Sb(III) and As(III) instead of P(III)

[Organikum]

is of course preferable for preparation and for subsequent dehydration of the hydroiodic acid in the reaction so no phosphorus is available (or H3PO2/3).

Nevertheless I cannot agree in Osmium being "absolutely" right. Naming others names cannot replace references and information.
Naming names is usually the argument of the dumb.
And the fat ones I want to add.

have a nice day.
ORG

[Rhodium]

Read this clarification I made to the above post the last time that was overinterpreted:

Post 459244

(Rhodium: "Behavior of ions in solution", Stimulants)

[Osmium]

> Nevertheless I cannot agree in Osmium being "absolutely" right.

That's ok, you don't need to agree. Doesn't change the facts though.

> Naming others names cannot replace references and information.

Did I call you names in this thread?

> Naming names is usually the argument of the dumb.
> And the fat ones I want to add.

Congratulations for the nice example for dumbness you so generously provided. Couldn't have said it better myself.

[ragnaroekk]

"Reduction of Phytalonsäure to Phytalid-Carbonsäure
With potassiumiodide in diluted hydrochloric acid. 19,4g Phytalonsäure (0,1mol) have been boiled together with 8,3g KI (25% of theory) and 6g phosphorus for 4 hours in 12ccm conc. HCl and 22ccm....."
The rest is description of the workup, yields had been 78% of theory, 2,1g phosphorus were regathered.

Sorry I dont know the english names of the compounds.
Phosphorus produces no HI from KI as far as I know and the amount would be to low to do all the HI production and recycling if I didnt miscalculated it.

This is translated from this reference:

https://www.thevespiary.org/rhodium/Rhodium/djvu/miescher.djvu

Thats why I asked.

Please look at this post also:

Post 445996 (missing)

(ragnaroekk: "Nobody really read this it seems", Stimulants)
where I repost parts of an older thread where it is also stated that HCl + KI works for making HI (Crankenstein and Prickleberry)

I am a Bollock.
RaG

[Osmium]

> where it is also stated that HCl + KI works for making HI

Dissolving KI in aq. HCl produces a solution containing K(+), H(+), Cl(-) and I(-). Saying that the solution contains "HI" is misleading since the H(+) doesn't know that it is supposed to produce HI.
HI and HCl are very strong acids and can be considered to be 100% dissociated in aqueous solution.

[ragnaroekk]

This was already stated by Rhodium.
And it does by no way answer my question.
It explains plain nothing.

Why does it work in the translated reference?
And another question brought up (not by me) was this hydrate thingie?
If I understand it right, it is asked: Why do completely dissociated ions form quite stable constant boiling hydrates?

[Rhodium]

They form something which can be seen as azeotropes/complexes.

[ragnaroekk]

Chief, isnt that exactly what I wrote?
...constant boiling hydrates.
....azeotropes/complexes.

I would define a hydrate as a complex - perhaps I am wrong, but for sure a constant boiling mixture of two compounds is an azeotrope.

Isnt it this way that HI dissoziates into H+ and I- ions which are as dissociated ions associated to a certain number of H2O molecules? (or H+ and O- ions if the water is also dissociated? Serious question, no teasing) This way things would fit under one hat - the dissociated ions of the HI form complexes with watermolecules (the ratio varying with temperature and concentration) called hydrates?

If this is right, the explanaition of the reactionmechanism of HI reductions should regard this and should be interpreted from the view of the hydrated HI and not from completely dissociated ions complexed with nothing.

Festers HBr dehydration with HCl
The HI dehydration with H2SO4 or GAA or HCl

Damn, far away from the question: NaI + HCl = HI yes or no, or partly, this would provide a working theory for halogenations with haloacids which could be made high yielding and also adjustable so that the halogenation might stop at a certain point and not affect all possible parts of a molecule (semiselective?).
I believe this being useful.

[Rhodium]

I simply said why hydrates form, as you asked it - and as you said in the later post, it is a kind of complex.

Is your question now "why do complexes form"? If so, then that is too complicated for me to answer - it's an electron/orbital thing.