Author Topic: Super High Potentcy Push/Pull dope  (Read 77658 times)

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FeatherWood

  • Guest
da trueth
« Reply #20 on: January 18, 2003, 07:12:00 AM »
similar situation was experience but not intentionally. goodies were dubed pook and choke people said the old days are back...uhhuh yes warlock thanks for the confirmation.


Take care all
FeatherWood

Daphuk_up

  • Guest
Alright, got it so far...
« Reply #21 on: January 18, 2003, 07:51:00 AM »

Thanks Worlock for your help, very much appreciated.  ;D

SWID has one more question for the more knowledgeable bees, however.  Is a push-pull set up really necessary for smaller batches, say 2gRP, 5gE, 8gI2?  Would a simple 18" long 1/4" dia. hose with a balloon on the end be sufficiant?  SWID guesses that it would, that push-pull set-ups are only for larger batches.  Help here for this noob would be, yet again, appreciated greatly.  :)

PS  It somewhat shames SWID to admit that his reaction vessel is a brown-glass beer bottle.  Anyone see any particular problem with that, other than SWID can't see the rxn too well?  :(



Jacked

  • Guest
A balloon will do
« Reply #22 on: January 18, 2003, 08:48:00 AM »
No you don't haft to set up a P/P system, a balloon will do for those amounts just fine. Just run a couple feet of hose first and attach the balloon to the end of it.


AbSoLuTe

  • Guest
So is the proof in the pudding?
« Reply #23 on: January 18, 2003, 10:36:00 AM »
Hi Worlock Ive not been in here for a while.
Have you done a M.P.on the product and if so what is it?
Also colour pre acetone/ethanol wash.
I personally prefer the fast route, the closer to a flask fire the better. MMmmwwwhhhaaa. But then again reading one or two of your posts, it looks like your brain was way ahead of your fingers. LOL


Organikum

  • Guest
if the higher concentration
« Reply #24 on: January 18, 2003, 10:40:00 AM »
If the higher concentration of the HI is to do the trick (what I would like to be true very much as I was convinced of this for quite long a time) some pressure might be the way to go (if someone wants, as there are more ways to heaven...).
Three to five bar should be enough to hold quite high concentrations of HI solvated - also at elevated temperatures.
I claim that if the flask is set to rest for 48 hours after short heating up for starting the reaction and a overpressure is maintained during this time and temperature is about 25°C to 35°C, there will be first class product yielded. And the needed amounts of Iodine and RP or the correspondending acids may be reduced also. Applying a soft shake from time to time or a stirrer on low speed optimize the procedure - and prevent that the cook feels useless.  ;)


ORG


Scottydog

  • Guest
Simply stealth
« Reply #25 on: January 18, 2003, 11:09:00 AM »
Theoretically speaking...

Warmer climate bees could literally slap on a balloon and dump it in the back of a broken down junk car.  ::)

The possibilities are endless. The method is simply stealth.

The transient down the way could have a hole dug out in the desert covered up with plywood for all we know.  :)

With clean precursors a rxn will kick coming off an icebath. So maybe cooler temps will reduce as well?

Temperature vs time?

This could open the floodgates to bees who had been previously limited due to an unrealistic living situation.

Can't believe the electricity Swis has wasted over the years.

Will be interesting to see some feedback.

Set it and forget it.  ;D

Much respect...
___________
Refuse/Resist

Worlock

  • Guest
Swi D srr arr asrr
« Reply #26 on: January 18, 2003, 01:55:00 PM »
In the city you can run up to about 1/2 oz  without the  P/P  when it gets up to an Oz it gets smoky so run it through kitty litter make sure the litter can't get sucked back into the flask

2 oz wull put out quite a bit of smoke

under 1/2 pz wait until dark then run the hose outside,

SWID SHOULD BE PROUD OF HIS LITTLE BROWN BOTTLE,
true cavemnan equipment
If it were too hot it might break

  I broke a 12 liter flask first time I used it because I did not heat it evenly, it was a very stupid mistake, talk about scrambling to find 2-6 liter flasks. Lost vey luttle of the contents, it cracked but did not shatter,
I had just walked out of the room then I heard that sickening sounding crack, it could only be one thing


BenWiFFen

  • Guest
Daphuk-up
« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2003, 02:17:00 PM »
Does that say 8g of I2? I'd go with 3-5-5 or 3-5-6 but 8 is a tad high not that it wouldn't work. Worlock your comming in loud and clear but your voice sounds different.


