Author Topic: Crude Colchicine Extraction  (Read 403 times)

Vesp

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Crude Colchicine Extraction
« on: December 31, 2008, 11:15:13 PM »
Check out the PDF at the bottom - it is more detailed then my original post.

This solution works well, I have doubled the chromosomes of several different plants. Some of the plants include Morning Glory, Wild Lettuce, Canary Reed Grass, as well as a few others.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2009, 01:30:05 AM by Vesp »
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cft

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2009, 10:24:39 AM »
Can you post your procedure for the cromasome doubling? At which point did you treat the seedlings with the colchicine extract and how much did you use etc?

Vesp

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2009, 11:05:33 PM »
I tried to do an LD50 with the plants and seedlings. I figure if half of them die, the other half got a high enough dose of colchicine to become polyploidy. I can't give any real data on it though, I think you will just have to do trial and error until you get what you want.
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cft

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2009, 02:41:24 AM »
I was thinking more an acid/base extraction of the colchicine to get pure-ish powder that you could at least treat the plants with an approximately known amount?

Otherwise even if it works this time around you can't guarantee the method will be reproducible as the next batch of C. autumnle bulbs might have a different amount of colchicine in.

Where you say colchicine isn't very stable, do you have any data on this, i.e. how likely would it be to survive acid/base extraction and drying. Wonder how hard it would be to find the journal article in which colchicine was first characterised as that will have detailed extraction technique, but it'll be from like 1890 or something...

Vesp

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2009, 05:28:21 AM »
i don't have any data on it, sorry. I would think if you were to keep the pH's not to acidic or basic, avoided heat and light and worked fast it could be extracted. I remember reading that once the solution is made it only lasts a few months. That could be a false memory though.
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Mr.Murphy

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2009, 04:01:17 PM »
@cft: A/B-extraction won't help any good here, as colchicine is neither significantly acidic nor alkaline (check the structure!).
Colchicine is known to be unstable in particular towards (UV-)light, as reported for example in Chemische Berichte 1951, 84(7), p.621.

Extraction can be achieved in general with EtOH, followed by evaporating off the EtOH. From the crude extract one gets already purer colchicine by treating with chlorofom (can be replaced with DCM). Final refinement is usually achieved by column chromatography, or recrystallisation if one has enough material.

Looking at the described "tek", I have to stress the immense high toxicity of this compound. Gloves are highly recommended during ALL steps.

I somehow doubt that the described procedure produces significant amounts of colchicine, as the compound is only moderately soluble in water, which is the used solvent. Therefore I recommend, as said above, EtOH, followed by CHCl3 for refinement. *)

See the attached document (and referenced contained within) for a rough draft of an extraction procedure.

Peace! Mr.Murphy

*) Don't get me wrong: You will get colchicine´by the described protocol, but the method can be improved easily. :)
« Last Edit: July 10, 2009, 04:03:07 PM by Mr.Murphy »

Vesp

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2009, 06:29:34 PM »
Yeah, this was by no means of making it pure, just to be used to induce polyploidism, I found several methods stating water works well. I figured EtOH would probably kill most plants/seeds.

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Quantico

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2009, 05:57:13 PM »
Nice work Vesp

Reading around I found this (use on cannabis)
http://www.rexresearch.com/hhusb/hh4bot.htm#HH46

just if someone thought the same :D

Prepuce1

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #8 on: August 06, 2009, 04:05:26 AM »
Is cholchicine unavailable now? I recall using it many years ago in a biology class. It came from a chemical supplier.

Giberellic acid was another interesting compound we used. Correctly applied It causes plants or parts of plants to grow to an unusually large size. IIRC we used it to make huge tomatoes.

