Any system that depends solely on post counts to determine a member's status is flawed because of the nature of these types of sites    The members that do post here are almost all valued contributors, simply because the site isn't real well known    The waxworms as you call them are probably trying to learn enough to be able to post something appropriate, the technical bar here is somewhat higher than some of the more well known web sites    Hopefully the waxworms will learn enough to be able to contribute something useful, it's happened before on a site long lost to the internet 

@ vesp, is their an interest to get this site to grow in numbers, but I get the feeling it is to grow in contributing members?

Could this be a call somewhat for a begginers section, albeit calling it a different name( i just dont like copying what every other forum does etc), where people knew to the Art, may feel more confortable in posting. Im a beginner with respect to high pressure work(above Champaigne bottle pressure etc, and microwave and of course advanced chem processes. Allthough I am in a position of having the basics pretty well covered, have done a dip of lab tech, and currently studying in a high level area relating to chem, hence can teach myself much of what I need. but this isn't the case for those who dont know things like vapor pressure, determing correct stoichmetric equations, titrations to determne Molar concentrations, Research methods, etc etc etc,

I also feel it would be a place where safety could be a key aspect, in the light of promoting amateur chem, in a responsible way. Storage and handling, testing small scale reaction,etc.  I know many sights do have a begginers section, and reading what Lugh just posted makes me wonder whether it would be a good idea. I think something on these lines maybe a good idea. But I dare say, it may require a moderator(s) that is tolerant for the beginner, as some of them, as we are aware of, want to do the holy grail reaction, and yet they haven't even done simple distillation. It dumbfouds me. I had to delete about 5 replies to that thread, due to the annoyance, and how they were asking help, and didn't seem at all interested in getting the ground work sorted. Reading such absurdity can promote a sense of annoyance, which I have noticed is very common at other sites, and is something I love about the V, because that put down, of peoples bullshit, is done in a more mature fashion. Ive visited other sites, and its just abuse after abuse, be it subtle, or YOUR JUST A DOWN AND OUT RETARD, yeah its sort of funny, but I pleased that THE V, hasn't come down to that level.

Perhaps having a beginners section may promote that, but If it was moderated with someone mature, and somewhat firm fisted, then it should not end up continuously abusive. Anyway, just a thought Id share on this matter.

2bF

Ok a few suggestions here from me.

We will discuss the addition of the begginers section to start with.
The begginers section is a great idea. However it invites Annoying Kewls to become post whores quickly in come cases... Agent Madhatter comes to mind and was a prime example of what 2b stated about wanting to jump into the deep end of the pool prior to even getting your dick wet. Begginers section should not be called that(I also don't think Drug synthesis and extraction should be named that either but thats a whole another reason and thread alltogether which I would like to discuss in the moderators lounge soon enough if you don't mind. Else all out Aussie members will soon be banned from this site and we can not loss the likes of yall because its seems to me they are more dedicated then other countries.

Ok back on topic....

Begginers section should be named more along the lines basic inorganic chemistry or better yet Basic Chemical formulation. A place where instead of newbees and Kewls to post short one line threads about "how Do's Me Mk Mefs" We should all chip in an make a massive amount of Stickly of the formulation of molar rations. Basic laws of entropy, Redux reaction basics, and simple electrochemistry...ect...ect.. I could go on but you get the point. Make it so the more informed members can do basic writeups and the noobies can ask there question in the appropriate thread about things they do not understand. I feel it will help our high members just as much if not more then it will the noob by forcing us to rethink old concepts exc... and expressing them in a way that even the layman can understand. If we do create the section first things first we need volintiers willing to take the time to write out these things. Even if you have to plagerize and dumb down your collage Chembooks thats ok.

Now on to the topic that Lugh spoke of. His is dead on. Many valuble members may not post because they feel they do not know as much as the rest of us so they stay quite. There is nothing wrong with that but learning by asking questions is the fastest way to clime the mountine. Many people underestimate themselfs and over estimate other. 2Bfrank You are a prime example brother. You do not realize it but I have had much respect from you from the get go and I feel you have more knowledege and potential then you realize. People tend to put me on a peddistal and where as I do have much experiance in my lil makeshift lab and years of learning chemistry since I was extremely young recent events has caused me to loss 90% of that information and where as I know its still there somewhere, and it comes out with a little push in the right direction on my neurons recalling information is a serious issue at times even if I only read it a few minutes ago. Hell... Once apoun atime when I was a member at the hive, I had formulate not an altogether new theory of Lewis acid and Lewis base but there where some modifications I made that seem to accurately follow my new rule for more complexe synthesis. However after a decade of stress and various other things.... It pains me to admit that after learning about Lewis acid and lewis bases recently I am struggling with the overall basic concept altogether. This is the struggle I deal with at the moment but it is my struggle and you noobies who place me on a pedistal may just be able to teach me a thing or two but being able to put it in the mindset I was in when I first learned it like you will be doing at the time.

