Author Topic: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??  (Read 338 times)

sassa

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thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« on: June 01, 2010, 07:43:49 PM »
Hi.i´m new here i like you see very excited.Sorry about to much questions...
    I have on the way of mdma since year.From the begining,i have seen that the effects of "home mdma" are diferrent from the streets mdma. It is usual to see mdma crystal.Diferent colours...of course...but the effects are very smilar.Very euphoric high with lots of empathy and energy to make i night totally special.Some crystals where too much strong,with a very stonning high at good doses,but similar betwen it.
   The reason i ask that,it´s because when i first tried "my mdma",supposed to be pure,the high was not to euforic...was like to melow,not too much energy to dance and go out(yeah it´s energetic and powerfull),but not like the good "street mdma crystal".
   Several sources afirm that the European mdma crystals is mdma 70-90% ,but i really think part of this mdma it´s MDA.Never tried MDA,but seems to be the responsable of this very energetic high ,with an very urge to dance,talk,kiss everybody,...

     I´m thinking on adapting my tech labs to go into MDA.Literature claims it´s a litter easier and a very good trip.Another time,there is no consensus on whats it´s better:MDA OR MDMA

  My results on "my mdma":first dose makes you be a little stoned,like THC,and 30 minute after,more energy,more kisses...hah,,,more party...but only comes to be near to "street mdma" at higher doses.

 I suppose tolerancy it´s important,...but weeks ago i tried again street mdma,and yeah,...this energy and crazy night party was there.

   I´m really enjoing "my mdma" on the final of the night,...when all ends and you are talking with your people on your house.

  I have read about the sodium cyanoborohydride method,amonium acetate and Nitrogene Tank.Seems to be the best method,highest yields,easy procedure,....
  I have now i dealer for cyanoborohydride(it´s expensive:135 Euros-50gr).amonium acetate it´s no problem,...i i think it will be not difficult to get a baby N2 gas cylinder from Airsoft-Paintball.

But it will very fine try to get mda from reductive amination with aluminium like i´m doing now for mdma.
Any sugeestion?i know it´s less yielding...but i´m know getting 8 grams of mdma from 25 grams of ketone,so....a change on the final product it´s a possible way to increase the yield and,of course,  the quality of the High.

Any suggestion will be very very very usefull to me!thank´s a lot!
« Last Edit: June 03, 2010, 09:33:57 PM by Vesp »

sassa

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2010, 05:33:39 AM »
I puntualize....
Not to convert mdma to mda...if somebody understood  that...
   I talking  about whats the better way to go from Mdp2p to mda without too much troubles and thinking on small batches...like from 25-50 grams of ketone.Like a said i´m quite used to Al/hg reductive aminations...but the cyanoborohydride sounds good and it´s easy to get to me.

Sedit

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2010, 03:25:45 PM »
Form the oxime using Hydroxlamine and reduce to the amine using Zn/HCl.
There once were some bees and you took all there stuff!
You pissed off the wasp now enough is enough!!!

sassa

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2010, 10:40:03 AM »
not much information on my hands about oxime´s method...
I was on the Rhodium to read about and found oxime tecniques...but needs chemicals i don´t have my hands at this moment.
Sounds good of course...but to me meanings another new procedure totally different to ones i´m used to,but if it´s worth it, and it´s the better way ,will be no problem i think.oxime sounds tricky to me ???
i wish to try with ammonium acetate , sodium cyanoborohydride and N2gas....or ammonium acetate and Al/Hg with the 2 days sitting behind the flask testing and adjustin Ph :P
   Only to know what of this methods resultings on better and clean procedure with not too much probabilty of mistakes.Yields will not be a big problem.Only to try and then choose whats the better way.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2010, 11:03:43 AM by sassa »

NeilPatrickHarris

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2010, 10:19:39 PM »
using ammonium acetate al/hg on mdp2p for mda, from what i've read, is a waste of goods because it has incredibly low yields.  for proper yields you should form the oxime first and run an acidic al/hg ...or... as you stated opt for a different type of reduction aside from al/hg

sassa

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #5 on: June 03, 2010, 11:22:26 PM »
reading on the Rhodium´s found that...Nothing about Zn/Hcl.
High-yielding synthesis of MDA from MDP2P
via Formation of the Oxime Followed by Reduction
http://www.erowid.org/archive/rhodium/chemistry/mdaoxime.html

seems very easy,clean and with very good yields.Only need to get Na acetate trihydrate,elemental Na and hidroxylamine.Supossed not to be  controled like it could be Na cyanoborohydride,and of course cheaper!
    Is this route worth it?
I´m going try it when i can following the text.What do you think about?any mistakes on the writing?
Thank´s all for so great information i found here. ;D ;D ;D

marakov

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2010, 02:41:27 AM »
Hi.i´m new here i like you see very excited.Sorry about to much questions...
    I have on the way of mdma since year.From the begining,i have seen that the effects of "home mdma" are diferrent from the streets mdma. It is usual to see mdma crystal.Diferent colours...of course...but the effects are very smilar.Very euphoric high with lots of empathy and energy to make i night totally special.Some crystals where too much strong,with a very stonning high at good doses,but similar betwen it.
   The reason i ask that,it´s because when i first tried "my mdma",supposed to be pure,the high was not to euforic...was like to melow,not too much energy to dance and go out(yeah it´s energetic and powerfull),but not like the good "street mdma crystal".
   Several sources afirm that the European mdma crystals is mdma 70-90% ,but i really think part of this mdma it´s MDA.Never tried MDA,but seems to be the responsable of this very energetic high ,with an very urge to dance,talk,kiss everybody,...

