Author Topic: 2c-x from mequinol  (Read 484 times)

Dr.Methoxy

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Re: 2c-x from mequinol
« Reply #20 on: February 20, 2011, 09:00:54 AM »
reimer tieman rxn's gives shit yeilds think duff formylation, its mo better..

hey,

Reimer-tiemann is not that shitty, only work up is tricky because you need steam distillation. Ok, yield is not really good but it's always around 40%. All reagent are easy to get.

The best formylation here is PFA/magnesium methoxide but the reaction must be performed under N2 athmosphere.

Intergalactic Captain

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Re: 2c-x from mequinol
« Reply #21 on: February 23, 2011, 08:40:43 AM »
Never had any luck with the Mg(OMe)2 method...Or chloromethylation for that matter.  At least a dozen attempts were tried for each, but with one caveat - The CH2=O donors were less than ideal.  Porta-potty grade (in varying states of purity) p-aldehyde and sym-trioxane were used, but neither one gave anything but greenish tar or a polymerized sponge.  The work over at SMDB on the Mg(OMe)2 method shows great promise, but I think they neglegcted to realize the necessity of PURE paraformaldehyde in the reaction.  All the articles I've dug up go into great detail on the need for anhydrous conditions, the speculative mechanisms backing this up, but none ever touched on the need for pure paraformaldehyde (although this is of no concern in an academic lab anyways)...

...Been looking in a different direction, though - Pure mequinol is not particularly difficult, but working with it leads to some interesting conditions and workups down the line.  Been looking more towards p-di-meo-benzene as a starting point.  Impure mequinol was used as a precursor in an MeBr methylation ala painkilla - The workup is in progress, but the results look moderately promising - Eyeballing a ~60% yeild despite far less than optimal conditions.

...Once the product is obtained, it will be brominated to 2,5-dimethoxybromobenzene - From there, I see two realistic pathways - The modified duff, and bromomethylation.  Been searching up and down for the old bromomethylation thread from the hive, but I can't seem to find it.  Anyone have any experience with this, or better yet the thread I'm looking for or a valid link to one of the hive archives?

pyramid

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Re: 2c-x from mequinol
« Reply #22 on: February 23, 2011, 04:33:44 PM »
I tried a bromomethylation once but got bad results and was over it. I have done the magnesium methoxide/PFA formylation many times, each not coming under 92% yield of 2-hydroxy-5-methoxybenzaldehyde. A few times I even used campachem paraformaldehyde, just washed with some water and dry MeOH. No need for an inert atmosphere and formation of the magnesium methoxide plus azeotropic toluene distillation keeps the reaction plenty dry enough for great success. It works exactly as described, but you substituted trioxane, so it's not a surprise you got a different result. Also workup really is very easy, extraction washing and evaporation.
Also, p-aldehyde? What do you mean? What is the substrate you tried formylating?
I could post an example of what i have done if you would like, but it is not too much different from some others out there.

Intergalactic Captain

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Re: 2c-x from mequinol
« Reply #23 on: February 23, 2011, 04:53:47 PM »
If you read a little closer you'd see that I tried both campachem and trioxane, individually, on multiple trials with both mgome2 and chloromethylation, with shitty to zero results across the board.  With mgome2, reagent grade toluene and methanol, dried for several days over 3A sieves, were used to no avail.  And yes, the magnesium was really magnesium...

...Could you elaborate on "bad results" with bromomethylation?  Bad as in poor yields or what?

pyramid

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Re: 2c-x from mequinol
« Reply #24 on: February 23, 2011, 05:02:05 PM »
Ok, but what was it you were formylating?
Aout 14% yield of 2,5-DMBA from dimethoxybenzene with the bromomethylation as discussed on the thread on hyperlab

Ps: I cannot see where you said you used campachem
Edit:
Really for the life of me I do not know what is wrong, because if you used the paraformaldehyde it should have worked. Did you wash it before? What was purity of starting substrate? Super dry solvents aren't even necessary but are better so there is not a problem there. After quenching the reaction you should only stir for 5 mins then continue workup. If not you get a lot of polymers.
All I can think of, also, when removing the toluene/MeOH Azeotrope did your reaction mix get very thick and gelatinous with the phenolate? This always happens to me around 85-90C and I just add a little paraformaldehyde and it thinsout.
This is all I can add I cannot think of anything else that is wrong. Can you share a writeup of your failed reaction?
« Last Edit: February 23, 2011, 05:46:25 PM by pyramid »