Author Topic: A newbee who needs help.  (Read 866 times)

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filthysock

  • Guest
A newbee who needs help.
« on: February 05, 2004, 11:17:00 PM »
Hey.  I'm just a newbie with almost no clue about chemistry.  I was wondering where a good place to start would be?  I have like no clue about names used in chemistry, what differant things mean and stuff.  I would just like to know where a good place would be to start, like what fun and interesting things can I make with things I can buy in shops or hardware stores...
I just need a place to start.  Are there any helpfull documents I could read (yeah I've read the welcome note for newbies here at the hive but even reading a paragraph of those documents is enough to make my head spin).  I'm a fast learner and very dedicated to learning about chemistry, I just want to take the back way and not the school-way.  Well, can anybody help, give advice, anything?  I am kind of desperate.

I live at a dormitory now, so I cant fiddle with chemicals that much in the dormitory kitchen (some empty weekends could work though) and I'll be getting a place of my own in 2 years, untill then I just want to fill my brain up with knowledge and experience.

embezzler

  • Guest
well for a start
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2004, 11:24:00 PM »
buy some chemistry books for college level beginners. they are informative and probably the best place to start also the

http://www.sciencemadness.org

board has a beginner forum. there is a lot of theorey available if you cant start with the technical skills straight away

aleph

  • Guest
Getting Started
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2004, 12:21:00 AM »
I recommend getting into some chemistry courses if possible.  Pay particular attention to the labs for practical hints and experience.  For a jump-start in the clandestine lab, Strike has written books of interest.  I found Total Synthesis II to be helpful....  There are, no doubt, quite a number of useful books available, and, of course, the hive :-)


foxy2

  • Guest
even reading a paragraph of those documents is
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2004, 01:57:00 AM »
even reading a paragraph of those documents is enough to make my head spin).  I'm a fast learner and very dedicated to learning about chemistry, I just want to take the back way and not the school-way.

Quit being a lazy piece of shit and read. If you really want a clue take basic chem and organic chem, then after thise 2 years you'll bee ready to start.  Don't take chem for morons either, make sure you take chem for chem majors.  Some large institutions like to have chem for morons classes.


hester18

  • Guest
Yes, University level classes are the way to start
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2004, 07:39:00 AM »
University level, general chem and organic chem are a must before even thinking obout any syntheses. Labs are particularly important, if you have never been in a lab and go to do a synth you will have no initiative. Even with your first few labs, its intimidating being in a lab but thats why the more time you spend mixing solutions the better. Also if you want to obtain any decent glassware without spending a fortune, you must aquire it from the university lab by any means necessary. What ever time you dont spend in the lab or reading the course text spend on the hive and you will be all set.
~Hester18

DrugsRCool

  • Guest
Where to begin
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2004, 08:41:00 AM »
Besides gen chem and org chem classes (and most importantly the labs) www.rhodium.ws is very, very useful.  Also find a copy of the organic chem lab survival manual.  This one even proved helpful while taking the lab.  Find yourself a copy of a Sigma-Aldrich catalog (those things R great) and a merck index.  then get some more books (yes, total synthesis 2 is good but I couldnt even understand it till I was working my way through organic).  Love is the best way to learn this stuff,  99% of the people I talk to hated organic, I loved it.  Go ahead and call me a nerd I don’t give a shit I’m still getting more ass than most of you.   

Remember, SAFETY first.  Build yourself a fume hood with adequate exhaust and get a fire extinguisher (class A,B, and C or 1,2, and 3 whatever the fuck it is).  I don’t recommend doing it anywhere on campus (except in graduate labs ha ha).  Get an idea of what you want to make (you already know) and start buying shit.  Its expensive if you are like me and are a poor fucking college student and getting all this stuff took me awhile even while I was robbing the school blind.  When ordering do it all with money orders.  Oh ya, the guy who wrote total synthesis 2 also wrote a book called sources.

Oh ya, UTFSE (use the fucking search engine).  I haven't had too many questions it cant answer.

Surf through an anonymous proxy server, setup a firewall or six.