Worlock

  • Guest
Organikum
« Reply #28 on: January 18, 2003, 03:52:00 PM »
Yes you appreciate the importance of forcing the relative diastemers of ephedrine to change configuration, and yet  have an environment mild enough to remove the oxygen only from the preffered form of ephedrine to make d-meth and exclude l-meth
Evidently the window of opportunuty is large.

 We have been blasting the ephedrine to both d and l meth m with a harsh and fast reaction

 we need to locate the best condition to make only d-meth,
The refluxers are doing it and the few that have done it under high concemtration agree the quality is much  higher, the dope is cleaner, but the yields are staggered and inconsistant. but I believe this is because of the newness and uncertainty about the endpoint


aquagirl

  • Guest
small stuff...
« Reply #29 on: January 18, 2003, 03:56:00 PM »
I was the one that coined the phrase "nanoscale" ( a spin on a legit marine science accomplishment of mine).

there was never any one way to do it- all depended on what was onhand at the moment.  50 ml boiling flask sitting in hot water with a balloon on it for all day worked (I let the reagents start cold and slowly react.  Used a microwave granite thingy that held heat as a heat source.  Used IR heating lamps.  Used lightbulbs.  Used a rubber stoppered and taped coke bottle on a lightbulb.  worked great once.  another time it disintegrated into high velocity glass shards and droplets while I was still holding it.  not even a scratch, but luck was on my side.  my bedroom wall was henceforth painted a nice HI color (faded over time).

on a slightly larger synth, I used the hotplate from a coffee maker as the heat source, and a length of braided hose taped along the side of my frozen windows in the dead of winter.

there's no need for this p/p vs reflux pissing match- the long reflux is a historical fact passed down.  the p/p has some theoretical merit (high conc under pressure).  Of course a controlled p/p (not the incendiary fun) is acting as (a relatively  inefficient) condensor to a ccertain extent..

I  used to place flasks with fitted condensors pumping icewater through them in the presto kitchen kettle with a rheostat and an oil or sand "bath".  I'd run a braided hose off my condensor, up a wall, and sometimes in some h2o for backpressure.  worked great. put the street rp/i to shame- probably because of a little xtra time to react.

if I find time and privacy to post it. I'll detail my "final" method that was the last one I used for a couple cooks before I gave it up.  It's another kinda hybrid reflux-p/p.

method alone accts for a relatively s mall variable- you put rp/i together in proper proportions, and it's gonna spin the pfed 'round regardless of what you do.  I believe there are plenty of other variables, denaturants in pills, contaminants hiding in your glassware.  then there are the steps that are ONLY honed by practice.  you learn to trust your eyes, your nose, your tactile senses- the stuff that comes into play after the rxn and it's time to  separate shit and tweak pH, and dick with emulsions, then properly form a salt, wash it, and xtylize in ways that make your friends green with envy.  you cannot learn much of the truly important skills- lab techniques, without performing them many times, fucking up, refining, etc.  Yeah, I fucked up a lot of shit for a long time- but one day it was kinda like it all clicked.  my failures had forced me into good techniques that seem to be the cornerstone of a rxn. 

anyone else just kind of have it happen this way?  like finally learning to ride a bike? and after that, you had to try pretty fucking hard to screw it up.




SHORTY

  • Guest
What is the deal with d-meth & l-meth
« Reply #30 on: January 18, 2003, 05:34:00 PM »

SHORTY

  • Guest
What the hell is going on?
« Reply #31 on: January 18, 2003, 09:31:00 PM »

sean1234

  • Guest
SHORTY: The powers that be are simply trying...
« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2003, 10:03:00 PM »
SHORTY: The powers that be are simply trying to eliminate redundance and make searching easier for newbees. You might try asking via PM.

BenWiFFen

  • Guest
The city or the sticks
« Reply #33 on: January 18, 2003, 11:33:00 PM »
The city or the sticks? There's no differance unless you have some kind of under ground lab with an elaborate ventilation system I don't recomend testing what your neighbors nose knows.  I've ben in houses that you could tell cooking wasn't just done for dinner.


