little smoke in LWR?

[JUMPER]

SWIM is trying his first LWR with a 2000ml flask. His amount of goods falls into Rhodiums flask size chart well. The ratio is fb:1,I2:1.25,mbRP:1,and dH2O:.8ml per gm fb.
   Added them per Whereami's post of fb and I2 first, then dH2O, then after liquid added MBRP. SWIM then took from ice bath to slowly heat over two hours to oil bath temp of 120C.
   SWIM did get some white smoke throughout the increase in temp which was nice, however also got some yellow heavier smoke for about 10-15 seconds during oil to shake to ice bath again for cool. SWIM has read this to be RP fire and reacted asap.
   SWIM has been hot now for around 10 of 36hr stretch. Did the short RP fire in flask change time for SWIM's LWR?
   From what's been read here at the hive, SWIM thought he wouldn't have any worries like this, but is trying to equate it with the size batch possibly or because the MBRP was on top? Wareami don't tell me if I would have used 1ml of dH2O per gram it wouldn't have happened either! Ha Ha 
   What should SWIM look for if he wanted to drag a 48hr out of this or what might need to be added or changed?
   Oh yeah, pseudo cleaned per Tetra trap with Scottydog's extras, MBRP cleaned per Rhodium's site for cleaning, and I2 is prill.

[wareami]

The yellow smoke was reacted upon hastily and incorrectly.
Red, purple, or darkish orange smoke is not a good sign and one should look to remedy this ASAP before things get out of hand when it occurs.
JUMPER JUMPED the gun at the first sign of Good Yellow Colored Smoke!
Oh well....What was done to remedy this ASAP(I'm afraid to ask... )...?
If more h2o was added then reset the alarm to go the full 48hr...
If it was just taken off heat til smoke died down then just let it cook steady temp with stirring or swirling at 6-8hr intervals.
Also, the order in which ingredients are added should incororate thorough intimate mixing inbetween each addition and at the end! This way no large concentration is centered in any area of the flask and we'll see no more suggestions or insinuations such as MBRP beeing on top....Right? Okay...thought so!

And with the LWR, there is no need for the IceBath in the beginning because the ingredients are sufficiently diluted with the dh2o that prevents a fast takeoff.
Ibee says, Just let it cook!
Ohhhh....and no bombmaking this time!

[JUMPER]

So white and yellow are both okay all of the time? I know I read some elder bee talking about yellow smoke being a RP fire, is it bad to a quick P/P? SWIM just cooled it for a little bit and slower warming to 120C. SWIM knows It's not suppose to need an ice bath to start but doesn't trust these little precursers at all!
    Will it need longer now to complete since SWIM (not JUMPER!) jumped the gun with the smoke?

[wareami]

Just set it and forget it except for the stir/swirl times.
Yellow in any rxn isn't a significant worry.
Just reddish or darker!
And this usually won't occur unless the ratio of MBRP to E is equal or better.

[Jacked]

I've seen so heavy colored smoke and some hot fast starts but never have I seen a flask fire. A fire needs O2 to burn and I don't think there is very much in the flask at this time.. Even if that is not the case I still have never seen a flask fire....

[JUMPER]

I researched to find where I saw about the Phos fire in flask and it was at Worlocks meth synthesis page under REACTIONS, at Rhodium Drug Chemistry Archives. It does say that the thick yellow or darker is a fire in the flask, but I appretiate the updates!
    SWIM now has the two different maroons, one very light and the other dark, however the light colored one that was kind of like a film on top is now also seeming to stick to the bottom of the flask also even with swirling every five to seven hours.
    Is this a problem or can it be because about a third of MBRP is in it's third reaction? Proper cleaning's were done in between and never appeared grey.
    SWIM needs to be finished during certain time in day and took much longer to get started at 120c. Will it hurt to add a little more I2 to take off some hours or would it be better to just slowly add more heat to get to PACMAN bubbles for finish? Already well over 24hr stretch but maybe a little too much dH2O for under 36 to 48!
    Appreciate the help from knowledgeable bees!!!

