Author Topic: Is this time the charm? [LSD synthesis proposal]  (Read 786 times)

Bluebottle

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Is this time the charm? [LSD synthesis proposal]
« on: April 17, 2011, 03:03:09 AM »
I know I make an ass of myself with my speculation. I'm no chemist, but I sometimes I think about things and get "unduly enthusiastic". I hope this isn't such a time, I don't want to waste your times. This is all by the books, I just put the pieces together and it's only a skeleton yet.

The methacrylamide type allyl anion is known, see the reference, made with an organolithium base. It's reaction with electrophiles is there too. The 2,3-dihydrotryptophan, benzoylated, cyclised, all as per Rebek's synthesis, then hydrolysed to the intermediate in the picture. MnO2 dehydrogenation is also documented in the same paper. MnCl2 hydroamination is attached as well.

Relatively simple/accessible. Few steps. My fingers are crossed, but it couldn't be this easy, what am I missing!?

[Edit- see response 17 "lament" for why it might not work. Essentially 5-exo seems preferred to 6-endo in many similar cases.]
« Last Edit: October 01, 2011, 02:57:17 AM by Bluebottle »
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Vesp

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Re: Possible LSD Synthesis
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2011, 01:54:20 AM »
Interesting idea, it seems like you've done the research. I wish I could comment on it to add more information, but I'm in the same boat as you.

Has anyone else looked over the chemistry of this?
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akcom

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2011, 03:43:42 AM »
Interesting synth.  Just briefly looked over the first paper.  They do these lithiation rxns at -78C.  The chillers they use to maintain those reaction conditions are pretty expensive.  You might be able to get away with dry ice and acetone bath (in a dewar type vessel obviously) with continuous addition of dry ice for two hours.  But that's going to be a bitch.

The second step is a bit confusing to me.  First of all, I'm not sure about that cyclization.  I don't know if the amide will be a powerful enough EWG to activate an alkyl amine, but it's certainly possible.  Only experimentation will tell.  I still don't understand how you're eliminating the alkoxide unit to get the conjugated double bond.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2011, 03:52:33 AM by akcom »

akcom

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2011, 04:14:50 AM »
Good luck with your endeavor, hopefully these papers will be useful to you
Quote
A Novel Sequential Aminodiene Diels?Alder Strategy for the Rapid Construction of Substituted Analogues of Kornfeld’s Ketone

Through a novel sequence of aminodiene Diels?Alder reactions, amidofurans 18a?c were converted to tricyclic ketones 21a?c in moderate to good yields. Ketone 21a could be converted to Uhlé's ketone (6) by cleaving the tert-butyl carbamate and oxidatively removing the methyl ester. Tricycle 21a readily underwent bromination to give 22. Formation of the corresponding enol triflate 25 followed by carbonylation gave ester 27, which was then coupled with N-methyl propriolamide to furnish 26.

Quote
Sequential Aminodiene Diels-Alder Approach to the Ergoline
Skeleton

Through a novel sequence of aminodiene Diels?Alder reactions, several substituted amidofurans were readily converted to tricyclic ketones in good yield. The formation of the tricyclic ketone system is the result of a ring opening and dehydration of a transient oxabicyclic adduct formed by an intramolecular Diels?Alder cycloaddition of an amidofuran with a cyclohexenone moiety tethered such that it participates in the cycloaddition as the 2? component. A convenient way to construct the cyclohexenone is to make use of some aminodiene chemistry developed by Rawal. An angular carbomethoxy group is required in order to activate the olefin toward cycloaddition with Rawal's diene. The presence of this activating group not only prevents the isomerization of the advanced ergoline intermediate to a naphthalene but can also be leveraged for an oxidation to provide Uhle's ketone (13). The easily formed Kornfeld ketone analogue 25 was readily transformed into the corresponding triflate 41 by the action of triflic anhydride and a base. Oxidative addition of vinyl triflate 41 to Pd(0) and the ability of the resulting vinyl palladium species to undergo cross-coupling with terminal alkynes prompted us to devise an expeditious route to lysergic acid. Unfortunately, our inability to carry out a regioselective Heck reaction using vinyl triflate 41 and the methylene amino acrylate ester 48 thwarted the completion of the synthesis of lysergic acid.