Worlock

  • Guest
Aquagirl
« Reply #34 on: January 19, 2003, 12:07:00 AM »
Thank you for coming out of retirement to set us all straight again.
I always enjoyed  your nano write-ups. I was given a brass mortar and pestle that was nano, it would crush one or two pills at a time,

In the beginning I also had many failures, then one day it began to make sense, Now it seems if I try to fuck it up it still turns into gold.
I shattered much glassware until I started cooking in sand , the sand gives a slow even heating, Nothing can ruin a yield like broken glassware on a hot plate. In sand if it does break, your chemicals are  caught in the pot holding the sand, seems like a safety net if everything does not burn up in the hot sand.
I have no gripe with reflux, it is a result of their success that has launched this revision of the technique.
Cooking it for 7 days is not as hard as it seems.
It is unacceptable to me since there is another that takes less time
I have done the 48 hour reflux and the results were the same as far as quality and yield. The hypo method produces a better quality product, but not as good as this cold method.
I have a couple of grams of E and have an urge to do a nano.

 
 


Phlegm

  • Guest
Low temp reflux?
« Reply #35 on: January 19, 2003, 12:23:00 AM »
Just for the record, a low temp reflux of an HI/RP/pseudo mix is a bit of an oxymoron - at least at the Hive it is, being that there are two camps on this issue: those that favor long, long incubations at about 180F, and those that reflux for a much shorter period. The problem is that by definiton, reflux implies a boil. So to reflux in HI means that your rection temp is 260F - way too hot for the cool crowd.

ZingoBingo

  • Guest
Worlock & Aqua Girl . . .
« Reply #36 on: January 19, 2003, 12:28:00 AM »
. . . whose next, Popeye? ;D

A thought has occured that an ambiant temp could be realized within, say an 96 qt. EE-glue cooler, by placing a shop light within. The hard plastic shield around the light would protect the inner plastic of the cooler. External temp flucuations would be hindered internally  by the insulating qualities of the cooler. A 24 hr trial run could then be monitored using a long stem meat thermometer or digital incubator thermometer with flexable probe inserted into drain plug.  Temp's could be varied by changing light bulb wattages until the 70/80 degree range was stabilized.  PP/balloon unit could be placed within and lid snapped shut.  Should flask break (highly doubtful) goodies would be retained within cooler and, what the heck, might even continue to react. A clandestine cooler off to one side would draw less attention than wine bottles duct tapped together on top the fridge or radiator. :)   Now, if a battery source could be introduced within the cooler with sufficient amps to power the light for 4 days at a constant wattage then we'd truly have an airtight, closed system.  Heck, you could load it up in the back of the 'ol station wagon and head on over to Yellowstone for a picnic at Old Faithful and no one would be the wiser . . . 8)

ZB

ZingoBingo

  • Guest
Hmmm....
« Reply #37 on: January 19, 2003, 12:59:00 AM »
If the higher concentration of the HI is to do the trick (what I would like to be true very much as I was convinced of this for quite long a time) some pressure might be the way to go (if someone wants, as there are more ways to heaven...).
Three to five bar should be enough to hold quite high concentrations of HI solvated - also at elevated temperatures.


Perhaps then, for an oh-zee, the goods could be placed in a large open bowl within a pressure cooker.  After the lid is secure the combined works/cooker could be placed within the EE-glue warmer previously illustrated.  Maybe we could call this system the 'hatchery'.

ZB

Organikum

  • Guest
shake it if no reflux
« Reply #38 on: January 19, 2003, 02:22:00 AM »
Low speed stirring or better a swirl/shake from time to time is IMHO favorable if there is no reflux and there should be no reflux under elevated pressure as this would say temperatures far exceeding 127°C. And thats what´s to be avoided. Pressure like temperature enhances reaction speed (as a rule of thumb) so  this is thought as an exchange: Lower temperature in exchange for higher pressure. The bonus plus  coming with this setup is a much higher HI concentration and the reaction running in a more or less sealed vessel whereby stink can be avoided/reduced with ease. Push Pull pressurized. Why not? Handling the pressure of a automobil tire or tapwater is no rocket science.

Why slow and not hard stirring? I can´t tell. I have some ideas but nothing I would throw in here by now as it´s only guessing in alpha stage.  :)

ORG


Daphuk_up

  • Guest
Given the above...
« Reply #39 on: January 19, 2003, 04:37:00 AM »
Given the above methodology, and the reagent ratio I am using (2gRP:5.5gE:7gI2), would 2mL be an appropriate amount of dH2O to add before adding the I2?  Note that psuedo and RP are very very dry, but the I2 was left slightly moist to make it more stable (less likely to sublime away).  Thoughts, ideas, suggestions?  :)