Author Topic: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy  (Read 6352 times)

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Offline TCdboy28

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In this, you must never lapse. Even those who would be our allies would not understand. Our domain is the shadow. Stray from it reluctantly, for when you do, you must strike hard ,fast and fade away... Without a trace.

Offline TCdboy28

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2016, 03:10:27 AM »
Also i know this is old news to us bee Europe has always been on the for front for ecstasy production for years now but Jesus 300mg pills smh thats to dangerous to be selling like that ? well mayb not in Europe but if those ever make to the us i can see them cause problems because kids nowdays are idiots! But i hope this is true i long for the gold age to return like in the 90s hopefully summer 16 will be the summer of love ! lol
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Offline Lipbalm

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2016, 04:28:16 AM »
Flood of MDMA is old news. The flood of LSD is the real news. Someone tell me where all THAT is coming from.
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Offline dream0n

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2016, 05:32:54 AM »
Lipbalm: I thought it was pretty obvious when examined closely. I couldn't point my finger in any particular direction.
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Offline NeonCortex

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2016, 07:51:28 AM »
It is very true that Europe has been flooded with MDMA last few years. Before this we saw more than a decade of expensive and often shady pills, while MDMA HCl was very expensive (although manegable since there are a few doses per gram). With the rise of PMK-glycidate came cheap pills and even cheaper MDMA HCl crystals of high quality. Seeing fairly large crystals in pills is not uncommon at all. Last year, high quality pills dropped to an all-time low of about €5/pill when buying 5-20 pcs or so. Last month I saw the lowest price (end-user pricing) on MDMA crystals I have seen in northern europe ever - about €35-40 even when purchasing a single gram!

Haven't seen much MDA going around yet though, I guess MDA doesn't really have the same commercial potential.
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Offline Lipbalm

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2016, 07:15:44 PM »
Lipbalm: I thought it was pretty obvious when examined closely. I couldn't point my finger in any particular direction.

So where is it coming from? Not submerged culture. If it is ET then I think the mafia would have to be involved (maybe the Galena plant in Milan) because I just don't see a single motivated person being able to bypass the restrictions.
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Offline TCdboy28

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2016, 07:46:29 PM »
Very interesting lipblam go on....... 8)
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Offline Lipbalm

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2016, 08:46:06 PM »
I'm just saying it has to be a material unscheduled and easy to get. Go back a half century through the LSD lab busts. They were all using something unscheduled. I have no doubt that some divert the scheduled materials but all the big labs busted were using something unscheduled. Ever since they scheduled ergotamine the chemists have just been going down the list of ergot alkaloids. Once one is scheduled they just move onto to the next one. But I have tried to source all remaining unscheduled ergot alkaloids and either no one makes them or they are made in small amounts by only one company. I just would like to know what this magic material is everyone is using. Because there is no fucking way you can buy a gram of %99 pure LSD crystal for just $9k all day long unless there is some material out there just flowing across the world with ease people are using. And I sure would like to know what it is.
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Offline NeonCortex

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2016, 02:16:04 AM »
Flood of MDMA is old news. The flood of LSD is the real news. Someone tell me where all THAT is coming from.

It's not mainly made up of LSD -it is only called or sold as that. I believe it's a glorious mix on the market in Europe. Some of it is LSD, sure, but there are other ergot-based compounds too. More than that, though, are probably all kinds of potent phenethylamine psychedelics. Last one I saw analysis on turned out to be that caffein-prodrug to DOM or DOB. Can't remember what it is called.
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Offline taz007

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LSD?
« Reply #9 on: May 05, 2016, 12:15:04 PM »
Its probably not legit LSD 25i-nbome or some other Chinese garbage

"Due to its potency and much lower cost than so-called classical or traditional psychedelics, 25I-NBOMe blotters are sometimes misrepresented as, or mistaken for LSD blotters.[19] It is dangerous to attempt to differentiate the two using sensory techniques (i.e. taste) but reagent testing (in particular ehrlich's reagent) can easily differentiate ergolines from 25I-NBOMe via colour change.[20] Small quantities of 25I-NBOMe can provide a large numbers of doses. Vendors may import 25I-NBOMe in bulk and resell individual doses for considerable profit"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/25I-NBOMe
« Last Edit: May 05, 2016, 12:17:32 PM by taz007 »

Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #10 on: May 05, 2016, 04:47:58 PM »
IMO there is still  to some degree large scale diversion of ergot alkaloids happening in eastern europe i.e the czech republic, and that much of the commercial lavender crystal i.e bicycle day tabs are laid with.
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Offline Vesp

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #11 on: May 05, 2016, 05:30:45 PM »
The real question is where the hell is all of the 1P-LSD coming from?
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Offline Vesp

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #12 on: May 05, 2016, 05:34:15 PM »
My guess is Chinese fermenting labs are producing it all. 
They also make all the ephedrine now days that ends up being used in meth labs in Mexico.  That was a big deal, one of the biggest drug lords was the ephedrine supplier and from China. They know their biotransformations.
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Offline Kykeon

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2016, 06:05:43 PM »
There is loads of real LSD on the market in Europe. And the 1P-LSD is made by lizardlabs as far as I know.

Offline xtvree

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Re: LSD?
« Reply #14 on: May 05, 2016, 06:21:03 PM »
Its probably not legit LSD 25i-nbome or some other Chinese garbage
Not talking tabs but crystal - price of a gram is down by 50% since two years ago

Offline thewire

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #15 on: May 05, 2016, 06:50:43 PM »
There is loads of real LSD on the market in Europe. And the 1P-LSD is made by lizardlabs as far as I know.
Thanx for that!   I love their posy "Love, light and lysergamides" ;D 1P-ETH-LAD ;D

Lab results Germany:
http://www.checkyourdrugs.at/drug-checking-2/datenbank/
Suchergebnis

Ergebnis 225 von 225 - Proben Nr. 193

Datum   29.1.2016
Event   Paradise Winter Festival - 29.01.2016
gekauft als   LSD
Straßenname   k.A.
Konsistenz   k.A.
Farbabstufung   normal
Farbe   bunt
erwartetes Ergebnis
Ergebnis der Probe

193
Probenummer
Testergebnis   
LSD
gekauft als
erwartete Inhaltsstoffe   Menge
LSD
80 µg
andere Inhaltsstoffe   Menge
-    -
Bemerkung

Diese Probe enthält jene Substanz, die erwartet wurde.


LSD is still available  on the market .

Ergebnis 210 von 225 - Proben Nr. 119

Warnung!   
LSD
gekauft als
erwartete Inhaltsstoffe   Menge
-    -
andere Inhaltsstoffe   Menge
25C-NBOMe
25B-NBOMe

unbekannte Substanz
480 µg
810 µg

Bemerkung

Achtung!!!
Die Inhaltsstoffe dieser Probe sind gesundheitlich besonders bedenklich!

-----------
Detailed Import Data of ergotamine tartrate
https://www.zauba.com/import-ergotamine+tartrate-hs-code.html

« Last Edit: May 05, 2016, 07:13:29 PM by thewire »

Offline thewire

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #16 on: May 05, 2016, 07:23:53 PM »
Heroin Holiday in the Czech Republic
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdYZj9vmfi0
If morphine poppy can be harvested like in this video ,  I can only imagine the scale of illegal harvest  of ergot in the same country. 

Offline Tsathoggua

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #17 on: May 07, 2016, 02:08:24 PM »
Poppies are easy as shit to grow. Its diffiult to foul up actually, to a point where you get nothing at all.

Even here in cloudy, cold, overcast rainy britain, a pod crop is worth it, and a big enough on can if extracted with solvents rather than just lanced, yield some very good H. Although, a tip-propionyl diester of morphine is far more potent, faster, longer acting, all round a superior drug to either H or morphine. Lasts a long  time, rather like pod tea does and IVed, packs a hell of a wallop.
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Offline Secura

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2016, 09:11:02 PM »
My pet snake told me that 1P-LSD, ALD-52, ETH-LAD, and any other "new" novel lysergamides hitting the market are being developed/manufactured by a few chemists working independently, with one of the outlets for distribution being based in Poland. You're probably familiar with the RC supplier if you've been watching the scene for the last year.

These labs have capitalized on the demand for these substances and don't feel comfortable divulging their lab notes. My snake heard that the ETH-LAD synthesis was very very tricky, a real hair-ripper-outter. That's all my snake knows.

Offline Lipbalm

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #19 on: May 11, 2016, 01:08:03 AM »
Poppies are easy as shit to grow.

