The Vespiary

The Hive => Chemicals & Equipment => Topic started by: NaXen on July 14, 2004, 11:21:00 PM

Title: Another homebrew condenser...w/ pics
Post by: NaXen on July 14, 2004, 11:21:00 PM
Heres another solution to those numerous 'How do I make a condenser' questions... which SWIN finds to be superior to the classic PVC/ABS pipe setup.

This setup uses glass UV lightbulbs, 2 to be precise... the first being approx. 350mm x 17mmID and the second being approx. 400mm x 10mmID. These bulbs are THICK WALLED, 2-3mm, and can be easily manipulated with SLOW heating w/ a propane or similar torch, as well as cut using a dremel equipped with a suitable cutoff wheel. (not the fiberglass kind...diamond wheels are required to make a clean cut)

Anyhow.. take the larger of the two tubes and begin by making a hole in the top and bottom (refer to picture...) one way is to use the dremel to cut a notch and then the torch to make the holes round and smooth. make the holes large enough to fit a section of rubber hose (tightly) these will be your water in/out ports  :)

So once you have this larger tube with 2 holes in it, take the smaller tube and wrap vinyl electrical tape around it until its built up the same size as the inside of the larger tube. Only wrap one side for now...

push the smaller tube all the way inside the larger tube so that the vinyl 'plug' is about an inch inside the larger tube. Now make a similar plug on the bottom and push it through to make a sealed chamber. You may want to recess the plugs about 1/2" so that the end spaces can be filled with silicone sealant. SWIN has not found this to be necessesary. I think thats it...

Title: Niceee... swim loves making ghetto equipment.
Post by: 12cheman12 on July 15, 2004, 05:30:00 AM
Niceee... swim loves making ghetto equipment.
Its alot more satisfactory when using ones own home made equipment he thinks.
Do you mind showing us a picture of the holes you made in the globe and possibly with the tubes in?
Title: Great Idea
Post by: abominator on July 17, 2004, 08:11:00 AM
Good work NaXen, similar to SHORTY's flourescent air condenser.  This takes it to the next level with the water flow.  Looks to be very do-able and "ghetto friendly".

Glad NaXen included a diagram and actual pic of finished condenser.

Has NaXen tested this setup during rxn?

Title: Havent tried it in a "real" reaction
Post by: NaXen on July 22, 2004, 10:49:00 AM
Havent tried it in a "real" reaction yet, but it was tested with some plain water and it condensed very quickly with cold tap water (most within the first 6") I will take some more pics of the holes with tubing inside and post asap.  :)  thanks for all the +ve feedback!

Title: light bulbs and electrical tape?
Post by: calcium on July 22, 2004, 11:42:00 AM
So, you are just melting two holes in the outer jacket for water in and out and sticking hoses into the holes?

It sounds doomed to failure.

Why not make the outer jacket out of pvc (or the like) pipe and fittings w/ glass inner jacket?

Why not just order a cheap one on an auction site?

This thing will work fine until you use it for real.

What if it fails during a reaction. Then what?
Title: Another air condensor
Post by: evilscripter69 on July 22, 2004, 10:07:00 PM
glass tubing (minimum 5') bend it into coils about 10" diameter(more coils/better it works) bend ends according to your intended use. Works very well, just be careful of bumping it on hard surfaces  :)
Title: Anather homebrew condenser...
Post by: XeF6 on July 22, 2004, 10:27:00 PM
Teflon pipes - is very useful material for Air and water condenser.
Very useful for any kind distilattion and rectification condensers and pipes.

Good luck
Be careful
Title: scripter just for the record
Post by: barkingburro on July 22, 2004, 10:27:00 PM
have you ever actually tried to take a 5ft tube of glass and bend it into coils? i mean really? cause i have and i have some pretty fucking hot torches, mapp, propane/oxy, mapp/oxy and an assortment of heads to go with it. the shit aint easy. not easy at all. first question for you is what are you wrapping this white/orange hot glass around to make these oh so fab coils? and don't say you do it by gravity, cause i know thats bs. how do you keep from kinking the ends when you alter the direction of the coil back into linear? cause if it's really this and that easy please hook a brutha up and gives me some insight.
Title: I agree with bb, Fuck the coils, things are...
Post by: ambi on July 23, 2004, 12:51:00 AM
I agree with bb,
Fuck the coils, things are never easy as they first might seem, it is possible, but the learning curve and effort, is not worth it, when you can just increase the length of tubing, or use colder water,.