Sedit

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2011, 05:07:03 AM »
I fear that remains of the alkoxide may lead to Iso-LSD which as I understand it is worthless but as of now I have read almost nothing of the papers presented and this thread in general. Its just the first thought that came to my mind.
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Bluebottle

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2011, 06:05:47 PM »
The alcohol can be dehydrated by P2O5 and MeSO3H in 95% yield according to Rebek, and I bet there are methods in the literature.

Thanks for the references, I already got em though ;) Ran a few numbers and the illustrious Dr. Rebek's method of getting to the ketone is the most practical: Tryptophan, Pd/C, H2, (60-70% yield) then Ac2O, AcOH and AlCl3 in DCM (57% on top of that). Later on MnO2 dehydrogenation at 75% yield, even then I think it's better. But the nitrogen has to be alkylated separately too. Instead of benzoyl, propionyl protection on the amines might be easier.

I toyed around with starting from indole as well: acrylic acid condensation to the 3-propionic acid (up to 69%  90% if you recycle the indole), and if you protect the indole nitrogen (pivaloyl, for steric reasons), there's a nifty procedure using AlCl3 and propionyl chloride to cyclise it at moderate yield. Alpha halogenation, somehow and that's bound to be indiscriminate, and then reaction with methylamine there ya go, and one doesn't have to mess around with hydrogenation/dehydrogenation. But that's more steps with somewhat less accessible reagents.

It would be really damn cool if methacrylic diethylamide and butyllithium could be used, for obvious reasons. But the other option would be using the wittig reagent derived from commercial bromomethyl methyl acrylate (avoiding the issue of dehydrating the alc). If the diethylamide isn't a strong enough EWG which is possible, then that would probably be the best route anyway. (And from the ester to the amide later on). I didn't think dry ice and acetone would be quite so bad, now that you mention it it could be a pain.

The manganese cyclisation should be fine though. Only thing that keeps me up is that it doesn't work on pyrrolidine at all, very strange. There is also precedent for using K2CO3 on MgO for that kind of addition with high yields with methyl acrylate and aliphatic amines, although not cyclisation afaik. Still reading up on this type of thing, apparently various catalysts have been used.

It probably would lead to some iso-lsd. Chromatography would sort that out, but there might turn up a stereospecific method. Some kind of co catalyst with the MnCl2 sounds possible but I have no idea.

[edit] After some reading, it might even be possible to get by using methyl methacrylate directly (for the lithiation) as long as the reaction were kept short and sweet; but the amines would have to be well protected and the yield would be lower. Methacrylic acid itself might work, I thought I've seen the dianion mentioned but I can't seem to find the ref again.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2011, 07:56:09 PM by Bluebottle »
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atara

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2011, 11:30:16 PM »
Just make sure that whatever base you're using to deprotonate the methacrylamide doesn't attack (as a nucleophile) the ketone. There are a couple of ways to achieve this, the most simple is to use more acrylamide than butyllithium, which will preferentially transfer all of the lithium atoms to the acrylamide.

Quote
Only thing that keeps me up is that it doesn't work on pyrrolidine at all, very strange.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baldwin's_rules

Quote
I don't know if the amide will be a powerful enough EWG to activate an alkyl amine, but it's certainly possible.

This is the other sticking point. The thing that comes to mind is using methacrylonitrile instead of methacrylamide.

It then becomes necessary to use a non-nucleophilic base to deprotonate the methacrylonitrile -- sec-butyllithium will react with a nitrile. The preparation of lithium diisopropylamide is described on orgsyn in detail, and diisopropylamine can be obtained by the alkylation of ammonia with isopropyl halides (triisopropylamine never forms in this reaction due to steric hindrance).