Yeah if you are in Afghanistan, Colombia, or Mexico. I don't know where else you are going to find the 1,000 acres you need to grow any meaningful amount in an unmolested manner (just like coca). If you want to just make some pretty flowers in your garden then sure it's easy to grow, but for drug purposes there is a reason it is all grow in far away places unlike marijuana.
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Offline TCdboy28

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #20 on: May 11, 2016, 06:14:07 AM »
Can we start a new thread on this topic and get back too the super pills ?
i wonder if they will really reach the us besides the dark web market  ::) it would be great if they could "bring back the good dope dayz" lol
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Offline dream0n

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #21 on: May 11, 2016, 12:19:43 PM »
TCdboy, I can only assume traditional distribution channels focus only on profit margins and not getting caught.
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Offline nigluhS

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #22 on: May 11, 2016, 06:34:46 PM »
Nigs stumbled upon this article yesterday, unbeknownst of this post.

Seems the EDM scene here is a little taken back by the "real shit" that has recently started to leak out. There is obviously a huge demand for the REAL deal.

Word is, that it hasn't been this clean/smooth in a LONG TIME.

300 mg pill is insane. Only makes sense if its bulk selling per say. One pill for two friends.

Being skinny with high metabolism, rarely does Nigs need more than .010 mg.

 All about the micro doses!!!!

The prices on the darknet are unbelievable competitive these days. No clue of the quality that churns out. Close call cut my ties a few years back.
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Offline Lipbalm

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #23 on: May 11, 2016, 07:30:35 PM »
TCdboy, I can only assume traditional distribution channels focus only on profit margins and not getting caught.

Yep. The only caveat is some of us will not get into fentanyl or meth production no matter the profit margin, so I guess there are some morals in there as well.
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Offline Tsathoggua

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #24 on: May 12, 2016, 07:25:07 AM »
Lipbalm mate, no, Tsath isn't based in afghanistan, or pakistan, or any other squalid, islamfestation-saturated 'stan, but in the UK, when he's  not holidaying below the south pacific in sunny R'yleh.

Doesn't grow them in his garden at home, although if some turn up he doesn't uproot them either.
Rather he travels to waste ground, all over the area scattering seed, not so much johnny appleseed, more toady poppyseed, lol. Yes, the UK, complete with its UK climate. His garden could only hope
to provide him with a few weeks a year of pod tea, or if refined a small serving of the dipropionylpantopon that Tsath' favors over almost all other opioids  that he has tried.

However, if doing it the guerrilla grow style one is effectively limited only by how much seed one has the capability to transport, a tip-Try to scout before actually going to do your planting. Find yourself a few choice wilding locations, doesn't have to be THAT wild, just a bit off the beaten path. Depending on density of planting. Dense stands could attract attention, but if dispersed a bit then it looks a lot like weeds growing to a lot of people.

And in any case people are, surprisingly enough, at least in this country, the UK, and parts of it he has experience of being in, largely, it appears, ignorant of the properties of poppy pods. They often just don't KNOW that opium comes from THOSE poppies, even if they know it does come from *A* poppy. They don't, far more often than not, in Tsath's personal experience of other people commenting on poppy pods or their use.

His neighbor didn't know what toady was doing when she saw him about to sling a bunch of thoroughly well all-stewed-out, exhausted pod slops onto the garden, asked, as she is a keen gardener. And was really surprised to learn that those flowers she herself also had growing in the garden (no, toady didn't steal her flowers, he wouldn't do that, shes a lovely girl, got a partner sadly, as she seems somewhat aspie-like and shes an absolute stunner, a real tazer-made-(very tasty looking)-flesh. Shit, shes practically a fucking PIKL on legs :D But she didn't know that what Tsath had been preparing was in fact, opium tea, and that they do indeed produce enough here in the UK climate, to make them worthewhile. Indeed they furnish him the very finest of all opioids, at least, of all that he has tried, that being pantopon, thats had the codeine stripped out to render the end product refined almost-full-spectrum alkaloid isolate, after hitting it with propionyl chloride and TETA, the codeine though, has to go, before the product is rendered safe for intravenous use.  (Codeine can cause such intense histamine release on being IV'ed that pulmonary oedema results. Not his idea of a nice relaxing nod, drowning in his own juices....for some strange reason that really just doesn't hold much appeal to him :P )

It does have a bit of a rough edge to it if IV'ed, probably there are still traces of codeine present, although evidently, harmless ones once one actually applies oneself to its removal (and of course, it can be saved for a rainy day, or just swallowed dissolved in a glass of coke or something functionally equivalent. Irn bru seems to taste a little less foul if saturated with codeine (less foul that is with respect to that same quantity of codeine dissolved in another drink, not trying to persuade anyone that dumping some codeine in a glass of pop will make that pop taste better, it doesn't, isn't and won't ever taste anything but rancid, not that toady feels it likely anybee will think it likely for that to bee anything other than the case, not at least, if they have ever tasted a mouthful of raw codeine base or its salts when its just come out of the pod isolate.)

