Author Topic: Weak effects are not necessarily a bad thing.....  (Read 2294 times)

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wolff_kishner

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Weak effects are not necessarily a bad thing.....
« on: July 27, 2004, 04:50:00 PM »

It is considerably weaker in both potency and qualitative effects than (meth)amphetamine, it gives no euphoria



Perhaps, then, one may be able to avoid conviction under the analogue act by saying that it cannot be an analogue of methamphetamine because its stimulant effect is not substantially similiar to nor greater than methamphetamine. What do you think? A new set of RC companies could be formed without fear of conviction.


methyl_ethyl

  • Guest
good luck
« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2004, 08:28:00 PM »
A new set of RC companies could be formed without fear of conviction.

I would tend to doubt that statement.  Research companies that get into the business on the basis of a "grey market" business model tend to not only fail miserably but  end up owing  large sums of money to the government (US) or even worse jail time  ::) .  I cannot stress the point any further that those that want to make money on the "gray market" are wasting their time.  Sure you might be able to pile up 300k (USD) during a good run, like the 1,4 Butanediol operation in Festus MO, however the odds are that you will be caught, and have to serve a lengthy sentence are almost guaranteed.

We have come to the point that formation of a small scale chemical supply wholesaler could never be formed without fear of conviction....

regards,

m_e


Vitus_Verdegast

  • Guest
forget about it
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2004, 05:00:00 AM »
Perhaps, then, one may be able to avoid conviction under the analogue act by saying that it cannot be an analogue of methamphetamine because its stimulant effect is not substantially similiar to nor greater than methamphetamine. What do you think?

An analogue is an analogue regardless of potency. You will not be able to avoid conviction if you sell this to the public, esp. not if they are called 'ravergirl69' etc.. Haven't you learned enough of the recent events?


A new set of RC companies could be formed without fear of conviction

Actually, I was very glad that the so-called research chemical companies were taken down. Of course I oppose the repulsive tactics used for this by the DEA strongly, but in no way I will support a bunch of greedy businessmen who earn lots of money in a completely immoral way and next to that are the main cause of illegalization of many interesting compounds.
I also support installing laws that make not the compounds but the RC companies illegal.


wolff_kishner

  • Guest
Effects AND structure determine analogue status
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2004, 12:36:00 PM »

An analogue is an analogue regardless of potency.



When I say analogue, I meant an analogue as defined by the analogue act. The act states that the chemical structure AND the effects must be substantially similiar for the substance to qualify as an analogue. Therefore, a substance with weaker effects would not be called an analogue under the law, because the effects are not "substantially similar" to a controlled substance.


psyloxy

  • Guest
forget it
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2004, 12:52:00 PM »

Therefore, a substance with weaker effects would not be called an analogue under the law, because the effects are not "substantially similar" to a controlled substance.




You think telling that to a US judge will get you out of court as a free man ? Damn, wake up ! I bet there's a host of DEA friendly 'scientists' who will testify how enormously substantial the similarities are. The law is made of rubber and always bent to your disadvantage, especially the drug laws, especially in the US.

Forget it. End of discussion.

--psyloxy--


xxxxx

  • Guest
mephentermine
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2004, 03:22:00 PM »
mephentermine (a,a,n trimethyl phenethylamine) is not a controlled substance and is rated as being 1/3 as potent as amphetamine. i would be interested in whether putting a cf3 or br on the 4 position or a 3,4 methylenedioxy would pass, since only schedule 1 and 2 analogs are currently schedule 1 compounds (last i read). of course if you put 3,4,5 trimethoxy on it this would be too much like mescaline for purposes of the 86 analogs act. comments please?

psyloxy

  • Guest
In case it didn't catch your eye already: #116
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2004, 10:54:00 PM »
In case it didn't catch your eye already:

#116 MDPH

(http://www.erowid.org/library/books_online/pihkal/pihkal116.shtml)

My last post still applies, even more when you see the statement "Quite like MDA" in the qualitative comments.

--psyloxy--

xxxxx

  • Guest
alpha, alpha, n trimethyl
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2004, 02:57:00 PM »
i wasn´t able to post a diagram of the molecule, but the methyl groups are on the alpha carbon (and one on the nitrogen), so the compound does not have the amphetamine skeleton for the purposes of the analog act. #116 mdph is beta, beta dimethyl although it is incorrectly named alpha, alpha dimethyl (alpha is the first carbon (toluene) beta is the second (ethylbenzene), yes?). that is why mephentermine is interesting to me (although since my last post i have heard the compound may be a schedule iv controlled substance, so analogs of this compound would still not be schedule i controlled substances.)

starlight

  • Guest
alpha, beta
« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2004, 02:59:00 AM »
MDPH is alpha, alpha dimethyl. The alpha carbon is the one with the amino group. The beta carbon is the one next to the aromatic ring.

xxxxx

  • Guest
picture in the link is...
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2004, 03:09:00 PM »
picture in the link is 3,4 -och2o-c6h3-ch2-c(ch3)(ch3)(nh2). mephentermine is c6h5-c(ch3)(ch3)ch2-nh(ch3).

moo

  • Guest
Wrong
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2004, 03:52:00 PM »
No, mephentermine is C6H5-CH2-C(CH2)2-NH-CH3, the alpha-carbon where to which the two methyls are connected is the same carbon bearing the methylamino group. Phentermine is alpha,alpha-dimethylphenethylamine where amphetamine is alpha-methylphenethylamine. Mephentermine and methamphetamine are the N-methyl analogues of those. Check out Merck Index or whatever if you don't believe.


xxxxx

  • Guest
forget the name...
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2004, 04:17:00 PM »
anyway there is a compound c6h5-c(ch3)(ch3)-ch2-nh(ch3) that has some activity. maybe putting a cf3 group on the 4 position would increase the activity.

Fastandbulbous

  • Guest
beta-methylphenethylamine
« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2004, 06:11:00 PM »
Without the alpha-methyl group, there isn't going to be a lot of stimulation going on. Years ago I tried beta-methylphenethylamine to asses if it had any stimulant activity (it has been used as a vasoconstrictor decongestant in the past); it doesn't, just has pressor activity. So by that reasoning, adding an extra beta-methyl group isn't going to be any more effective.

If you want something with a lot more potential, try looking at alpha,beta-dimethylphenethylamine (3-phenyl-2-aminobutane) and it's N-methyl derivative


acx01b

  • Guest
in france laws...
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2004, 03:13:00 AM »
sory i post here and in law forum, because i think there are similar laws in many countries:
 
in france law is very clear:

some compounds are illegal, you can go to jail for only having some.

but designer drugs are not really legal because you cannot sell or give a product which have similar properties as illegal compounds (hallucinogenic, stimulant, and/or relaxant), you can go to jail for giving or selling even non-active compounds, saying that they are active...
so: you can go to jail too for selling ephedrine in low quantities because it is stimulant whereas in france you can buy some pseudoeph at the pharmstore without medical order (non listed medication)
for the ephedrine: selling it in the caps saying that it comes from the pharmstore you can go to jail for 2years whereas selling it in powder, in same quantities you can go to jail for 10 years (in the 1st case you risk because you sell medication without being pharmacist, in the second case you risk because you sell compound which has similar properties as illegal drugs)
finally in France you wont risk anything producting and consuming ALone things like methphentermine, but if someone says you have sold or given him some, you can go to jail for 10years...