Conversion of the nitrile to an amide is the next question. This may be accomplished through the aldehyde with SnCl2 (Stephens Aldehyde synthesis) and the cyanohydrin / acyl cyanide with NaCN/MnO2/Et2NH (MnO2 converts cyanohydrins to acyl cyanides, which behave as acylating agents).

I doubt this will all be necessary. Cyclization of the amide should proceed just fine.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2011, 11:34:16 PM by atara »

letters

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2011, 01:04:42 AM »
I feel like im constantly being the nay-sayer around here...
just looking at your starting compound raise a red flag! alpha-aminoketone... thats always a bad idea. especially if you plan to use a base (and you do)... dimerization/double molecule cyclization should ring in your ears! if it doesnt, i suggest going back to the textbooks and reading up on functional groups and their reactions.
Another point i feel i should mention, which is present in the old literature, in articles dabbling in ergolines total synthesis, is that the D ring cyclization is quite hard and does not proceed easily. from what i know, i would wager that what you will get is a 5 membered ring protruding to the right in your picture, instead of your wanted 6 membered ring.

also, do you have any real life experience with t-BuLi? that is one of the nastiest reagents ive had the displeasure of working with. It is a serious hazard!
One of our emeritus professors has lost an ear and his nose from a BuLi mis-hap. It catches fire super easily, it is hard to extinguish.
It is absolutely impractical to work with it outside of the lab, and even in the lab, i would never consider carrying even a moderate scale reaction with BuLi!!!!!! Be Warned!
« Last Edit: April 22, 2011, 01:06:43 AM by letters »

Bluebottle

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2011, 01:20:35 AM »
Thanks! I really appreciate the help, and "naysaying".

Leaving that amine protected and hydrolysing it afterwards is the solution to that trouble, hopefully.

I've never even seen organolithium but I do have fear of the stuff. So on that note maybe what occurred to me earlier today is the way to go. I still have high hopes for the MnCl2, and it begs to be tried.

Following what Rebek originally did, avoiding cold temperatures and lithium. Reformatsky reaction with methyl bromomethylacrylate to the lactone (83% with iodine catalyst and Zn in THF), but then skip right to aminolysis with NH(Et)2 and the hypothetical MnCl2 ring closure. But I really have to read up on that aminolysis, so far I just know it's possible, not feasible.

[edit] Reluctant as I am to abandon the use of methacrylamide, I'd rather avoid slightly pyrophoric reagent in light of a better option. The aminolysis should work just fine, admittedly with a good excess of amine. Iodine though, that's not too available is it.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2011, 02:49:07 AM by Bluebottle »
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akcom

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #9 on: April 22, 2011, 01:58:28 AM »
nBuLi is usually added via a syringe.  It's not uncommon to see sparks on the end of the syringe from the reagent. sec-buli on the other hand is less reactive and will "only" ignite paper, cotton, clothes etc.

letters

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #10 on: April 22, 2011, 03:10:14 AM »
actually n-buli is much more benign then t-buli. im willing to work n-buli almost every day (unless im drunk and at work, which rarely happens). t-buli however i will do my best to avoid and not work with. have no experience with sec-buli. t-buli syringe needle regularly catches fire for me (not sparks, actual flame).
« Last Edit: April 22, 2011, 03:13:09 AM by letters »

Bluebottle

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2011, 05:21:24 AM »
On the MnCl2 thing, ahah!? The angles don't make sense with the unsaturated bond there, that's why it's so difficult to close. The key must be to dehydrate the alcohol AFTER the ring is formed. Now what exactly is the mechanism of that catalysis... I was thinking intermediate is a 3 member ring with Mn and the electron deficient alkene (does that sound right? It's the only thing I could sketch out that made any sense). That might violate Baldwin's rule, but then "cations are often exceptions" it says, so I don't know. (And the momentary primary cation would be what does the job, being why the EWG is so important) The whole thing hinges on the final cyclisation of course.