His neighbor really didn't have a clue what lurked within her poppies, although tsath did tell her, and offer to share his product, although was declined politely (he didn't really have to worry about doing so, since she is by now pretty well used to the sight of a gas-mask-clad, a' begloven and begoggled toady beavering away in the garden when he can't do whatever it is indoors for safety's sake. (he's always careful when doing that though that it be a task to be undertaken outside, that it isn't handling anything that could put the neighbors or his folks in danger. Being at ground zero himself, standing at the workbench, thats Tsath's own choice to make, his own flesh and blood that would be spilled in case of him fucking things up, that is fair enough for him to exercise such a choice, he just doesn't believe it his choice to expose anybody else, save by consent or request.

She and her other half though have lived nearby long enough to have seen it all, so to speak, all the flasks, beakers,  condensers, sep-funnels, sohxlet-s test tubes, tubing, torches and gas tanks; probably witnessed more than just the one very occasional dive out the back door with a smoking, steaming and sizzling beaker of fuckknowswhat by now, and knows quite certainly that he's not allahsturbating, only a mix of spesh-as-hell spazz hobbyist, and clandestine chemist, seasoned with more than a little sprinkling of artist, who happened to be born being to a paintbrush about
as developed and innate a talent, as your average chimpanzee, and to poetry, he hasn't exactly tried, but when having to take art back when he was in school, and english, both of which attempted to coax some out of tsath, wished they hadn't. He got told not to bother taking art at GCSE option level, and rightly so. If the teacher hadn't told him, toady would have told himself.

But when it comes to the sciences, well thats something else entirely. Got to be one of the things toady appreciates most about the clandestine-cum-hobbyist approach, the atmosphere in the lab. Not the one that frequently requires a gas mask or diving air supply, but the nontangible, aesthetic one about that kind of lab, and the culture one finds in places like this, WD,  blacklight ; and of course, the hive, back in its glory days. The couch...and the den of iniquity no less, thats some funny shit sometimes. Back in the day, staying up all night flitting between the lab and the pc, pure hilarity abounded.
Toady isn't what anyone would call a tweaker, but when a lot of like minded users includes a large dose of tweakerdom, it really can't end up being much else.

And Tsath agrees, lipbalm, that really despite what some irresponsible sacks of dog shit may claim, or do, that throws an uglier shadow than those we needs must in this governmental climate, exist within over our art and science, we if we choose to engage in the hobbies that we do and follow the procedures which use or produce chemicals which are themselves often as not, pretty toxic, either directly, to our environment, or both, we DO owe it to others not to act like a dick hole, and not contaminate others/the environment either with reagent, or with end product.

Unless a chemist happens to be lucky enough to live out in the sticks away from urban areas, then working with the likes of fent (borderline when it comes to acceptability, if someone's responsible, 100x morphine's base strength is about the limits of what Tsath would consider acceptable for a compound capable of producing lethality with ease in the event of overexposure. BUT, he agrees only with in that sort of agents case, use by the creator of the drug, upon the person of same. Or by others in partnership with the person(s) working on it by common  consent. Not with commercial supply. Tsath is fairly confident others here will share the stance that regulation, and especially under threat of assault, bald theft and kidnap as we regrettably risk in pursuing our calling should never be used to intimidate us, and our like-minded fellows from pursuing that calling. But will probably bee singing from the same bible, if not the same hymn sheet or psalm when he says he thinks it fair enough, if people contaminate the land we all have to live in, and from. Or who expose people who do not consent to be exposed, then really an arse kicking isn't particularly undeserved if harm results. Toady doesn't mean your odd slick of vac pump oil spilled, or a splash of HCl or caustic on the grass, sure he doesn't, but for those who are just so utterly irredeemably cuntish that they for instance, dump mercury waste down the john, or who dump it in fifty liter drums like complete fucking cretinous inbred redneck hick fucks, they are no better than the drivers caught by the DEA birching in pop bottles down their pants whilst on the road.