[geezmeister]

The smoking was likely caused by having good mbrp in excess in the flask, and all your iodine. I add less mbrp when I use it, and add the I2 in portions if needed to prevent smoking. I think everyone develops a method they are familiar with and enjoy, and follow it.

The smoke you saw was not a problem.

I had a flask fire in a coffee pot years ago when I was doing very dry type reactions and mixed some good I2 with some fresh lgrp. I couldn't get the smoking thing out. I almost got the fire department called because of the smoke. After that, I made sure to mix my ingredients with a little water before having I2 and rP both added to the flask.

I think with that size flask, and a condenser, 120C oil bath temp may be a little too low to heat the contents of the flask to just below 100C. The combinations vary a lot, and the flask size, reaction size, how well the condenser is working, etc-- all have an effect on inside temp. You should check it with a thermometer if possible. If you do not have a thermometer, adjust the heat until bubbles cover roughly half the surface of the solution in the flask. The flasks I use and the size reactions I run seem to show this much bubbling just before 100C.

[JUMPER]

SWIM knows he didn't add the precursers the way you did. But since he used your water ratio and cook time to wareami's after that thread debate between you two, SWIM took his method of adding precursers and still fucked that up!
   SWIM just trying to give props to both of your techniques.
   Wouldn't third time use of MBRP make the reaction need more?
   Thanks for the advice on the flask size and it makes sense to turn it up a little and watch since SWIM is  running out of time!

[wareami]

I've seen so heavy colored smoke and some hot fast starts but never have I seen a flask fire.

I have never seen a flask fire either in the numerous hot/dry fast rxns that Ibee has run. Not in the literal sense of the term. But thanx to Jacked's and Worlock's early teachings and words of wisdom, two were avoided by taking their advice. The suggested ASAP remedy was to quench the improperly ratio`ed rxn with dh2o. Loss was suffered during the short time it smoked heaviest purple.
It was pretty to watch...but I'd rather watch a lava lamp after a hit or two of purple microdot.

that thread debate between you two
I wish bees wouldn't see that thread and interpret it as a debate. Geez and Ware come from different backgrounds but have a common goal in learning and sharing that is fueled by doing the research necessary for validation. And finally putting bees in the envelope of success. You might say it's kind of remarkable how two bees that have never met arrive at the same conclusions more often than not.
When we disagree on an applicable approach or a fundamental principal, I know I start retracing steps and analyzing in an effort to see what I might have missed that he picked up on and I feel Geez does the same.
I have sat dumbfounded some times when seeing the miraculous similarities reported by several bees but mostly Geez's knack for detail and never missing in a beat regarding the pill extraction front. His findings mirror my own in many cases.
Neither have a desire to compete with the other and neither are running for office, so I don't see our preferences in variations or discussions spawned as debates...
I do know with confidence that what He and Ibee share in there findings and suggestions can be applied with a higher level of certainty by other bees that put them in the success range if followed properly.
Without applying suggestions from Geez's circle, I'm confident that they work. There are only a select few bees that I can say that for without varification or confirming.
With that said...

Wouldn't third time use of MBRP make the reaction need more?

Not necessarily...if the previous rxns ran clean and the MBRP was cleaned properly it's not unheard of for it to be as strong as was if not stronger than the first run.
If any trash is left on the MBRP after cleaning...the rxn has a funny way of stripping it of that trash during the first run.
Obviously, the redder it is, the better. It will begin to grey as it gets weaker.
Ibee always flash tests his MBRP with fire by taking a small portion and seeing how it burns beforeand after rxns.

Now back to the rxn at hand.
Since you decided to go with the best of both worlds
And since the inhabitants are marching to the beats of different drummers , Ibee has to stick to guns in the customary drive-by fashion and and say Go with the 48hr and avoid trying to tweak it to fit into a smaller time frame.
That tweaking in and of itself is the cause of many disappointments and failures and then the ones getting blamed are the good bees offering the guidance rather than the tweeking inhabitant of both worlds holding a bigger hammer trying to slam the square peg in the round hole.
This rxn already has one strike against it, not with the amount of dh2o but with the inconsistancy in heating coupled with the inconsistancy of how the reactants came in contact with one another throughout the rxn.
Those reactants work best when they are evenly dispersed in the beginning in order for the recyling of the highest HI percentage generation over time, exposed to what is being reduced.
If a bee has a huge clump of RP or I2 stuck on the bottom someware....the rxn may suffer some collateral damage

[spectralshift]

But Geez what about yellow smoke in small freebase reactions?

