Author Topic: What keytone is this? MDP2P or something else  (Read 1817 times)

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carcrash

  • Guest
What keytone is this? MDP2P or something else
« on: November 25, 2002, 04:54:00 AM »
Swim was given a recipe that seems to make mdp2p directly from d-phenlyalanine but doesnt react properly in hg/al.
Also does water kill the hg/al/nitropropane/mdp2p reaction? There was obviously water in the keytone.
The recipe was from a life long crank cook who never made anything else.

A hand held stick blender is a must, spatula or stir bar will not cut it.  Also great for mixxing polar and non polar solvents. $10 for a cheap one at Target.

Solution A
 D or DL phenylalanie 100 grams
 Sodium Bicarbonate 4.9 grams
 Mixxed into 350 ML distilled water

Solution B
 Potassium ferriccyanide 69 grams
 Baking Soda 6.9 grams
 Mixxed slowly into 450 ML distilled water

Slowly over 10 minutes add solution A to solution B stirring well.

Add a liter or more of polar solvent.  Ozark Trails is a Walmart brand of Coleman Fuel but without oil and rust inhibitors. A gallon evaporates to a few drops not a tablespoon of crapola from Colemans Crap.

Blend thoroughly and let settle.

Decant off the polar solvent getting rid of the yellow fluffy crapola which is capsule filler and maybe the L-phenylalanine.

Run the remainder thru a coffee filter.

Supposed put in refridgerator and collect crystals, which are recrystalized with anhydrous isopropyl, but doesnt crystalize at all in the refridgerator.  Will freeze solid in the freezer.

What has been tried is thawing and refiltering after freezing.  Swim believes the red crystals filtered out are unreacted potassium ferrocyanide.

It has the right color yellow/green, has an oily consistancy and a keytone smell though not overpowering.  Tried reducing the volume of it in a water bath (should try distilling under vacuum) to cook off some of the water.  It turns the color of dark urine, but then returns to the same yellow/green afterwords.

Wondering if this should be attempted with either anhydrous methonal or possibly anyhydrous isopropyl instead of using water.  There was a question mark on methonal for Sol B or Sol A and B. Someone had suggested isopropyl because it is less likely to react than methonal. Either would be easy to evaporate off.

If this can be fixxed this could be a very easy otc mdp2p.
Help would be appreciated.
-carcrash


Barium

  • Guest
No no no!!!
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2002, 07:06:00 AM »
You can not get MDP2P from phenylalanine. No matter what old crank cooks might tell you. I can assure you that they, more often than not, have no clue about chemistry.

What were you aiming for when reacting Al(Hg)/believed to be-MDP2P/nitropropane? N-propyl-MDA or what?

Catalytic hydrogenation freak

carcrash

  • Guest
What keytone is it then?
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2002, 03:05:00 PM »
It is definitely producing a keytone at the least that in appearance is mdp2p.  What keytone might this be? Wondering if there are other uses for it.

Swim may dream about repeating and attempt a dcm extraction with 3 washes of the water/keytone. Then test with sodium bisulfate.  If it tests out then try the nitropropane/hg/al/mdp2p reaction. Was missing knowledge on how to attempt to distill or extract the keytone. Was also unaware of how useful DCM would be and didnt have any at that time. 

Many thanks to all those who post on the hive. Read everything, then read it again and eventually it sinks in.   

Apparently there is an old german patent about 1940 or 1950 but I don't have a patent number yet.  Trying to get that located.


GC_MS

  • Guest
phenyl alanine
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2002, 12:00:00 PM »
phenyl alanine is an amino acid. There are no substituents on the Ph ring but the alfa-aminated propionic side chain. If you would convert the amino acid function to a ketone, you'd end up with P2P. There is NO essential amino acid that will give you MDP2P by simple chemical reactions.

Ave Hive, synthetisandi te salutant!

Rhodium

  • Guest
phenylalanines to carbonyl compounds.
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2002, 12:07:00 PM »
Here is a multi-page TIFF of an article describing the oxidation of -methyl-3,4-dimethoxyphenylalanine to 3,4-dimethoxyphenyl-2-propanone. Standard phenylalanine would give phenylacetaldehyde by this procedure, but even more interesting is maybe the synthesis of phenylacetaldehyde from tryptophan, for further manipulation to DMT and analogs.

https://www.thevespiary.org/rhodium/Rhodium/projects/typing/methyl-dopa.tif



If somebody could type up the relevant experimental details here, it would be appreciated.

carcrash

  • Guest
Would it produce just phenylacetaldehyde from DL?
« Reply #5 on: November 28, 2002, 02:55:00 PM »
Would it produce just phenylacetaldehyde from a mix of DL phenylalanine? 2 different isomers of phenylalanine. If so this is a really cheap way to produce it, since DL phenylalanine can be found for $100 to $200 a kilo if you shop around.  Much easier than making then converting tryptophan which i dont believe you can buy in some countries. L pheynlalanine can be found for much less. Both are otc too. It is also a very easy synth that can be done with little work or cleanup. DCM extraction would be the hardest part which is cake. I would still freeze it solid, thaw and filter 2 times before extracting with dcm. This definitely gets rid of the remaining crapola.

Rhodium do you mean the L isomer of phenylalanine as standard phenylalanine?  This is the naturally occuring one.

Rhodium

  • Guest
It will produce phenylacetaldehyde from any ...
« Reply #6 on: November 28, 2002, 06:00:00 PM »
It will produce phenylacetaldehyde from any isomer of phenylalanine. I said "standard" as opposed to the alpha-methyl-phenylalanine used in the article. Phenylacetaldehyde polymerizes easily, so don't subject it to high temperatures or extreme pH.