Have fun and enjoy the ride.

sassypants

  • Guest
don't knock the school-way
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2004, 06:35:00 PM »
there is a reason that traditional "school" has been a standard method for teaching for so long.... it works. Hell, I took 3 organic chems in school (but didn't pay attention as well as should have, never dreamed I'd become a bee)AND worked in a prefessional chem. lab for almost 3 years... I could still use more school. If you don't have room in your schedule for electives, or can't afford more classes, then read up. The "organic chemistry lab survival manual" is helpful. Can find it on amazon.

Snakebyte

  • Guest
I agree with foxy. How can u say u r dedicated
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2004, 08:32:00 PM »
I agree with foxy.  How can u say u r dedicated to learn about chemistry when u want to "take the back way out".  You can't even read the newbee page without whining.  I'm not trying to discourage u  but chemistry can be very dangerous for those who take shortcuts with knowlegde and equipment.  Just read the "stupid mistakes thread" and look at all the accidents posted and most of those people know chemistry to some extent.  If u serious about learning and don't want to take any courses then pick something simple like GHB or meth and read post after post after post.  I have a little university chemistry under my belt but when i decided to start doing some shit i read post after post on the Hive for about 3-4 hours every second night for exactly 1 year...and that was sticking to the simple shit.  During this time u can start accumulating the "proper" equipment u'll need because trying to using mickey mouse glassware and ghetto equipment can cost u you your life.  Buddy above is right about making a fumehood...only bees that know their shit should be working beside a window.  If u want to take the easy way out go find a hobby that won't be dangerous to u and others around.  Also, u might think that u must have patience to do all this shit...if i had patience i wouldn't have learned anything about drug synthesis or dreamt about building a wicked lab.  Don't fuck around!


biotechdude

  • Guest
dot com education
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2004, 04:04:00 AM »
Literature at the hive assumes you have a basic chemistry knowledge.  Eg on reactions, nomenclature, equipment, safety etc.

These things need to be learnt before venturing into clandestine methods.  You cant just think 'i can copy that' without knowing the who what where when and why..

The reason being for example - you goto order your first chems - the clerk asks you a chem question - u go "d'uh - me not know"....and that source is fucked and you'd better hope your registered car isn't parked out front...

Search google; they will have academic sites with whole first year chem class lecture notes...start at the start and see how u go.  Read detailed experiment protocol to learn lab techniques....then procedd with caution yourself and test your skills.

Swix is an educated bee; and he struggles, tries his hardest and mostly finds success... u need to have that head start to win the race

Or u can copy and bluff..but you'll be like every other doped out convicted hypo cook taught by the bikers...

aleph

  • Guest
Shame on you, Hester.
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2004, 03:01:00 PM »
Shame on you, Hester.  Don't encourage bees to steal their equipment, particularly not from schools.  Spending your own money on equipment (and supplies) instills a respect for the equipment that only the resulting lack of discretionary funds can buy.


filthysock

  • Guest
Thanks alot bees
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2004, 04:53:00 PM »
Thanks alot...
I dont live in the usa though so I can't just pick courses and add them to my schedule.  Where I'm from its like you choose chemistry and get stuck with it for like 3-5 years and then get your major, so I'm not going to do that now that I'm in the middle of something else, maybe later in life.  How long did it take for you serious bees to make something interesting for the first time with your education/knowledge... starting from scratch (and I dont mean GHB or Meth)?

BTW, as of now I'm searching around the rhodium, hive and general internet for all sorts of information.  Learning what I can.

DrugsRCool

  • Guest
First of all, I wouldnt give up on GHB or Meth
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2004, 10:30:00 PM »
First of all, I wouldnt give up on GHB or Meth because you have start somewhere and these could be good second and third steps.  Maybe start with extracting DXM from cough syrup. 

If you are willing to work this can bee done.  It will take a lot of reading on your own.  I assume you can do basic algebra.  Fuck school.  Start with a gen chem book, amazon.com has a wide variety of choices.  The only good thing about school is the experience it gives you in lab.  Thats why you start what something easy and work your way up.  Plus lots of reading.  Read, read, read, read, read. 

No, on second thought go to school.  I think it makes world a safer place.

