Author Topic: Alternative safrole sources  (Read 10726 times)

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El_Zorro

  • Guest
Alternative safrole sources
« on: January 21, 2002, 12:24:00 AM »
This subject has been plauguing me recently, and I could use a few answers from the fellow bees.

1. Does Star Anise oil contain safrole?(illicium verum)

2. Does anyone have an online nursery source for Illicium Parviflorum(sp.?)?  DO NOT post it here, if you do.  If you are of a very noble and giving heart, you might PM it to me, though.

3. Does anybody have a good eugenol-->safrole synth using HI to cleave the methoxy group? (Uh oh, here come the dreaded UTFSE's  :o

4. And lastly, does anyone have about 50 gal. of sassy they could drop off at SWIM's house? ;)  Just kidding, but if you took that seriously, feel fre to PM me. :)

Zorro

baalchemist

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2002, 01:31:00 AM »
Try over at Rhodiums site, I believe the Safrole FAQ has all the safrole containing oils listed and their respective %'s. I think the Eugenol>Safrole synth is over there also.

GODISNOWHERE

Dr_Sister

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2002, 03:12:00 AM »
unless you are connected it pretty much time to start thinking about precursers other than sassy, like apiole, dill apiole, asarone or anethole.

7.10.01

El_Zorro

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2002, 04:20:00 AM »
The safrole FAQ only gave anise oil as "disputed", and the only other info I could find did not list safrole in the contents. :(

I would love about ten or fifteen yellow anise trees, though.  With the evergreen leaves, SWIM could harvest multi-kg's of leaves a couple of times a year, and then, you guessed it, steam distill it, and maybe have 2-3 kg's of safrole several times a year.  The only problem is, I don't live around GA, so I don't have any nurseries around here that sells yellow anise.  The only online nursery I could find only sells one tree per person.(Are they catching on? :o )

What about Piper Hispervidinum?  Does anybody have a common name for this?  Nursery source?

Anyway, it's just been on my mind lately.

Zorro

El_Zorro

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2002, 08:39:00 PM »
I've been looking around, and (what do you know) I've got a couple more questions.

In the AlCl3 demethylization, a PTC is used apparently for the specific reason of allowing the AlCl3 to mix with the eugenol.  Couldn't this be achieved by using a solvent that dissolves eugenol and AlCl3?  Maybe an alcohol, or DMF, or something like that?  Or would the AlCl3 go after the solvent?  If this worked though, all SWIM would have to do is reflux in eugenol, AlCl3, and solvent, then extract and test to see if you got Catechol(that is unmethylated safrole, isn't it?).

Second, Where would one get Nordefrin?  I was thinking that a very very bad person could just methylate it, then possibly run it through the sulfuric acid/metal chloride reaction that turns ephedrine to P2P, and maybe get MDP2P.  Would that work?  Or you could just run the methylated product throug the birch, HI/RP, etc. to get MDA.  Comments?

Zorro

Rhodium

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2002, 09:36:00 AM »
Anise oil does not usually contain appreciable amounts of safrole, it is only a goos source of anethole (4-methoxypropenylbenzene).

El_Zorro

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2002, 09:57:00 PM »
Oh my god!!  Rhodium actually responded to one of mt posts! :-[

Anyway, fuck eugenol.  The ONLY interesting thing I read was some post about eugenol being refluxed with NaOH and I think they added AlCl3, but anyway, all they got was 5% demethylated product.  They did say that the remaining eugenol was relatively unharmed, but I still don't think it's very feasable.

So.......does black pepper oil contain piperine?

Zorro

Osmium

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2002, 10:12:00 PM »
Piperine is too big to steam-distill.

Live long and Prosper.

Elementary

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2002, 11:29:00 PM »
Have you considered Ylang Ylang ?

One day I'll understand everything !

