Choice of NP?

[place]

Hello.

I'm having quite a lot troubles finding the rigth (and cheapest) NP solvent to extract ephedrine/pseudoephedrine/meth.

I can understand that some solvents are better than others, e.g. does many likes naptha. Is it posseble to  still get the same product if using a not so good solvents, if you e.g. extracts more times, use more solvents etc.?

Where I live, N-heptan (which I have heart should be good to extract meth?) and white spirits is the cheapest and easist to buy, Xylene is more hard to find and cost a lot more than N-heptan and white spirits.

What would be best to extract meth and E? I have tried to use the search engine, but everytime I only got the answer: Hot naptha.   

[wareami]

not hot!

[fierceness]

SWIF never had much luck with naptha, but xylene and toluene worked like a charm.

[aztec]

like fierceness (that intrepid sweet bee), her luck with naptha has not been as successful as that with xylene (she says toluene is best but oh so hard to locate). wareami sounds as if naptha is his choice of poison but then again, he seems to have the midas touch in areas where others do not.

[popi]

Place ,other bees and exotica.Swip ordered a approximate 20 ltr pail from your local hardware chain.No sources need bee given. Price was a over a hundred dollars.Did not have the cash so Swip said she would be back.LOOked at the pail and noticed the sender...remembered the name and number and presto,bee went and found ALL SOLVENTS/The best cheapest solvents in any size and they carry everything sold to garages,chain stores,paint stores and the like.Find out the supplier and gogo.They take cash ,have a computor to see what's in the solvents and even a print out free of charge.Did bee have to open an account ? "Nope said the Sucretary"Mek was the only one priced high.The acetone,vmp naptha were only approx,$30.00!for the large grey pails.By the way Ware & Geez or Scotty they had a high flash point Naptha! Is it worth the higher price? Don't know but bee loaded up his trike with all he could carry.The same exact small 3.some odd ltr acetone carrys a hefty price of close to $15.00 from your Small Dart Store.This plagued Swip for years ,running all over to cop expensive wet solvents.Hope this helps some bees.1.Order a pail 2.Check the return address 3.Gogo and get all you want at the supplier.We saw large 55 gal drums,tanker trucks and most likly a train car too ;so it must be fresher than ...

[wareami]

Resourcefulness will make or brake most bees.
Some bees are limited in areas of aquisition.
Others are limited at the point of application regardless of aquisitional availability.
Nothing beats a dual solvent combo's efficacy in receiving the amines in question here. Any solvent combo across the board is superior to any single solvents affinity for acceptance of the amine.
Even among the same family's of solvents....ie...vmpnaptha...colemans...charcoallighterfluids...etc...
The luvshack ware Ibee first set up shop was in serious danger of being shut down by the direct association of aromatic solvents odors leaking from it's locale.
Today...this use of certain aromatics puts bees at jeopardy more so than in the past.
For those bees at risk, taking the least favorite and making it work at it's full potential and efficacy isn't just an option....it's mandatory and this in itself will separate those who can or will and those who can't or won't succeed.
What others may see as severely limiting, considering the scope of Ibee's achievements in the past, Ibee's always looked at as mere obstacles that demanded adjustment and subsequent work-arounds.
Ibee's AWE about HIGH performance and never ruled out half-baked ideas as a means of getting on top of things considered by most as "out-of-reach" or a least favored way of getting what he wants.
FWIW....

[Scottydog]

Swim is partial towards warm Xylene. He has tried Naptha, Queensford charcoal lighter fluid, Lamp fuel, T.U.R.P.S, Mineral Spirits etc.

Ware is right, "warm" solvents are best, (esp with the new gakks) which seem to do the most damage as surfactants or encapsulators when hot. Either that or "loss of yield" through the burning of pill feedstock.

Coffee warmers rule! A little less heat over a longer period of time seems to bee the most efficient when basing with sodium carbonate. With these coffee warmers, any glass coffee pot will work, any size beaker etc.

Popi, yes the larger containers of solvent are cheaper but seem to bring on some suspicious stares from neighbors when wheeled into a garage on a dolly, in a residential area.  

Swim does not recycle his solvents but Orgy is an advocate of it and knows more about what he is talking about then Swim ever will.

I wonder how long 5 gallons of Xylene would last Swim if he were to use and then distill? Probably months?  

[alphacentauri]

In my experience, mostly related to cat making, but meth also, I found chloroform simply unbeatable for methylcathinone FB extraction, but also with meth FB chloroform works very well. Last Christmas I ran short of chloroform and the shop was closed, so I used some toluene I had at home, but I got greenish cat and low yield too. With chloroform, instead, I always obtain a perfectly white powder with small needle-shaped crystals in a definitely higher yield.
Then for ephedrine extraction I only use water and ethanol, but that depends from the fillers of the tablets. Anyway I think that the stereate is eliminated in the first water wash, when you separate the microcrystalline cellulose. I think that because to detect the amount of fats in foodstuff analyses, you filter a mineralised liquid extract of pasta through fossil flour (kieselguhr, the stuff once used to make dynamite) or, more often, microcrystalline cellulose, and both those substances block fats, while the rest passes though the buchner. So why Mg stereate should not be blocked by the cellulose of the first water wash? I forgot: I filter a COLD extract, I leave it in the fridge (or outside in winter) the whole night long.
Sorry for my language, I hope you understand well.      