When I read your H3PO3 tests I took the small wisp of yellow smoke as a minor kink in your mastery of the HI rxn, but that on a small to nano-rxn it would bee a bad error, no?

[JUMPER]

Ware thanks for the input on the MBRP third use and the other help you've given. Other than that shitty 48hr info and knowing that SWIM takes no blame and will most definitely blame you if things fail (just teaseeing)!
   Don't feel like debates are a battle like when we were in school. The bee who posted that after you two gave your opinions of styles probably just meant it in fun because of your and Geez comments. Debates are just good communication and opinions brother!
   So when in your post you say that you add your Ephedrine first, then your I2, then your dH2O, and let sit till liquid. Then you add your RP and heat and forget about it, your RP is added in smaller doses over time and mixing? JUMPER is confused and doesn't understand what you mean in last post above.
   SWIM raised temperature to 135C and got a boiling frenzy, so he must have been close to the right temp. all along. Please agree even if SWIM's wrong or he'll cry!  

[wareami]

WTF? Are you nuckin futs?
It's against the rules to agree even if your right!

> your RP is added in smaller doses over time and mixing?

No! If that was the case it wouldn't be set it and forget.
•Add E to flask
•Add I2 to E in flask
•Stir until liquid and all I2 is intimately mixed.(No clumps)
•Add dh2o stir
•Add MBRP/RP stir and cap with balloon or condensor.
Set on heat source then set thermostat to the 100°C mark.
It's kay to watch as the internal temp rises to make sure all is going as planned with the HI generation.
Set your alarm for 8hr stirring intervals.
As the rxn progresses, the reactants will collect on the flask sides and hold RP. Ibee likes the 8hr stirrings to knock it all back down into the reactants where it does the most good.

More than likely, I expect to be tied to the whipping post by the floggers, WizardX, Orgy, and Ballzofsteel for not suggesting making the HI first.
But this is the way Ibee does it.

[livid]

swims first sucsessful rxn went off so violent, he had to quinch it with h2o, turning it from a push-pull to a wet dream. he was so scared, he almost chucked the whole thing out the window,then he said to himself , preparing and extracting and acquiring all these precursors was a lot of hard work and time. he held on to his stopper for dear life, untill he got things under control. he sat there the entire time watching everything for many hours, took a guess when he thought it was done, and did the standard work-up. then he stayed up for 3 days on a 20 bag. the end

[Jacked]

Swim mixes the E and Rp then chills it right in the reaction vessel in an ice bath, after a bit he adds the I2 followed by the H2O, caps it off then rolls the flask around until all is liquefied, Hardly any smoke is produced, a white mist sometimes, This proceeds into it's own course as smooth as a baby's ass...No mus No fuss.. The amount of H2O is important as well. more for longer refluxes is good and less for short runs is sometimes good unless you are me then it all is good. hahahahaahha, Just kidding.. Well, not really..

[spectralshift]

Swim mixes the E and Rp then chills it right in the reaction vessel in an ice bath, after a bit he adds the I2 followed by the H2O, caps it off then rolls the flask around until all is liquefied, Hardly any smoke is produced, a white mist sometimes, This proceeds into it's own course as smooth as a baby's ass...

That's the method swim absorbed too, using an ice bath, water bath, warm water, mug of hot water. 
Jacked is the wisp of white smoke HI or the "highly toxic' gas Argox says that is produced at the beginning of HI production?

[geezmeister]

Spectralshift: I haven't seen any yellow smoke in quite a few of these of reactions now. I can't recall it having been a problem when I did. I really can't say that I have identified the source of the yellow smoke, or that it bodes ill for the reaction to see it. I simply don't know.

