The Vespiary

Site => Harm Reduction Resources => Topic started by: Azoth on September 27, 2015, 07:31:40 AM

Title: Xanax :'[ need some advice please, worried.
Post by: Azoth on September 27, 2015, 07:31:40 AM
im not sure if this is the right forum, (fuck im retarded it clearly says harm reduction) but anyways, i have been taking alprazolam for quite some time, on and off, you know on some special occasions back then where its offered but now i have been taking 1 to 4 a day (BARS, R309,s903 etc) for the past 2 months (tolerance).. xanax being the little devil it is, has made me become a social animal, and a shameless, money grubbing, yet self-less for some ( i will never lose my empathy) bastard, i meen, shit this fucking pill makes you want to just do whatever you please without any remorse or shame, its good for hitting on women, job interviews, social settings, being the awkward loner i have always been yet comfortable once i am in tune with someone, i benefited but the weight falls more on the side effects and long term effects. well the point of this post is... me and my girlfriend have been taking them everyday and well, i was gone for a week and came back and she had a seizure she is fine now but she quit cold turkey its been around 4 days but she hasnt been herself, now, me and her havent been on good terms for a while, truth is she was addicted to them before cause of an ex bf of hers, so i kinda fucked up bringing them around.. but it seemed to help me and i would take them responsibly, she would take 2-3, sometimes 4, xanax can make you take 10 and youll think your sober but your really just drooling on the floor.. its ridiculous... i found 50 missing the week i was gone..its kinda ruined our relationship, that and other things..  i am worried about her and myself, i stopped for a day and got cluster headaches, half my body was falling asleep, muscle spasms, that sort of stuff, mind you im on probation and need to quit soon i have around 18 days to quit everything, xanax weed speed, coke.. I DO NOT WANT A FUCKING SEIZURE, even though i honestly feel guilty and probably deserve one.. what is the best way to taper off this shit and not die? my girlfriend was lucky she was around people when this happend, i on the other hand probably wont be around people, i dont wanna die being alone in my room, i know magnesium, L-Theanine, vitamin B, B12, and GABA are nutrients i will need to take, along with chamomile for sleepy time.. if theres any advice my fellow vesps can give me that would be highly appreciated, i worry for my girlfriend too, she has been aggressive, depressive, and well she kinda suffers from BPD.. but i love her and want us to get through this shit and never look back again.
i am dropping 500ugs of upper white tommorow for the bloodmoon, alone, hopefully that will cure me a bit...
Title: Re: Xanax :'[ need some advice please, worried.
Post by: ijontichy on September 27, 2015, 08:12:06 AM
If you say that your girlfriend has BPD maybe Risperdal (Risperidone) might be suited for her needs, but nevertheless she should consult a therapist before starting a new type of medication. Self-medication never works as it should be.
Title: Re: Xanax :'[ need some advice please, worried.
Post by: Anthranilic on April 03, 2016, 02:04:58 PM
Phenibut is avaiable without a prescription and it should help with the withdrawals more than GABA and chamomille. Pregabalin and gabapentin would help too. And Clonazepam if you're really storngly addicted can help you taper off. If nothing is available and you want to avoid seizures, a very low-carb high-fat diet (ketogenic diet) has been shown to reduce the incidence of seizures...

Good luck!
Title: Re: Xanax :'[ need some advice please, worried.
Post by: Tsathoggua on April 04, 2016, 02:38:59 AM
Has to be extremely low for a person to go into ketosis. . valerian is a GABAa agonist,  longer acting benzos are available online as grey market RCs, to taper with

valerian tastes and smells awful be warned and ive found it induces intense vivid dreaming first few days of use
Title: Re: Xanax :'[ need some advice please, worried.
Post by: Scarecrow on April 07, 2016, 04:37:16 AM
Taper off with Clonaz dude. Or if you cant get it, smoke weed and reduce your dose by a quarter every 2 days or whatever you feel comfortable with. I always found codeine (OTC where I am from) was the best/most available thing for me to taper off Alpraz, although ive never been really addicted although I did feel hyper sensitive/anxious in the days of abstinence following maybe 3 or 4 consecutive days of use.

Id strongly recommend going to a doctor and talking to them about this and say that your goal is to be completely off benzodiazepines. Pregablin as Anthrallic said is a good option for this.
Title: Re: Xanax :'[ need some advice please, worried.
Post by: poisoninthestain on April 07, 2016, 05:23:12 PM
As a psychiatric Registered Nurse who works on a dual diagnosis unit (psych with drug and alcohol diagnoses) you SHOULD NEVER cold turkey benzos as you can have a seizure obviously.  The typical tx for the taper is Librium(Chlorodiazepoxide) 25mg 3x daily or Clonazepam 1mg up to three times daily. The reason being the half-life is much longer on these two benzos compared to Ativan or Xanax. In your case it will take a minimum of 1-3 months to be out of the range of seizure thresholds at the doses you mentioned.  Most psychiatrists I work with prefer the Librium taper but Klonopin will do a decent job.  If you live in the USA and have insurance it's pretty cheap to stay a month or so in a detox unit.  Beaming you good vibes.

When no other options are available OTC valerian root works fair.  If you notice your hands have a tremor buy some immediately and take a healthy dose.  Since valerian root has valerazepam (think that's the one) even though it's only a partial GABA agonist it's enough to stop seizure activity.
Title: Re: Xanax :'[ need some advice please, worried.
Post by: Tsathoggua on April 07, 2016, 06:25:13 PM
Smoking weed may help ease anxiety but it may prove to do the opposite due to the way cannabinoid agonism at CB1 acts as a kind of gain control mechanism within the architecture of neural circuits. CB1 is a presynaptic receptor that exhibits a rather uncommon and unusual manner of signalling. Instead of as happens at most synaptically located receptors (as opposed to e.g glial cells, and receptor-independent signalling through gap-junction channels), Usually the presynaptic neuron releases neurotransmitter in response to receiving sufficient input from the depolarization of other cells summing together until sufficient to trigger the firing of an action potential, which then stimulates  that cell's  presynaptic receptor in receipt of the action potential targeted by the neurotransmitter in question to release its own signalling neurotransmitters, fire off their own action potentials etc.