ambi( ex glass blower)
Title: Well BB, Seeing as you mentioned it i shall...
Post by: p2e3r4f5e6c7t8 on July 23, 2004, 07:56:00 AM
Well BB, Seeing as you mentioned it i shall give my opinion on how i have seen it done. ;)

Fill the tubing up with sand And that will or should stp the kinks when bending the glass tube :(
I have actuly done it with copper pipe and i belive copper plumbing pipe would bee more susceptible to kinks and folding instead of just bending ;)

Anyway good luck getto enthusiasts  ;)

Title: Glass Coils
Post by: PolyesterSpam on July 23, 2004, 08:42:00 AM
Making a glass coil is difficult. Filling with sand is not a good idea. For a start, the sand will stick to the soft glass.

From Procedures in Experimental Physics (John Strong 1938):



Title: uhm not to be an ass, but im pissy
Post by: barkingburro on July 23, 2004, 04:34:00 PM
fnny thatyou'd suggest filling the glass tubing with sand, since glass is oddly enough made from hot silicates, also known as SAND. i think i'll pass on adding sand to hot glass, but thank you for trying.
Title: nice jpeg
Post by: ambi on July 23, 2004, 07:40:00 PM
To master a simple right angled joint , is around $ 50.00 glass lossed, mapp gas,.etc,.
Yes it a beautiful medium,;glass,
It just takes a bit of practive,
You wil need at least a mapp gass, or higher, to achieve this on a 5mm diameter tube, 1 mm wall thickness, the bigger the glass the more  the tendacny to go [comp. air, and propane(gas bbq),].

It is worth it, in some cases,

Title: ehem
Post by: p2e3r4f5e6c7t8 on July 24, 2004, 08:09:00 AM
Is anyone talking from experince when you say sand wont work ?
The above is just a question ? ,Nothing else because wouldent theSAND have a higer melting point then GLASS ?
And no i havent used TFSE  :o  :P

Title: "Is anyone talking from experince..."
Post by: calcium on July 24, 2004, 09:03:00 AM
No one who has done it for real, not just seen it done(to copper tubing!)would be dumb enough to fill a glass tube with sand and then heat it to plastic deformation temps.

Buy a condenser.
Title: Sand
Post by: PolyesterSpam on July 24, 2004, 02:39:00 PM
as calcium says, I wouldn't bother. Glassworking is an acquired skill - I've never tried anything as complicated as a spiral and I reckon I'd muck it up the first couple of times. The sand won't melt, but it will stick to the glass, and you don't need sand to make a smooth bend with glass anyway.

I've got the rest of the chapter on working glass if anyone is interested. Maybe I could dejavu it.

Title: Re: I've got the rest of the chapter on ...
Post by: abominator on July 24, 2004, 07:26:00 PM

I've got the rest of the chapter on working glass if anyone is interested. Maybe I could dejavu it.

Post it!

Title: there is an obvious difference between those
Post by: barkingburro on July 25, 2004, 09:40:00 AM
who have experience  and those who arem just throwing out left field suggestions. this is the reason i posted the rebuke in thte first place. no-one who has ever worked glass would come and in 3 lines tell others that they can solve thier problems by just heating and coiling a glass tube - lickity split. i guess the missed point here is
DON'T TALK OUT OF YOUR ASS - lord knows we all do it from time to time. but sometimes you have to ask yourself this question before posting : do i really have any clue what i am talking about? or am i just trying to look as if i know whats going on.

trust me, i know from experience : keeping your mouth shut and just reading and nodding your head will get you alot further than haveing shit smelling breath.
now that the ran is over i will follow with a set of condensor designs
Title: screwed and condensed
Post by: barkingburro on July 25, 2004, 09:41:00 AM
ok here's my fav ghetto fab design its good for quick breakdown and storage :

condensed and screwed

principle of design - a large ghetto fab condensor designed to break down into modular pieces for ease of hiding and transport.

note : all plumbing type pieces are CPVC unless stated otherwise, all connections on CPVC is threaded unless stated other wise.