[Jacked]

"Jacked is the wisp of white smoke HI or the "highly toxic' gas Argox says that is produced at the beginning of HI production? "

 Hell man, I have no idea. I know sometimes later into the start its actually moisture and a very fine mist taking on the resemblance of smoke.  

Yellow, green and brown colored smoke, Swim thinks it is I2 from tincture that generates these colors because it's never seen using lab grade I2. (by swim anyway) The I2 from tincture has a moisture content that when the three reactants come together raw they react faster causing hotter Smokey starts..The three I was referring to would be Rp, I2 with a small amount of H2O present in or on every other crystal.

Not relevent but Look up the word tincture anyway, webester says it's "A coloring or dyeing substance; a pigment. 2. An imparted color; a tint. 3. A quality that colors, pervades, or distinguishes." I know it's just a coincidence but had to go there, hehehehe

[spectralshift]

hehe your a bloody idiot jacked! but excellent, thanks a lot for the response! You only come out on special occasions!
Well as long as I know swij is seeing the same thing  

10x

[JUMPER]

Oh Yeah!! Fuckin Yeah!! Oh Yeah!!  JUMPER's, I mean SWIM's LWR went for 48hrs without him shooting anything in his house from angry no patience pacing and worrying!
   The only fuck up came from dropping the 2000ml flask while trying to take a drink of SWIM's Crown Royal after rxn complete. But no worries SWIM pissed himself, launched the 1/5th of Crown flying, and caught the top of the flask after it bounced perfectly off my one slipper and back up and away towards the concrete floor. After numerous kisses of the side of flask SWIM went upstairs to have a great A/B per Geez: "post reaction workup" and then Chicken and Geez combined recrystallization methods!
   The yield only came back at around 72% from psuedo fb and SWIM has no clue on purity because he's only tried one other product from fast P/P where he got 53% yield and it was yellow and made SWIM agitated and the rambling typist on the "Tetra trap thread".
   No experienced friends over yet to be guinea pigs, but SWIM got a great body rush,warm euphoric feeling for quite a while,pulse doubled in around a minute,stayed up talking with girlfriend all night,now it's the next night and still no agitation or anxiety. SWIM feels like he could sleep anytime he wants,which should be next week some time.
   Only drawbacks were SWIM's jaw felt tight like on double dose MDMA and girlfriend said she didn't get the helicopter sound like when she tried years ago. Oh yeah, and my dick looks like I am five and Chinese and I can't piss!
   So someone with some knowledge in this category please tell me do these effects sound like things came out okay, good, or excellent? It blew the doors off the other yellow shit that SWIM was better off snorting big lines. This took about the size of the bottom of a cigarette on end and no nasty yellow shit left on foil like before and gagging.
   All clean baby and with no help from anyone at all! SWIM did it all by himself and didn't even have to ask for advice from the Hive. He also didn't have to have Wareami and Geez on their fucking computers for days answering numerous PM's from him in urgency because he was scared shitless!
   Thanks to the Hive,The Tetra Trap with scottydog's input, and mostly to two cool mother fucking bee's named Ware and Geez who baby stepped the stranger through the LWR. JUMPER can give compliments but will never take blame for anything!

   Ware let me know if want me to shoot that nagging bitch spectralshitt who needs to go find a guy to pull that rag out and fuck her. There's no way that spunkashit could be a guy! Wow it's liberating to no longer be just a stranger, but a bee! Does that paragraph sound familiar to you spunkashit!  

  Jacked, think the yellow would probably have to do with the I2 because of coloring when breaking down. But SWIM's I2 is medical Iodine prill which is pure and dry, not tincture. thanks for the input though!

[gluecifer69]

Only drawbacks were SWIM's jaw felt tight like on double dose MDMA and girlfriend said she didn't get the helicopter sound like when she tried years ago. Oh yeah, and my dick looks like I am five and Chinese and I can't piss!
 
    If you can't piss either you did too much or the shit was not all the way done and there are still some unreduced intermediates in it.  However, my dick usually only shrinks when I am dehydrated or very cold.
    These are only observation's that Gluecifer has experienced before and those were the causes.  Obviously not being able to urinate is not a good thing, Keep that in mind.