(no, he's not joking, he actually has read of an account, by the DEA themselves, of catching at least one meth cook driving down a motorway, with a bottle of anhydrous ammonia, a plastic pop bottle no less, down their kecks, actually busted in mid Birch-B)

Tsath is no stranger to improvising a solution to a lab problem. But at least those problems were tackled IN the a lab. The only time he's come within a million miles of a down-the-undies birch-B, would be having someone wellmeaning but a little....well he wasn't a chemist, just somebody who meant well, gut one of his E-fag batteries that failed on him and toss the resulting chunk of metal into his lap meaning to have given a gift, not some form of nadger-selective incendiary device whilst Tsath was sitting there quite innocently, watching TV. That was a hairy enough event (he means the actual experience, not his very-nearly-scorched dangly bits) without adding the quadruple hazards of distracted driving, possibly squashing somebody/ending up resembling a tub of SPAM, losing pseudo, and a flimsy PET (!) pop  bottle full of highly basic, bloody corrosive cryogenic  condensed gas sharing a bunk with Mr.Dick and the two lodgers who are to be found hanging out behind his house.

Toady does not, however, believe it to be somehow inherently 'immoral' (lol) to synth meth. Why should it bee? when a great many of the bees and gurrls that share our collective propensity for psychotropics would not similarly condemn either the user/producer of say, some exotic DARI or DA/NE releaser type stimulant. Seems odd to condemn the substance itself, or its more responsible users/cooks when not applying the same principle to other psychostimulants. Whats the difference? nothing, in Tsath's opinion save for two things only.

One of them is the relative ease with which meth may be prepared. And the other (which is more unsderstandable really, and not entirely incomprehensible, if in his opinion, nevertheless somewhat misguided all the same) is the demographic of users who don't give a tinker's titty about the environment, and who's appreciation of safety procedure probably ends at not injecting the post-birch mixture whilst still in liquid annie with bits of bronze floating about in the rig (not that it wouldn't come out of the needle tip in an ammonia fountain, or just blow the thing through the air like a dart gun/blow the plunger out/send the barrel and tip flying like a rocket due to warming up, evaporating and building up pressure if somebody were brainless enough to try of course)

Lol that driver Tsath read about in the DEAnus bust, IIRC it was in an issue of ?g, that kind of poster child for the campaign to legalize postnatal abortion, with that kind of bellend loose on the roads of the US, its not all that much of a wonder really to be honest, that the DEArseholes tar everybody with the same brush as that ball-bag-birching, evidently brainless little chickenfucker richly deserved. With twats like that on the same nominal side in the 'WoD', who NEEDS enemy combatants when coming under that kind of (electride-)blue on (electride-) blue fire ? :P
 
But sadly, the deserved hatred they pour forth upon such complete and utter cretinous, failed throwbacks to the protozoal domain of life, spills over onto the rest of us.
Shite like ballsack birching, ????????, 'cheese' kiddie heroin (yegods, ain't that just one of the ugliest phrases you ever did see, 'kiddie heroin', fuckin'ell' :o) as well as the occasional true personal tragedy, like the case of the frozen addicts (MPTP resulting from a sloppy batch of a pethidine analog, resulting in instant parkinson's of a truly shocking, and absolutely horrific severity to a couple who had been making the drug without issue until they shortcut the synth by heating to get their gear ready quicker. Poor, poor bastards), that all gets used
to stack the decks and weight the dice against us.

Tsath thinks the responsible element should show themselves (not literally) to bee responsible by our conduct, and separate us from both the moronic, and the violent criminal commercial gangs, even for those who do engage in the commercial distribution of their efforts. At the same time though, he does find it quite frustrating that those of us who DO live by that small, but no less important for being lonesome, ethic as toady in that, and he himself, we can be as responsible as we like, we can be truly saintly, without comitting so much as the most minor sin, we can even scrub the last nanogram of dirt from beneath our fingernails and sink every penny not used to feed the lab and feed the chemist, into feeding the homeless and scrawny little famine orphans and live in rags like mother bloody theresa, yet by the very nature of the calling, its inherent need currently, for secrecy means that the only advertising that gets done, is to
air the horror stories. The many many benign tales, of hard working honest cooks, of those who don't sell a damn thing, and those  of us like Tsath's own self, who are simply born with Hg swirling through our vasculature in lieu of blood and battery acid for lymph and who  just don't KNOW of any other way to live (and who, for that matter, wouldn't change a thing if we did...jeezis', what a horrible, gutwrenchingly hideous, terrifying concept *shudders*)   (hey, anybody got any persulfuric acid, HClO4, 90% H2O2 or perxenate handy and know how to do an ICV injection? because somebody prep 10cc of brain bleach, stat! before the patient ends up with PTSD https://thevespiary.org/talk/Smileys/default/shocked.gif

