The Vespiary

The Hive => Newbee Forum => Topic started by: rudebwoy on May 09, 2003, 10:39:00 PM

Title: Gassing IPA and how to use
Post by: rudebwoy on May 09, 2003, 10:39:00 PM: I'm aware gassing IPA with HCl gas is a very good method if you don't want to setup gassing setup every time. However what I don't understand is, when you add this mixture to the NP layer to get crystals, wouldn't the IPA alcohol dissolve some of the crystals?

Also I'm not sure how to calculate the mass of ipa/hcl to put in for the freebase in meth/ecstasy np layer.
Title: Methinks that the amine we all know and love...
Post by: raffike on May 10, 2003, 07:08:00 AM: Methinks that the amine we all know and love might be soluble in IPA even if it's converted to HCl salt
Title: raff me too
Post by: rudebwoy on May 10, 2003, 09:25:00 AM: That was the same line of thinking I was having after pondering about using it. I've been thinking about doing this method a lot so I'm asking the other bees.
I remember reading someone writing that they just add the ipa with hcl sat in to the np layer and then just filter out.
*shrugglez*

Ne1?
Title: experiment
Post by: abacus on May 10, 2003, 10:29:00 AM: A typical recrystallising technique is to dissolve MDMA.HCL in 3.5 times the amount of boiling IPA, add 3-4 times that amount of acetone and let sit in the fridge overnight, next day filter out about 80% of the starting salt. Then boil most of solvents away, add a bit of fresh acetone, cool and collect another crop of recrystallised MDMA.HCL.

So with this in mind, I'd try this experiment. Weigh say 1 kilo IPA, gas it like mad and weigh it again to work out the HCL loading.

Then assuming it's say 7%-10% HCL, I'd then add 250g-300g distilled MDMA freebase to this HCL/IPA mixture, shake, maybe add some acetone to help crash out the salt and let sit in the fridge overnight thereby combining the gassing and recrystallising into one procedure. But, if the HCL loading is low this won't work.

Maybe some bees could shed some light on how much HCL IPA can absord.

Abacus
Title: Hmm
Post by: rudebwoy on May 10, 2003, 11:36:00 AM: I suppose using xylene as the np layer and then adding the alcohol/hcl mix then driving the alcohol out with microwave at low setting would work.

That way if any substance is locked in alcohol, it can just all go to hell.
Title: HCl in IPA
Post by: Kinetic on May 10, 2003, 03:20:00 PM: Maybe some bees could shed some light on how much HCL IPA can absord.
A 5-6 molar solution is commercially available, so the answer must be quite a bit. Assuming 6M is a saturated solution, 1 litre IPA can therefore hold around 220g HCl (i.e. 6 moles). Taking the density of 6M HCl in IPA as ~0.8g/mL, this would give a (220/0.8x1000)x100% = 27.5% w/w solution.

I think..

As for the substance being 'locked in' the alcohol, I don't think that will happen when you have a co-solvent which the IPA is soluble in and the MDMA HCl crystals aren't. This is the theory behind 'crashing out'; the IPA won't be able to hold as much/any MDMA HCl when it's diluted with xylene/toluene as it would when neat.
Title: Max I'm curious about how well that IPA/HCl...
Post by: foxy2 on May 10, 2003, 04:23:00 PM: Max
I'm curious about how well that IPA/HCl solution keeps?
Have you had any problems storing it?
foxy
Title: 4ever
Post by: rudebwoy on May 11, 2003, 08:55:00 AM: foxy.
on rhodium'ws page it states
it can be kept indefinitely
however if storing hcl/acetone solution, it is hydroscopic while ipa isn't

how chilled does the ipa have to be in order for it to be saturated completely?
I'm guessing you chill the ipa, gas, then chill some more, then gas.
Title: I'm guessing you chill the ipa, gas, then...
Post by: foxy2 on May 11, 2003, 09:29:00 PM: I'm guessing you chill the ipa, gas, then chill some more, then gas.

See I would want to store it at room temp and my only real "concern" would bee the bottle blowing up. That would suck.
Title: Commercial 5M HCl in IPA
Post by: Rhodium on May 11, 2003, 09:39:00 PM: A 5 molar solution of HCl in IPA is sold commercially from several chem suppliers, with no special expiration date. It seems like if it has been properly prepared, no side-reactions or extensive decomposition to 2-chloropropane does occur.
Title: would it be possible to add 33% HCl(aq) ...
Post by: fierceness on May 11, 2003, 11:56:00 PM: would it be possible to add 33% HCl(aq) (hardware muriatic acid) and then dry the IPA/H20/HCl with NaCl and then with MgSO4 ?
Title: No, that would not be feasible (UTFSE, This...
Post by: Rhodium on May 12, 2003, 12:23:00 AM: No, that would not be feasible (UTFSE, This has been debunked several times before.)