Still... rambling... Xanax Hydrocodone, adderall and I feel better and more productive then I have in years. Perhaps its time to get my persciption back


Ok on the topic of the Essay.... How about all the forums are locked to new members once we get the first suggestion of basic chemistry forums setup. They can read the rest of the forum but not post until they can add to some of the stickys showing they understand and are willing to contribute to the advancement of knowlegde to the members of this forum and it would also should they are willing to contribute to there own further advancement in chemistry.



In conclusion what to you all think? I have thought long and hard about what my idea form of a forum would be. I love The vespiary and I feel it has the most potential as far as Psycoactive substance synthesis advancement goes. Blacklight is also huge potential but its main focus is the discussion of biological activity of the substance. This could carry the discussion further to detail the exact and cheepest means to make these knew many times Legal componds. ScienceMadness is Awsome Much knowledge and Many old bees who more often then not prefere to remain nameless. Yet there is the issue of any thread discussing a mind altering compound turning into a shit flinging fest. I would like to combine all the good aspects of each into a wonderful supersite where we can have a greater pharmacology section because right now its kind of a ghost town.

Ok Im done now I think Hope yall found the time to read and understand this long mess of a post []

~Sedit



PS: BTW Waxworm is a great name everysite has a ranking system even if it don't mean anything so waxworm to drone to workerbee ect.... even if it didn't really mean much would still be a great idea

The "waxworm" starting level might get some people off their asses to post/contribute something, even if it is in the new memer introductions thread.
And it would nice to have the "ranks" in theme with the site. It would bring some increased homogenity for the forum.
I'm no pro at chem, it is just a hobby. A hobby I like verymuch.

That is an interesting idea, and sounds pretty good. I'll look into this later on, might need some reminding if you guys think it is a good idea... I'm pretty tired and getting a little sick :'(

user vote
if any one complains about a post getting more votes than fesable then admins have a look into it.

I might have a go at making a sticky, getting it checked of course. but think that idea of sedits is a good one. We all have areas of understanding, and a sticky on a particular area could promote learning, discussion and seeing it in a broader context. Also this issue of AUS members possibily not being able to access the forum with these bullshit screening laws, well I urge the moderators to please put this on the table, as its exposed to happen soon. I dont know the exact details, but a trial of this kind I think is going to be implemented soon. Its just a friendly reminder of this situation.

2bf

I lack expertise, but imagine it to be tripped into no access by certain key phrases, or so they say. Id be more inclined to imagine that a select group of Christian fundamentalists, will have a list of sites, that are deemed as inappropriate, and from that list, they'll cast some vote. I very much urge the IT people at the vesp to please look into this. It may well mean an overhaul of topic naming, without the word of drug extractions, ect. I am not sure, just rambling here, but I second the push for this to be addressed. ASAP pls

2bf

It is a list of sites, if they know about the Vesp it will be on their!!!

Official run down;

"On Tuesday the 15th of this month, Minister Stephen Conroy called a snap press conference to announce that the live trials of ISP filtering were successful and that the Government was moving ahead with its mandatory filtering policy.

This means that at some point in the new year, legislation will be introduced in Parliament which will require all Internet service providers to begin filtering a list supplied by the Australian Communications and Media Authority within 12 months or face heavy fines. This filter will apply to all Internet connections in the country and will be mandatory.

Interest in the policy has been high in the Australian and international media and opposition is mounting. EFA has been spreading the word in the media (see below), and we are working on several campaigns to ratchet up the pressure on the Government next year. We will begin with the Internet Blackout campaign in January, with much more to come.

As usual, we can use your help. See below for some projects requiring enthusiastic volunteers. We also have an opening for a full-time campaign manager, so if you or somebody you know want to help us take the fight to Conroy, read on!

For more background on the filtering proposal, see efa.org.au or check out EFA’s fact sheets at hxxp://www.efa.org.au/mandatory-internet-filtering-fact-sheets/."

From EFA.org.au if you are worried get behind them, they are not asking for money just support. You do know that the Australian internet has been classified 'Under Surveillance" for some time know, you should really be using protection anyway!
hxxp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship

I edited out the like

"Are those linked to the very site that ruins this site"



EFA is the electronic frontiers Australia, like the EFF for Australia. I hope they were not the site that ruins this one, I will take the links down if you want?