Sorry for the uneducated musings, haha, I never said I was an expert!
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akcom

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2011, 06:00:36 AM »
letters, you are right.  slip of the tongue on my part :)  I've never had a fire thank god, but on the occasions I've worked with n-butlit its definitely caught kimwipes on fire when the last drop in the syringe touches it.

What classes have you guys taken for this sort of stuff (or is this self taught)?  After two semesters of organometallic my straight organic mechanisms are really rusty.  I'm thinking about just pulling the big book of named mechanisms off the shelf and pouring over it after a good dose of adderall.

edit:
I can help you out with the Mn mechanism though.  Given that the olefin contains an EWG it's almost a given that the olefin coordinates to the metal center.  Later transition metals tend to be pi basic which makes sense in this case, esp. given the EWG.  After coordination the olefin is activated towards nucleophilic attack.  The nucleophile attacks, protonolysis (via MeOH, 1-3 is forbidden) frees the product.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2011, 06:24:18 AM by akcom »

letters

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2011, 11:20:54 AM »
Ill have a look at the Mn mechanism and see what i can learn from it. Will report back.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2011, 10:51:40 PM by letters »

Bluebottle

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2011, 03:15:30 AM »
I should make a note of this, nickel will not work well, if at all, for the hydrogenation of tryptophan. I had certainly hoped Ni would be a cheap alternative, but alas.

Dissolving metal reductions work on indole to a modest degree, but is it even worth it? I bet a dash of Pd and H2 is cheaper than a bunch of metal and acid in the long run. Also came across a reference of Pd on hydroxyapatite (teeth and bone, haha, now there's an image!) selectively reducing indole but it looks like even a methyl on the 2 or 3 gets in the way.

Quote
The reduction of indole with zinc dust, or zinc
amalgam9 in hydrochloric acid affords indolines, but the yield
of indoline produced from indole by such reductions is lowered
by simultaneous polymerization of indole in the acidic media.
This side reaction has now lo been eliminated by effecting this
reduction with zinc dust in 85 x phosphoric acid, under nitrogen
to prevent aerial oxidation. Under these conditions the
3H-indolium cation which is formed by protonation of the
indole nucleus at CB, and which is presumably the intermediate
in reductions carried out under acid conditions, is
stable to polymerization and indoline is produced in 64-
69 % yield.
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atara

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #15 on: April 26, 2011, 01:05:40 AM »
Thanks! I really appreciate the help, and "naysaying".

Leaving that amine protected and hydrolysing it afterwards is the solution to that trouble, hopefully.

You could probably get away with mere alkylation of the tryptophan amine considering methylone is at least reasonably stable. You're going to end up alkylating it eventually anyway; the most interesting groups (to me) that can go on there are methyl and allyl, the former giving rise to classic LSD and the latter giving rise to AL-LAD which of all the lysergamides in TiHKAL seems to be a clear winner as far as I can tell.

The most interesting thing about this route of yours is the ease to which it seems to lend itself to making the other various 6-substituted lysergamides such as ETH-LAD, AL-LAD, PRO-LAD etc.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2011, 01:09:54 AM by atara »

Bluebottle

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Re: Is this time the charm?
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2011, 10:27:28 PM »
I have no idea, you tell me, if it's fine to use the secondary amine that would be great. But the methacrylamide anion is pretty strong. (an allyl group there from the outset might cause problems.)  Personally I guess I'd rather not risk it.And of course if it's through the lactone followed by diethylaminolysis, then the amine's going to have to stay protected anyway.

I'm curious why the kinetic base is so important, or alas is it? TMEDA I can understand, breaking up the lithium clusters, but what else is there on the Et2 methacrylamide that's going to get attacked?