PP

Vesp

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #9 on: August 06, 2009, 06:16:05 AM »
I'm sure it is available, but picking something up at walmart with 5 minutes of preparation vs ordering offline and waiting a while I think has its advantages. Of course, the product isn't as pure and could cause some problems, but it has its uses.
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Mr.Murphy

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #10 on: August 06, 2009, 04:32:29 PM »
I admit, I'm more guessing than knowing here, but I can easily imagine that such potent poisons like colchicine are not sold to everyone.

- Murphy

eesakiwi

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2009, 07:33:14 AM »
Colchicine is used by people with Gout.

 Gout is a buildup of Uric acid crystals in some peoples feet, between the bones, from memory.
 Its a Doctors prescription medicine but a lot of old people use it & often have old bottles with a few tablets still inside them.

ChesireCat

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2009, 10:04:04 PM »
From The Merck Index:

Monograph Number:  2496
Title:  Colchicine
CAS Registry Number:  64-86-8
CAS Name:  N-[(7S)-5,6,7,9-Tetrahydro-1,2,3,10-tetramethoxy-9-oxobenzo[a]heptalen-7-yl]acetamide
Molecular Formula:  C22H25NO6
Molecular Weight:  399.44. 
Percent Composition:  C 66.15%, H 6.31%, N 3.51%, O 24.03%
Literature References:  A major alkaloid of Colchicum autumnale L., Liliaceae.  Extraction procedure:  Chemnitius, J. Prakt. Chem. [II] 118, 29 (1928); F. E. Hamerslag, Technology and Chemistry of Alkaloids (New York, 1950) pp 66-80.  Structure:  Dewar, Nature 155, 141 (1945); King et al., Acta Cryst. 5, 437 (1952); Horowitz, Ullyot, J. Am. Chem. Soc. 74, 487 (1952).  Crystal structure:  L. Lessinger, T. N. Margulis, Acta Crystallogr. B34, 578 (1978).  Total synthesis:  Schreiber et al., Helv. Chim. Acta 44, 540 (1961); Van Tamelen et al., Tetrahedron 14, 8 (1961); Nakamura, Chem. Pharm. Bull. 8, 843 (1960); Sunagawa et al., ibid. 9, 81 (1961); 10, 281 (1962); Scott et al., Tetrahedron 21, 3605 (1965); Woodward, Harvey Lectures, Ser. 59 (Academic Press, New York, 1965) p 31; Kotani et al., Chem. Commun. 1974, 300; D. A. Evans et al., J. Am. Chem. Soc. 103, 5813 (1981).  Biosynthesis:  Leete, Tetrahedron Letters 1965, 333; Battersby et al., J. Chem. Soc. 1964, 4257; Hill, Unrau, Can. J. Chem. 43, 709 (1965).  Tubulin-binding activity:  J. M. Andreu, S. N. Timasheff, Proc. Nat. Acad. Sci. USA 79, 6753 (1982).  Toxicity:  S. J. Rosenbloom, F. C. Ferguson, Toxicol. Appl. Pharmacol. 13, 50 (1968); R. P. Beliles, ibid. 23, 537 (1972).  Clinical evaluations in cirrhosis of the liver:  M. M. Kaplan et al., N. Engl. J. Med. 315, 1448 (1986); D. Kershenobich et al., ibid. 318, 1709 (1988).  Bibliography of early literature:  Eigsti, Lloydia 10, 65 (1947).  Monograph:  O. J. Eigsti, P. Dustin, Jr., Colchicine in Agriculture, Medicine, Biology and Chemistry (Iowa State College Press, Ames, Iowa, 1955).  Reviews:  Fleming, Selected Organic Syntheses (John Wiley, London, 1973) pp 183-207; G. Lagrue et al., Ann. Med. Interne 132, 496-500 (1981); F. D. Malkinson, Arch. Dermatol. 118, 453-457 (1982).  Comprehensive description:  D. K. Wyatt et al., Anal. Profiles Drug Subs. 10, 139-182 (1981).
Properties:  Pale yellow scales or powder, mp 142-150°.  Darkens on exposure to light.  Has been crystallized from ethyl acetate, pale yellow needles, mp 157°.  [a]D17 -429° (c = 1.72).  [a]D17 -121° (c = 0.9 in chloroform).  pK at 20°:  12.35; pH of 0.5% soln:  5.9.  uv max (95% ethanol):  350.5, 243 nm (log e 4.22; 4.47).  One gram dissolves in 22 ml water, 220 ml ether, 100 ml benzene; freely sol in alcohol or chloroform.  Practically insol in petr ether.  Forms two cryst compds with chloroform, B.CHCl3 or B.2CHCl3, which do not give up their chloroform unless heated between 60 and 70° for considerable time.  LD50 in rats (mg/kg):  1.6 i.v. (Rosenbloom, Ferguson); in mice (mg/kg):  4.13 i.v. (Beliles).
Melting point:  mp 142-150°; mp 157°
pKa:  pK at 20°:  12.35; pH of 0.5% soln:  5.9
Optical Rotation:  [a]D17 -429° (c = 1.72); [a]D17 -121° (c = 0.9 in chloroform)
Absorption maximum:  uv max (95% ethanol):  350.5, 243 nm (log e 4.22; 4.47)
Toxicity data:  LD50 in rats (mg/kg):  1.6 i.v. (Rosenbloom, Ferguson); in mice (mg/kg):  4.13 i.v. (Beliles)
Use:  In research in plant genetics (for doubling chromosomes).
Therap-Cat:  Gout suppressant.  Treatment of Familial Mediterranean Fever.
Therap-Cat-Vet:  Has been used as an antineoplastic.