[ampdup]

For pseudo extraction, I swear by denatured alcohol.  It's less then a sawbuck per gallon, is sold at the big Department stores and everywhere else that painting supplies are sold, and evaporates totally with no funky aftertaste.  I refinish old furniture as a hobby, so what smell it does have isn't anything that you might think twice about.  Hell, you could keep a half finished chair or something in plain sight as a decoy.  Just move the thing around every once in a while..hehe

Deception and camoflage is half the battle!  If your sneaking around all the time, then chances are, you LOOK like you have something to hide.  Act like you own the place, but without being sloppy or stupid.

[DrLucifer]

Swim is faithful to xylene as xylene is faithful to swim.
As far as aqusition goes, swim gets his dirt cheap because the 4l tins are dented, or the plastic handles are broken or something minor like that. Local chemical surplus mob.
Top blokes working there and the guy running the show supplies solvents for an 'outlaw' motorcycle club.
Of course, that doesnt help you much, but it lets me brag about my sweet deal with chemical 'recyclers'.  
On a more serious note, swim cant really offer comparison on different extraction solvents, as xylene was his first pick.
But, if you CAN get it, then get it, its worth it.
Plus, you cant beat that sweet aroma of xylene...mmmm!

[place]

Nobody using Heptan?

[xaja]

Toluene always been the best but if you are stuck even turps can be used (pretty rough though!).

[gluecifer69]

For post reaction extraction of the goods, swim always uses oderless mineral spirits!  Available from the supercenters to the supermarkets!  Buying charcoal starter doesn't arouse as much suspicion as other chems and as long as it is oderless, seems to work great for swim.

In the past swim has used both xylene and toluene, but they seem to be quite agressive pullers and always pull more back than meth, i.e. trash. IMHO

Theoretically there should be no little or no gakk in your post-rxn mix, but if it is there those agressvise solvents will pull it.

[fierceness]

In the past swim has used both xylene and toluene, but they seem to be quite agressive pullers and always pull more back than meth, i.e. trash.IMHO

Which is why you wash the post rxn fluid with toluene/xylene before you base it!

[gluecifer69]

RE:Washing post-rxn fluid:

Don't worry Fiercnees(excellent point BTW), swim(is dumb, but not that dumb ) always washes his fluid with, Xylene or Tolly.  I thought the statement swim made about xylene and tolly would be obvious that they are good post rxn fluid washers for that fact!   It is good that swif pointed that out because in swim's area that step is the most oft neglected step in the post-rxn workup!  Gluecifer would never dream of leaving in out, let that be known.

Regardless of post-rxn washes or not they IMHO are a bit to aggressive in swim's taste, may just bee in his head but he never uses them to pull gear. Different strokes for different folks, eh?

The main point swim was trying to make about mineral spirits is how widely available they are!  And cheap to boot.

[place]

SWIM had 12,5g ephedrine.hcl which were a little unpure, and he had decided to do a a/b on the white powder/crystals. He did a keyplunking and used HCL water to extract and make salt crystals from the NP.

SWIM tried to use white spirits, after the HCL water the end was evap, only 1,5-2g ephedrine was collected!    SWIM is sure that the product was no THAT unpure at the beginning. SWIM saved the water (pH 14), can he try to get more godies from that, or has the white spirits destroyed it?

[wareami]

From all previous reports from the Gassing Geez's corner, SWIG has extolled the use of tetra as a superior candidate for pulling the amine.
It's no small wonder for those gassing as tetra repels h2o.
Ibee's not a gasser as he's yet to obtain a suitable filtration rig for the deed.
Tetra in titration is tricky because of it's bottom layer nature.
It would make an effective wash solvent of the post-rxn fluid since it would catch any residual gaaks that weren't effectively removed during the extraction of OTC goodies.

[place]

Nobody who can  give me advices what to do, to save the E?  

[wareami]

place: Seeings how this threads topic is "Choice of NP"
Change NP and Keep Pulling
It's in there unless it's not awe there to begin with!
The Time is Now to be looking for (-)-pseudo as a possible yield stomper.
Unfortunate yes....but it was propheseed!

[xaja]

White spirits cannot destroy the E. Not sure what happened, but maybe you didn't add enough base. You say pH is at 14 in water, are you sure? You can't over-basify so mix up another few tablespoons of caustic and dump that in, then try the extraction again. If the white spirits was seperating into another layer on top of the water it should be ok to use, but try to use new stuff second time around or wash the used stuff first with ~5% NaOH solution first.
Not sure what else it could be, pills these days are full of other crap so maybe there was only couple grams of actual E in there.
Another thing maybe: did you use distilled/deionised water? Could explain an unexpected result to some degree. Only other thing I can think of is that you maybe didn't have enough HCl in your last extraction phase. Check that out too before trying again. So good luck.

[LoW_JacK]

I've found your posts quite frequently informative ,if not interesting to say the least. However, that tetra shit just plain sucks for pre-washing pill muck, and for use as a non-polar at the rear end of the reaction. That is tetra ala electro shit cleaner. No offense bud, but tetra sucks dog dick. Toluene is the best I've seen, but it reeks. Xylene hasnt been used by anyone I've known. I always lumped it together with methyl ethyl ketone....a waste of solvent aisle space.  After reading up on xylene it seems like it should be superior to naptha. Fucking Colemans rocks. I challenge someone to prove me wrong. After you regain your seating from laughing your ass off at that joke, disregard it as a challenge. I was making a funny.