     I´m thinking on adapting my tech labs to go into MDA.Literature claims it´s a litter easier and a very good trip.Another time,there is no consensus on whats it´s better:MDA OR MDMA

  My results on "my mdma":first dose makes you be a little stoned,like THC,and 30 minute after,more energy,more kisses...hah,,,more party...but only comes to be near to "street mdma" at higher doses.

 I suppose tolerancy it´s important,...but weeks ago i tried again street mdma,and yeah,...this energy and crazy night party was there.

   I´m really enjoing "my mdma" on the final of the night,...when all ends and you are talking with your people on your house.

  I have read about the sodium cyanoborohydride method,amonium acetate and Nitrogene Tank.Seems to be the best method,highest yields,easy procedure,....
  I have now i dealer for cyanoborohydride(it´s expensive:135 Euros-50gr).amonium acetate it´s no problem,...i i think it will be not difficult to get a baby N2 gas cylinder from Airsoft-Paintball.

But it will very fine try to get mda from reductive amination with aluminium like i´m doing now for mdma.
Any sugeestion?i know it´s less yielding...but i´m know getting 8 grams of mdma from 25 grams of ketone,so....a change on the final product it´s a possible way to increase the yield and,of course,  the quality of the High.

Any suggestion will be very very very usefull to me!thank´s a lot!


If One would replace MethylAmine with a simple amine they would have MDA or a substituted MDA.

NeilPatrickHarris

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2010, 05:37:45 AM »
this isn't mda from mdp2p but perhaps look at jon's method.  halogenation of the olefin, keeping the primary amine in mind

jon

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2010, 01:37:11 AM »
i explained that process pretty well in another thread but i will say if *properly* done iodosafrole gives quantitative yeilds of mda using dry isopropanol and 15 gram moles nh3/mole iodo safrole.
it helps to bubble the ammonia into superchilled isopropanol because it's not a good solvent for nh3 but using other solvents than ipa gives poor results with ammonia.

java

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #9 on: June 21, 2010, 06:58:56 PM »
Two-Step Iron(0)-Mediated N-Demethylation of N-Methyl Alkaloids
Gaik B. Kok, Cory C. Pye, Robert D. Singer and Peter J. Scammells
J. Org. Chem.
2010



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jon

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2010, 08:08:44 PM »
that's quite impressive

sassa

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2010, 12:01:49 AM »
Hi guys,i think i´m not playing at the same level when talking about pure chemistry.  :'( :'( :'( :'(   ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D!!
  That things  sounds very interesting, but it seems to me that this enough out of my possibility current as for knowledge ,materials and chemicals.
 I would prefer obtain information of some amination in AL/Hg or with Na CyanoBoro., which was working well in small batches and with chemicals not very different from the used ones in the obtaining of another amine
 Excuse my ignorance,but i think i see it more on the practical way that theorical.That´s good of course,but i´m lost on information that i can´t put on the lab. :-\    Thanks anyway

dewittdale

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #12 on: August 07, 2010, 01:17:49 AM »
If you want to recycle the MD-P-2-P and don't mind the low yield you can use ammonium hydroxide on HgCl.  1 gram MDA for 50 grams MD-P-2-P.  Otherwise go with the anhydrous route. 

Buzzoff

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2010, 06:18:43 AM »
In "Street"  MDMA, you have no idea what you are actually consuming.  The extra kick you are experiencing could be due to adulteration.  Might be anything from Methamphetamine, to Ketamine or Fentanyl.

MDA itself, is actually a lot more "Psychedelic" than MDMA.  Lots of closed-eyes visuals. 

MDA, is not nearly as straight-forward to make as MDMA.  The Leuckhart reaction works, but not brilliantly.  Hydrogenation with Benzylamine, followed by elimination of the benzyl group by further hydrogenation....is reputed to work, but most itinerant chemists, aren't equipt for such tasks.

The old standby, is producing the Beta-Nitropropenyl Benzene, and reducing it with LiAlH4, or NaALH4.  Handling LiALH4 is hair-raising.  But, if you live through the experience, it works pretty well.

 

sassa

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Re: thinking changing mdma for mda:method suggestion??
« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2010, 08:59:52 PM »
i think i´m a little stupid... ??? ??? ???
i have seen today on rhodium´s archive there is a route to reduce the ketone oxime with an AL/hg using HoAC(think it´s acetic acid please confirm my ignorance)...i didn´t look seriously to the oxime route to mda because the elemental NA that figures on the recipe to reduce the oxime it´s almost imposible to get to me.
   Now i see that only need hidroxylamine and sodium acetate to form the oxime and then run a simply Al/hg with modifications.Very cheap and easy to get.
   This happens me often:seems like the magic article don´t arrive to my hands until the last moment.Happens me usually with Rhodiums archive,when i was sure a looked around all articles.
   Now i have spent the money on the cyanoborohydride,so i have to try it,but of course
i will run after the oxime route with acidic AL/HG.Jesus.... ??? ??? ??? ???
http://www.erowid.org/archive/rhodium/chemistry/alhg.oxime.html