The CB1 cannabinoid receptor on the other hand is an oddball. Located presynaptically, CB1Rs activate in response to various different endocannabinoids, often based upon an eicosanoid fatty acid derivative of some sort, although there do exist ones which are not fatty acids. Once released from the postsynaptic neuron the endocannabinoids travel in their rare manner of retrograde transport, back to the presynaptic neuron where they bind and activate CB1, resulting in an overall decrease in neurotransmitter release, of both GABA, the prime inhibitory neurotransmitter, and glutamate, the major excitatory player.

Whilst benzos potentiate the effects of GABA at GABAa receptors, leading to increased conductance and Cl- ion flux through the heteropentameric ion channel, and thereby exerting GABAs inhibitory effect upon neuronal firing with response to excitatory input. This is reduced in benzo dependence, and indeed the downregulation/desensitization/internalization etc. of GABAa receptors and consequent awful effects of benzo WD.

If you cannot obtain a suitable benzo or other GABAa positive modulator (what are usually spoken of as agonists are in fact almost always allosteric positive modulators at GABAa rather than true orthosteric agonists (those which share a binding site with GABA itself, these are actually quite uncommon and the range of such ligands is relatively limited, vastly fewer are known than there are
allosteric regulators (like the benzos, barbs, carbamates, quinazolinones ala methaqualone, loreclezole, chlormethiazole, chloral hydrate, trional, tetronal and sulfonal, etomidate, propofol etc)
this being probably because the steric and chemical structural requirements imposed for an agonist of the GABA binding site itself are quite strict.

Benzo withdrawal isn't anything to fuck around with lightly, do not get caught short without at least sufficient supply to last until you can actually attend the earliest available appointment with a dr. This is especially valid in the case of short-acting drugs, like alprazolam and most of the other triazolobenzodiazepines, because things can go from having taken a dose sufficient to remain asymptomatic to plasma levels having dropped to dangerous territory, and because the action of benzos is anticonvulsant and anxiolytic, acute withdrawal onset can be capable of physically incapacitating the sufferer and preventing them seeking help.

There are quite a lot of benzos available now these days online on the 'research chemical'/'RC' grey market scene.
A long-acting one is what you want for doing a controlled taper, short acting drugs are usually pretty shitty options for tapering off a substance to which one has established a physical dependency. This is because one ends up with many repeated peaks and troughs in drug plasma levels, which makes for a lot less tolerable, more uncomfortable, harder to manage and CERTAINLY its not conducive to maintaining a stable steady-state plasma level without many  unpleasant sudden variations.

In the case of DHC, this is annoying, with a stronger opiate, like when Tsath used to get and shoot a lot of OC80s its outright painful.

With a benzo, 'utterly horrific' is the entry-level scale of horrible experience.

Poisoninthestain is quite correct in stating that you SHOULDN'T FUCKING WELL EVER attempt to cold turkey from GABAergics. The seizure risk, and not to mention just the withdrawal symptoms are in and of themselves, without suffering a seizure, absolutely brutal. Benzo, and other GABAergic drug withdrawal makes opiate withdrawal even from severe opiate habits look like a wonderful treat by comparison.

As far as librium tapers go (librium is chlordiazepoxide), actually, having done it once,  didn't find it much use at all really. Chlordiazepoxide has one useful trait and one only, its long duration of action. Which is far from unique amongst the benzos. Otherwise its not worth a streak of cat piss. For a true emergency to prevent seizure, or chlordiazepoxide is the ONLY option, then go for it. otherwise pretty much any benzo is better than that one.

of the prescribed benzos, nitrazepam would be the one that Tsath would personally recommend, due to its combination of very respectable potency, long duration of action, and strongly hypnotic and anxiolytic, and as well as doing a very effective job at preventing seizures, its long lasting enough for it not to result in any nasty surprises on waking up.
And its got enough of a hypnotic and anxiolytic effect to it to help make things pretty painless if the taper is done slowly enough as it should bee.

You should make sure to IGNORE the dangerous, ignorant garbage ofifered up as advice by scarecrow with respect to dose reduction.
Scarecrow-you shouldn't go making suggestions to people that have a large benzo physical dependency follow a detox schedule  you yourself used to taper from a mere few fuckin days for cunt-cancer's bloody sake, especially when you knew it wasn't enough, because even then, YOU still felt rough.

By a quarter every 2 days? thats going from the level the subject requires detoxing from to zero in a mere week and a day.
That would be stupid and dangerous, not to mention bloody uncomfortable and generally equating to much misery and torment for the person having to endure it.

1/4 every 2 days would be suitable for only the ABSOLUTE mildest, most farty insignificant levels of habituation physically possible, I.e a week or two's light dose regime of benzos, longer w/ the Z-drugs Tsath would think because they are so much weaker, and less prone to proconvulsant effects of WD, especially in the case of zaleplon, as its so pissweak as to be barely active in the first place :P

For grey market benzos, do make sure that you STICK to your taper plan.  Get enough to permit following the taper from initiation through to end point and being benzo-free, to make sure that one cannot be forcibly dropped in it at the deep end by means of the chosen taper agent by the government filth infesting your country.