El_Zorro

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2002, 11:29:00 PM »
Well...........

does the reduction of MDP-2-Nitropropene with AlLiH4 as given in the "large scale MDMA from piperanol" page on Rodium's site actually give MDMA, or MDP2P, like in EVERY OTHER reduction of MDP-2-Nitropropene I've read?

What does Yling Ylang have in it?

Zorro

pickler

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2002, 11:44:00 PM »
Yling ylang has safrole in it. Swim believes it's about 90%,but swim could bee wrong check Rhodium's site. It's in the safrole FAQ. Swim found some places tha have it, but kinda expensive compared to sassy.

El_Zorro

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2002, 09:26:00 PM »
Many questions answered.  One to go.

Is Yling Ylang watched at all?  Could I order say, 5 or six kilo's of it and not woory about pigs busting down my door?

Zorro

noj

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2002, 09:31:00 PM »
Yling Ylang? Ylang Ylang? Hell I even saw Ylang Yling! Are these all misspellings of Ylang Ylang?

crucify the ego before it's far too late
and you will come to find that we are all one mind

Elementary

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2002, 09:31:00 PM »
It's Ylang Ylang !  :P



One day I'll understand everything !

El_Zorro

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2002, 11:11:00 PM »
Yling Ylang, Ylang Yling, Yling Yling, Ylang Ylang, who gives a fuck?

All I care about is how much safrole it has in it, and how watched it is.

Alright, I lied.  Another question.

Can the cyclohexylamine in the piperonal-->MDP-2-Nitropropene synth be substituted?  Is it just a solvent or catalyst, or an actual reagent?

Zorro

Elementary

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2002, 12:01:00 AM »
You'll give a fuck when you try and order something that don't excist !

UTFSE, then you will find what you want about safrole !

Well look at that, only took <1 min to find it

Post 95481 (missing)

(Osmium: "Oils that contain safrole", Chemicals & Equipment)


One day I'll understand everything !

El_Zorro

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2002, 05:38:00 AM »
Yeah I know dude, I especially give a fuck about whether or not people actually answer my question or just post a lot of bullshit that really amounts to abouy, oh, maybe, JACK SHIT.

When I asked who gave a fuck what the name of the oil was, it was not meant as an insult of any kind, and it was in no way a statement by me that I would actually try to order MDMA precursor materials without thorough investigation of each and everything I ordered.  That whole reply was meant by me as basically a "please get back on topic so Rhodium won't yoink this thread" reply.  What I don't understand is, is why, if you are SO inconvenienced by my ignorant questions, do you take the time to not only give me the classic UTFSE, but you also do a search for me.  If you hate the questions so much, DON'T WASTE TIME IN THIS THREAD.

The question I asked, that you so deftly avoided answering, is whether or not a 5-6 kg order of ylang ylang oil would draw undue attention.  The post you gave did not even come close to answering this.  I already know what I need to about safrole, this thread is about safrole ALTERNATIVES.  So next time you try and put someone in their place, maybe you should take more than a minute.

By the way, you spelled exist wrong.

The question of cyclohexylamine still stands, though(everybody else). ;)

Zorro

terbium

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2002, 06:18:00 AM »
whether or not a 5-6 kg order of ylang ylang oil would draw undue attention.
It would not occur to anyone that the Ylang Ylang oil was being used as a precursor for controlled substances so it would not attract attention in that respect. It would attract attention in the sense that 5kg is a very large quantity of an expensive oil, you would likely have to do business with an importer/wholesale house to obtain such a large quantity. I doubt that Ylang Ylang would prove to be a cost effective source of safrole.

noj

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2002, 06:22:00 AM »
yeah, I was thinking it was like 4x the price of sassafras.

amalgum

  • Guest
Re: Alternative safrole sources
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2002, 07:35:00 AM »
I strongly suggest finding out what type of climate you have in your area, and figuring out what types of plants grow in your area. In my area sassafras grows wild, and it proliferates anything from a yard to the woods.  With a little hard work, you could have all the free precursor you wanted.