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isomerizing attempts and questions...!

Started by hCiLdOdUeDn, November 22, 2002, 05:39:00 PM

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GOD

If you suspect that isomerisation was a failure, and the quickest way to do this is by taking an atm bp-, if it boils @ safroles bp, then chill and add a seed crystal (of safrole).  If it isnt below -15 or whatever the melting point of iso, you may bee able to actually freeze out a good portion of unreacted safrole.  I just offered this suggestion as another alternative for verifying what was left after an isomerisation.  Swim managed to separate un-isomerised safrole from a botched oxone run this way, he had vac distilled, but got one solid fraction going from safroles bp up to ketones bp for his too strong of a pump (this was before he learned to slow it down, and use a vigreux)

Im not the bearded man upstairs, Im a bald guy with a healthy penis. So open yer pie-hole!

chem_123

SWIM thanks you.

It tastes like burning! :o  :P

hCiLdOdUeDn

Inspection of swims supposed CaO was indeed Ca(OH)2. Upon reaction with water no heat was given off. Ca(OH)2 needs to be heated with a blow torch to turn into CaO.

Unfortunatley swims homemade alcohol burner doesnt cut it.

Sink or SWIM

hCiLdOdUeDn

Swim did an atomospheric bp of sassafras oil and suspected isosafrole. Both came over at ~230C  :(  :(

What the *&^! is up with my isomerization process? I did the KOH/CaO (which failed because it was Ca(OH)2. I also did at atomospheric isomerization using 5% NaOH. Arragh!!

Time to go the chem store and buy REAL CaO....

Sink or SWIM

RoundBottom

this is the easiest method i've seen...

Post 278285

(RoundBottom: "Re: vacuum refluxing", Chemistry Discourse)
, it's not rocket science, people.

Now with 12% more Bottom!
Nymphomania is not a disease, its a goal! (Methadist)

dr_ruthenium

Does anyone have thoughts for SWIDR's last post?  Has anyone never been able to get iso to distill at >250 C?!  Also, The Isomerization of Safrole: A Review on Rhodium's page citing boiling iso at 120-130 @25mm Hg (Isomerization with KOH/CaO) is wrong indeed.  At 25mm Hg the B.P. of trans-iso should be 137.5 C.  (The cis-iso might boil in the upper end of that range though.)


TRISMUS!!!

Rhodium

Has anyone never been able to get iso to distill at >250°C?!

Oh yes, certainly! If you let the reaction go on for a while, any formed iso will convert to the trans form.

Here's all the physical data published on Isosafrole in Beilstein:

5-cis-propenyl-benzo[1,3]dioxole (cis-isosafrole)
mp -21.5°C1
bp 77-79°C/3.5mmHg1

5-trans-propenyl-benzo[1,3]dioxole (trans-isosafrole)
mp 6.6°C2
mp 8.2°C1
bp 86-86°C/3.4mmHg1

1: Bull.Soc.Chim.Fr. 1053-1056 (1957)
2: Z. Phys.Chem. 167; 407-419 (1934)

Isosafrole, cis/trans unspecified

252.4-252.7°C/768mmHg - Chem.Ber.; 42; 1909; 3080.
252°C/760mmHg - Ann. Soc. scient. Bruxelles; 48; 1928; 122.
253.5°C/735.4, 179.5°C/100, 135.6°C/20 and 120.2°C/10mmHg - Rechenberg,C.; Einfache und fraktionierte Destillation, 2. Aufl. , S. 300.   
120°C/15mmHg - Acta Pol.Pharm.; 17; 1960; 241,242; Chem.Abstr.; 55; 14351; 1961.
125-127°C/16mmHg - J.Amer.Chem.Soc.; 47; 1925; 1149.
127-128°C/15mmHg - J.Prakt.Chem.; <2> 115; 1927; 332.
131°C/17mmHg -

Bull.Soc.Chim.Fr.; 1964; 1892.

(https://www.thevespiary.org/rhodium/Rhodium/pdf/benzodioxole.deriviatives.pdf)
112-116°C/12mmHg - Ann.Chim.(Rome); 52; 1962; 1261,1263.
123°C/11.5mmHg - Chem.Ber.; 42; 1909; 3080.
116-117°C/9mmHg
111-112°C/6mmHg - Rocz.Chem.; 39; 1965; 1251,1255; Chem.Abstr.; 64; 12656.

Isosafrole, selected syntheses

Synth.Commun. 23(10), 1379-1384 (1993) - Safrole isomerization, KOH/Aliquat 336 (5%), 5min @ 80°C
J.Chem.Soc.Perkin Trans.1 2307-2326 (1985) - Erythro Horner-Wittig, NaH/DMF, 30min @ 50°C, 85% trans-iso, 4% cis-isosafrole
Tetrahedron Lett. 24(36), 3931-3934 (1983) - Erythro Horner-Wittig, NaH/DMF, 60min @ 50°C, 84% cis-isosafrole
J.Chem.Soc.Perkin Trans.1, 19, 2393-2397 (2001) -

Post 385717

(Rhodium: "Isosafrole via Wittig Olefination of Piperonal", Novel Discourse)

J.Pharm.Sci. 81(12), 1219-1222 (1992) -

Post 431447

(FriendlyFinger: "Safrole Isomerising methods", Methods Discourse)
Safrole Isomerization (KOH/n-BuOH, 3h @ RT, 98% trans-isosafrole)
Tet. Lett. 27(22), 2529-2532 (1986) - Allylbromide/5-Bromobenzodioxole/PdCl2(dppf)/Et2O, 65% trans-isosafrole
Synthesis 701-703 (1983) - beta-MeS-3,4-MD-styrene/MeMgI, PPh3/NiCl2, Benzene/Ether, 68%
J Braz Chem Soc 11(4), 371-374 (2000) -

Post 431447

(FriendlyFinger: "Safrole Isomerising methods", Methods Discourse)
Safrole Isomerization (KOH/n-BuOH, 3h @ reflux, 95% yield)

hCiLdOdUeDn

Thanks for the info!

A good way to check for sucessful isomerization if you are unsure about the boiling points of safrole/isosafrole is to add 20mL of sassafras oil to the isomerized oil and distill together. This way you will see the boiling point of safrole first, then after ~20mL later it will shoot 10-15C higher and then collect your isosafrole as you will know the correct temperature. This worked for SWIM ;)

Sink or SWIM

dr_ruthenium

Thanks for the references Rhod!!!
hidden CLOUD said "it will shoot 10-15C higher", referring to iso- boiling point compared to safole.  This would mean 244-249 C, since safrole's B.P. is 234 C.  Well, SWIDR's safrole boils at 230-234 C, and iso- boils at exactly 16 C higher (246-250 C).  This has been repeated multiple times with the exact same results.  SWIDR has never been able to get iso- to boil >250 C, nor has SWIDR seen the broad temp range that Rhod's Isomerization Review referred to ("the trans isomer boils at approx 10°C higher than the cis, so the isosafrole isomers are usually collected as a mixture over a temperature range").  SWIDR would expect that isomerizations have been successful, however is still stumped by what not-ketone really is (slightly lighter in color, less viscous, boils 5-10 C higher than ketone, and does not aminate).  Parameters were as per buffered performic (scaled up to 3 mol) and oxone (scaled up to 1 mol) oxidations from Rhod's web page.

TRISMUS!!!