Toady over and out. (he better go up to his room and draw up the shot of cycli-morph he left out for himself in the morning, before retiring last night, before such a horrid thought makes his insides lose the fight to hold on to their recent filling of cola, chocolate trifle, fudge-brownie milk shake, strawberries, fried shiitake mushrooms and steak that formed today's breakfast and they end up as wall decor.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2016, 08:24:13 AM by Tsathoggua »
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Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #25 on: May 13, 2016, 10:33:05 PM »
Quote
The real question is where the hell is all of the 1P-LSD coming from?

Vesp, I am 99% sure that the ALD-25 homologues such as 1P-LSD are coming from labs using a particular chemical lullu is familiar with, where the chemists are protecting the indole nitrogen so that they can oxidize other parts of the molecule so that they can couple with diethylamine, but then do not deprotect the ring nitrogen. So to avoid yield losses on N deprotection, they are using protecting groups that are easily cleaved in the stomach aka acetyl protection for ALD-25 and propionyl protection, as to why these drugs have such similar effects to LSD.

Hehehehe :D damn oxidation reactions! But my, us chemists are crafty :)
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Offline Tsathoggua

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #26 on: May 14, 2016, 09:33:19 AM »
Don't think that the indolic nitrogen will lose a substituent that easily.

1p-LSD was very different, to tsath than the original. For one it really can be a gutbuster. suspect maybe increased 3HT3 involvement, since antimuscarinics, opioids, cyclizine, cimetidine etc didn't help. Ondansetron however counteracted it in its entirety, and fast.
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Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #27 on: May 15, 2016, 12:41:23 AM »
Quote
1p-LSD was very different, to tsath than the original. For one it really can be a gutbuster. suspect maybe increased 3HT3 involvement, since antimuscarinics, opioids, cyclizine, cimetidine etc didn't help. Ondansetron however counteracted it in its entirety, and fast.

What are you?

Also yes I remember reading that the 1p-LSD does not only act as a prodrug of LSD, but as a receptor agonist in itself.

I still wonder if there is some homologue of LSD, or perhaps salvia, that has something as brilliant as what LSD brought to the table that has yet to be discovered.

To be honest, I would really like to try DOT and Aleph2. Particularly Aleph-2.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2016, 12:58:41 AM by Scarecrow »
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Offline Tsathoggua

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #28 on: May 15, 2016, 02:17:50 PM »
Oh yes. in S.divinorums case yes look up herkinorin. Its a very very unusual MOR agonist, as well as kappa OR agonist. Unusual in that it doesn't induce recruitment of beta-arrestin II
And thus, should produce very much less tolerance, if any (although there are other mechanisms of opioid tolerance) than conventional opioids that lack splice-variant selectivity (such as that iodobenzoylnaltrexamide (derivative of naltrexone) fucker that specifically targets certain alternatively spliced isoforms of MOR1, and produces far less tolerance than other MOR ligands.)

PRODRUG? wow. damn! considering the lengths needed to alkylate an indole at the nitrogen, I.e deprotonation with a strong base, like sodium/potassium hydride, surely, removing that group
is a bit difficult, for in-vivo conditions.

What do you mean 'what are you' ? he just means that he found it subjectively different to LSD itself. A bit of a suckerpunch in the guts to be quite honest, won't be going for it again. Not, without having ondansetron on hand, although toady does. IIRC its something like med no 8 or 9 in the mounting stack of GI meds he needs to take. Actually, aside from the stomach cramping it  was every bit as pleasant, but it puts him off, he won't take it without a 5HT3 antagonist.

What is Tsath? spaz science addict, cyberpunk tech-head, mycologist, botanist, and generally creative, completely unconventional sonofabitch.
Polymath, ironically enough, considering that mathematics itself, to tsath is like holy water to the devil himself, garlic to a vampire etc.

The alephs are interesting as hell. He needs to check with his supplier if they can still get him the benzaldehydes for aleph-1, 2, and 5 (the most interesting sounding ones), he'd love to try those, and their corresponding phens and cathinones.
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Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #29 on: May 15, 2016, 04:23:54 PM »
Quote
considering the lengths needed to alkylate an indole at the nitrogen, I.e deprotonation with a strong base, like sodium/potassium hydride, surely, removing that group
is a bit difficult, for in-vivo conditions.