1 4 ft tube of 1/2" pyrex or 1/2" flourescent light tubing with ends squared off (pyrex works best)
1 4ft 1 1/4" acrylic flourescent light sheath
2 1 1/4" T's
2 1 1/4"(m) to 1/2"(f) reducers
2 1 1/4"(m) to 3/4"(f) reducers
2 pvc 1 1/4"(m) to 1 1/4"(f)socketed bushings (socketed is flush)
2 brass 3/4" nipples (m to m)
2 brass garden hose quick connects
2 1/2" rubber grommets or thick rubber washers
pvc cement
silicon sealant(may not be needed)
teflon tape
dremel (with glass cutting wheel and carbide tile bit)
mapp or propane plumbers torch (mapp is best)

1 > first decide on size and cut acrylic tubing to accomidate. then roughen external surface of each end and set aside. then roughen inside surface of each flush pvc bushing. apply pvc cement and/or silicon sealant to all roughened surfaces, insert acrylic into pvc and put aside. take care to align the screw ends of the pvc so that the beginning of the threading is on the same plane facing the same way or on the same plane facing opposit. this will determin it=f your intake/outakes are on the same or opposite sides of the condensor.

2> once cement/sealant is thoroughly dried take acrylic/pvc 'window' and loosly attach at at both end, and also 1 - 1 1/4" to 1/2" reducer on each end.grind/sand down the threads in each of the end reducers to allow 1/2 glass to slide snugly though. use this rough construct as a tool to decide on the length of the inner glass tubing. mark tubing at one end approximately where the tubing is going to meet the reducer on the inside.. do this for both ends.

3> take your glass rod and cap one end, then heat the glass as evenly as possible around one of your markings. blow the glass so that the diameter is about 3/4". let cool and repeat for other end.

4> now its time to assemble the condensor. wraps all threads with teflon tape. now assemble. heres the order brass quick connect to brass nipple, brassnipple to reducer, reducer to T - repeat that for the second  T. now screw the tees onto the 'window' and you should be left with the grommets, the inner glass tubing and the two reducers that cap the T's. place the gromets on the outer sides of each 3/4" bulge and then slip the reducers down onto the ends of the glass. if needed you may want to add an o ring to the insode of the reducer. now carefully screw in each end a lil at a time and try to keep the number of rotations the same. do this back and forth until both ends start to tighten. now heres the tricky part, and will take two large gripping tookls of some sort. on each end you will grip the reducer with one tool and the T with the other. slowly tighten the ends until both take alot of effort to move. if you get it too tight yopu'll never getthe fucker apart, and that kinda defeaets it''s purpose.

then attach hoses to quick conects and trouble shoot any leaks. there should be none :D

and thats it. aside from building the window pipe piece and grinding down the threads and then blowing the glass it takes nor significant building expertise aside from being able to screw.
Title: KOnDENSEr
Post by: Bozakium on July 30, 2004, 01:14:00 PM
UV bulb glass, nice, but electrical tape, come on, ever heard of a cork/rubber stopper?

Glasswork is definitely a harder skill than sweating copper pipe. Anyoneone wanna make a nice copper condenser with little to no custom fucking around?
  I wanna do a TV show called MonsterLab.
Title: Glasswork is really not that hard, i have an...
Post by: ApprenticeCook on July 30, 2004, 06:11:00 PM
Glasswork is really not that hard, i have an artist friend who makes artworks from glass, has the furnace and does all sorts of weird and wonderful things....
Its the accuracy required to make lab gear which is hard...

He isnt very science tuned (not many artists are) so i decided a while ago to see if he could make a RBF (simple to make a round bottom bottle in his eyes) showed him a drawing and he went to work....

Didnt turn out to bad, was right shape, even all the way around... but its hard to get volumes, ended up (after cooling and setting) fitting in 2.37L of water to the brim.
The only problem with it was that the walls were not thick enough (i didnt specify this when he was making it... doh!) and the rim could not be ground to a certain socket size as 1) the glass was to thin and 2) he doesnt have that equiptment.

So if someone can learn to gring the glass joints and find the equip to do it properly, easy, a normal glassworker can make it provided you specify the requirements of it...


Title: Glass Blowing
Post by: lugh on July 31, 2004, 05:41:00 PM
This chapter on glass blowing by Hershberg, found in Fieser's Experiments in Organic Chemistry shows how to construct a condenser from borosilicate glass, bends,  grinding it et cetera  ;)



Title: If the only way for you to get flasks is ...
Post by: Osmium on August 01, 2004, 11:51:00 AM
If the only way for you to get flasks is having them custom made then you are fucked, because that simply is too expensive.
No glassblower produces ground joints themselves anymore, they buy them and then put them on whatever glassware when repairing shit or building specialized equipment.

Title: Two words
Post by: abolt on August 01, 2004, 10:09:00 PM
Stainless Steel