much thanks.. for those that helped