CC

OoBYCoO

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2010, 11:50:34 PM »
I'm definitely going to try that tek!  Thanks Vesp!

Hey, quick question...  I have some crocus bulbs outside in the garden.  Does it matter if I just go and dig one up or should I get a new one?

Vesp

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #14 on: November 20, 2010, 04:43:54 AM »
Well, I honestly cannot say because, like with almost all plants the alkaloid content varies from type of soil, time of year, time of day, and many other factors... but yes that will work. As do the ones in walmart - certainly worth a try. I promise you will notice reduced growth rate for a while compared to a control. This to me says it certainly happens, but it may not be 100% effective - and thus you might not get second generation from seed polyploids.
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OoBYCoO

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #15 on: November 30, 2010, 12:24:25 AM »
I went out and dug these up from the garden.  Are they enough??...  Mind you that I'm not looking to make a large amount of the solution.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2010, 12:26:14 AM by OoBYCoO »

overunity33

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #16 on: November 30, 2010, 05:49:05 AM »
Could this be used to boost the output of a standard hybrid strain cannabis plant such as white widow?

Vesp

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #17 on: November 30, 2010, 05:54:13 AM »
Those should be plenty -- someone here might be able to chime in on a better extraction method though, perhaps using alcohol would be preferred. It will just be a trial and error thing to figure out the quantity of solution needed for each plant.

Could this be used to boost the output of a standard hybrid strain cannabis plant such as white widow?

Perhaps perhaps. :)
Can't say 100% that it will work, but it is my understanding that the doubling of chromosomes of plants makes them stronger and better in a lot of ways, as well as a good trick to induce fertility of hybrids.

It might even work with fungi? I don't know - never heard of it working.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2010, 05:56:00 AM by Vesp »
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OoBYCoO

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #18 on: November 30, 2010, 05:55:02 AM »
From what I've read... yes.

director of sound

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Re: Crude Colchicine Extraction
« Reply #19 on: December 19, 2010, 07:39:04 AM »
im gonna give this a try on spiral aloe and peyote... got the seeds and bulbs on hand and ill post some pics when it all gets going. ill be doing the extraction a little different by extracting the crocus bulbs with ethanol and evaporating that then dissolving the colchicine goo in water for soaking the seeds. hoping for some cool results. it would be nice to have a peyote that would mature to flowering age in 2-3 years or less!