Indeed, but whether it is acetyl protection which is used which creates a prodrug of LSD, or propionyl protection which creates a homologue of LSD, it still allows the chemist to make a drug the same/extremely similar to LSD. As long as the protecting group creates a drug that is okay for human consumption it allows missing a deprotection step, which can be usually troublesome for ergot compounds as they dont like acidic conditions :(

Anyway, totally hijacked this thread.

Ecstasy is bad mmmkay

Lets get some Aleph on the market, how would that be for some 'super potent ecstasy'
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Offline NeonCortex

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #30 on: May 16, 2016, 08:20:45 PM »
Just popping in with an on topic commentary: Last weighing of MDMA doses I witnessed involved 1-2 solid crystals per dose circa. Most doses were 1 crystal of 90-120 mg and 1 crystal of 20-50 mg to reach desired dosage.

If one  wished to, it could be nifty to sieve the material to a few stages and collect crystals in the 120-140 mg range. Perfect to keep a bag of 1 crystal=1 dose. :P

Wonder when the PMK-glycidate party ends?
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Offline Tsathoggua

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Re: Europe Is Experiencing a New Wave of Super-Potent Ecstasy
« Reply #31 on: May 21, 2016, 04:51:54 AM »
The <| series probably aren't right for large-scale commercial sale.

Read the entries in PIHKAL. Some of the <|series proved highly unpredictable in terms of dose-response and individual sensitivity.

These are DEFINITELY, IMO, compounds that should be kept for those who actually, specifically seek them, and are willing to make them if needs be. . Part of Tsath really doesn't sit well with that, it has a nasty flavor of elitism, of a kind, about it. But due to the unpredictable nature of these, they really don't ever need to start turning up in street 'E' pills.

Anyone here ever tried either aleph-1, 5 or 7 here? curious to hear first hand reports, because IIRC, one of his suppliers for reagents carries some of the correct benzaldehydes requisite to make them. And of course their phenethylamine, cathinone and meth/ethylcathinone analogs (or of course protection as a pthalimidopropiophenone, which would act as a prodrug for whatever amphetamine type agent that corresponds to the substitution pattern of the phenyl ring, pthalimidopropiophenones are cleaved metabolically to primary amine cathinones, thus neatly bypassing that severe instability problem seen with the likes of beta-keto-2C-b (this turned into a TOTALLY inactive purple compound in just the time needed to tip it into water, draw it up into a syringe to be plugged, it never even made it to the arse ring, before turning  into its inactive purple dimer thingy, it was THAT fast. IM Injection was just about possible
but only just, a really fast 'grab-yank-stab' is needed, you have to treat it almost like an epi-pen, or nerve agent autoinjector, and get there very rapidly, don't try micron filtering it  the usual way, but use two rigs, one with the filter, draw up, put filter on, and backload the actual rig to be used for the IM by squirting the solution through the rear side of the filter, in a reverse of the typical way of using them, then dive for the IM site like you were trying to dodge a bullet. And probably a high velocity anti-tank round at that!

Simply not enough is known about the <| series to make them suitable or not, for the mass market. Tsath thinks, going from PIHKAL, that they would not be.

Oh, and excuse his oversight, talking about alkylating the indolic N, haha, talk about a brain fart. Acyl, not alkyl. Is deprotonation using strong base like that needed for acylation rather than alkylation? probably IMO, but don't know, which is why Tsath asks.

But in any case, really didn't think too highly of 1P-LSD although toady is MOST impressed that some RC company was competent enough to bring a lysergamide to market. Just from a technical ability POV. 1P-LSd, is it known in the lit? would be interested to know how or if it binds to 5HT3Rs. Tsath' strongly suspects it does given the specifity of ondansetron to
totally wipe out the GI issues he had from it, while scopolamine/hyoscine eau naturale, and as the butylbromide quat salt both, atropine (as belladonna, seeds, per os, powdered), cimetidine, base/alginate type antacid (gaviscon), nor cyclizine touched it, while a couple of ondansetron tabs, plugged, let things go from hugging the bog seat, with gorge rising, about to spew any moment, into feeling fine, within moments.
Nomen mihi Legio est, quia multi sumus

I'm hyperbolic, hypergolic, viral, chiral. So motherfucking twisted my laevo is on the right side.