Master_Alchemist

  • Guest
First Drug Synthesis!
« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2004, 02:42:00 AM »
Funny you should mention DXM extraction from cough syrup!
Brings back memories of when swim first employed an a/b to extract a drug.  :)  
Codeine extraction was next but then swim tried to get morphine out of pills the same way!What a disaster that was, i think i even drank some  :(
Swim then diverted his attention to Kitty and then to meth.
I would rate my chemistry knowledge as mediocre compared to
some of bees around here, but I only attempt things that are
within my reach. As a result i am still breathing!!


filthysock

  • Guest
Well...
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2004, 08:28:00 AM »
Well I dont know if its too far of a jump but I'm allready studying the synthesis of DMT.  I've read a synth, written it over, taken notes from it and I'm just filling out the gaps that I dont understand along the way.  Thats how I learn, read things I try to understand and work my way through it with information from other sources... and thats just about the only way I can teach myself at this moment in life.  The GHB synthesis seemed more like a recipe to a cake than the synthesis of a drug :) , but its nice to know it now ;) , meth too, but is meth really helpfull stepping stone into chemistry?
What about kitty though?  What the fuck is that?  By the way, GHB, is that the same as NaGHB?
PS:
I will probably be asking some really stupid newbie questions as long as I cant find the answer on TFSE... but I may need a tutor of some sort the day I put my  knowledge into practice, no help goes unjustified and any help is much appreciated, peace.

fanofshulgin

  • Guest
Buy this book
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2004, 03:56:00 AM »
I can honestly say that in all my time doing chemistry, i have never come across a text as good as this.  This textbook starts from highschool chemistry and takes you through to PhD level in a very logical and READABLE manner. You can almost read it like a novel.  Forget hopeless march, with no mechanistic detail!  This book has arrow pushing for ALL reactions.  This book WILL gain you at least one extra grade in examinations.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0198503466/qid=1076381613//ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/102-7241044-7244951?v=glance&s=books&n=507846



I know its expensive.........go see if its in your library!  But most of all know that this book will make the biggest difference to your chemistry knowledge.

And no! Im not one of the authors.

Fan of Shulgin


EDIT:  This book is not ONLY just mechanistic organic chemistry....its EVERYTHING an organic chemist needs for his/her Bsc / Masters and into PhD....NMR, IR, UV...the works.....damn i wished i had shares in their publisher!


Kinetic

  • Guest
Buy that book!
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2004, 11:12:00 PM »
I never thought I'd see that textbook recommended here as it was originally published in the UK. I second everything fanofshulgin says about it; it is written by Cambridge lecturers - though published by Oxford (oh, the irony) - who really know what they're talking about.

It is a comprehensive book for all general organic chemistry; so well written that the preliminary chapters cover such basic material as 'how to draw organic molecules', making it suitable for newbees, yet manages to cover everything required for a 3 (or more) year undergraduate course in Chemistry over the next 45 or so chapters.

The book is far cheaper in the UK, only about £40.

I hear the front cover makes an excellent surface to snort various drugs from too. My copy has a faded/worn diagonal line right across it.

baalchemist

  • Guest
Make some iso-merized hash oil.
« Reply #16 on: February 13, 2004, 02:32:00 PM »
Make some iso-merized hash oil. Thats a great starter, and it is a fairly safe procedure that requires little in the way of chems & equipment. That will give you extraction,refluxing, & A/B experience in an afternoon.


gsus

  • Guest
best cheap book for the beginner
« Reply #17 on: February 13, 2004, 11:50:00 PM »
an excellent non-lab book you can find in most any bookstore is a big paperback ($15.95) Schaums Outline of Theory and Problems of Organic Chemistry (3rd ed. 1999) ISBN 0-07-134165-x McGraw-Hill. it is a great collection of the basic organic reactions, but you'll need a lab manual to learn ya the doing, safety, etc. this Schaums series also has books covering other chemistry interests right next to this volume on the shelf at 'orders 'ooks.
you won't find more physical and practical chemistry for the money anywhere.

praeseodymium

  • Guest
Online textbook worth noting
« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2004, 01:53:00 AM »
An online textbook  :)  can be found at

http://www.cem.msu.edu/~reusch/VirtualText/shrtbl.htm



It's a fairly comprehensive place to start, but having a real textbook on hand is even better.