And (sorry for all the questions) is there any reason I've never heard of an isopropyl-LAD  is that just to bulky or what?

edit

Didn't want to double post. They say a fool can ask enough questions to stump 100 wise men which is how I feel. My chem background? None! I'm a guitarist for chrissakes, while I do love chemistry... but another possible stumbling point occurred to me: there are two amide groups on the thing if the one on the indole nitrogen stays protected 'til the end, how does one get it off without messing up the diethylamide? Does that mean it should be hydrolysed immediately after it is cyclised, monomethylated, and make step 1 of the methacrylamide addition "cross your fingers"?

The more I think about it the more I think you're right, even if an iminium cation formed it wouldn't mess up the addition of the methacrylamide anion, it can't really attack the nitrogen. By George! Although it is speculative and having direct precedent in the literature is always nice, if there isn't a practical way to get the benzoyl off without harming the rest of the molecule that might be it. (If there is, zinc and iodine in THF isn't bad, and there are a variety of pretty Barbier reactions out there too)

During an attempt at monomethylation let's see here. The dimer (or possibly some polymer goo if it's fully debenzoylated) actually wouldn't be such a bad thing, an excess of acetone wouldn't be bad, just make sure all those amines are imines, alkylate gently with MeI (isn't that how it's done?) and hydrolyse away all the imine bonds with HCl, no risk of naphthalenes until the MnO2 comes into play thank goodness.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2011, 12:33:05 AM by Bluebottle »
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Bluebottle

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Lament
« Reply #17 on: May 08, 2011, 04:54:13 AM »
Tangentially, there is a procedure using Fremy's Salt to simultaneously dehydrogenate an indoline in good yield and hydroxylate where the 5-position on an indole would be, but I doubt anybody would want to do that. Who knows, it might not be active at all, could be even more active if that's possible, it could even be a disproportionally potent, ie fatal vasoconstrictor. But Fremy's Salt would probably make it.

edit - there was a revised proposal here, some flaws became apparent so now I'm removing it. If only it were that simple with real cholesterol.

The lamentation is that after doing some research (why oh why is it so hard to ask the right questions?) it seems that  5-aminopentenes are more apt to cyclise to the 5 member ring :(

The only possible saving grace would that relatively weak e- withdrawing diethylamide, and maybe the MnCl2 catalyst. I can't find anything on MnCl2 in the context of intramolecular hydroamination, and the amide is on the 2 of the 5-aminopentene, whereas it would do the most good on the tail, 1. At least as far as a reference from a dissertation on Fe catalysis is concerned.

So it's a guess, but not as bright a one as I'd hoped. Shame, the procedure was so simple.

Although, I wonder, would an amide of the "wrong" product this implies be active at all? It's not unthinkable.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2011, 03:02:12 AM by Bluebottle »
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Bluebottle

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Re: Is this time the charm? [LSD synthesis proposal]
« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2011, 09:09:18 PM »
While diethyl methacrylamide and MnCl2 etc. are nearly OTC themselves, another approach occurred to me circumventing some of the potential difficulties and also about as available. Nor involve dry ice baths.

Long story short, some variation on alkynylation of the aryl ketone (DMSO and KOH ~30% maybe something with zinc is higher yielding), formation of imine with formaldehyde, cyclization, and crossing tees to the -CONEt2. It might turn out to be possible in one or two sequential runs.

I'm still working it out. At the moment the most plausible is a copper catalyzed cyclization (reminiscent of http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/ol201542h "CuCl2-Promoted 6-endo-dig Chlorocyclization..." but instead of oxidation, simple dehydration to the pyridine). Pyridine to pyridinium of choice, NaBH4 reduction, and MnO2 oxidation.

The picture below is an older rough sketch, keeping it around for reference.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2011, 10:37:21 PM by Bluebottle »
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Tungsten.

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Re: Is this time the charm? [LSD synthesis proposal]
« Reply #19 on: October 18, 2011, 08:17:02 PM »
Bluebottle, could you explain the second step (Ac2O, AcO, AlCl3)? I can't figure out the mechanism. I even tried to figure it out with models and couldn't figure out how the intermediate goes to the final product.

Sorry, I'm a bit under-educated for this level of chemistry, but this synthesis looks very interesting.
-W