Author Topic: Alternatives to Al/Hg? (Read 137 times)

akcom · « **on:** March 23, 2010, 04:11:44 AM »

I'd like to hear some input from any bees here on amination procedures that scale up well. I have no interest in running ten Al/Hg reductions. I'm aware of the NaBH3CN reduction and this is the only alternative I've been able to come up with. The problem is getting NaBH3CN. It sounds like some very reactive stuff and the seller would have to make sure its not exposed to air or light. Hard to find someone willing to sell it under such circumstances.

Vesp · « **Reply #1 on:** March 23, 2010, 04:36:28 AM »

We don't really like talking about scaling up, so try to refrain from any mentioning of that. Also, did you search around? I know for a fact there is discussion regarding some alternative involving copper -- did you see it? I think just recently in a thread I linked back to those topics.

Quote from previous post:

Quote

Mercuric/aluminum amalgam reduction of substituted Beta-nitrostyrenes to amines (there is a lot of discussion here about the use of copper sulfate, NaCl, and HCl to do the reductions...) There is more info about it elsewhere... such as woelens (sp?) page. This might be of interest.
http://127.0.0.1/talk/index.php/topic,166.0.html

Anyways, hopefully that is of some help?

akcom · « **Reply #2 on:** March 23, 2010, 05:45:41 AM »

I understand not wanting to attract drug dealers, profiteers and the likes. But I'm not talking about reacting 500 gr batches of MDP2P at a time. Realistically though, I was able to get a decent amount of safrole from my efforts (and hence a decent amount of ketone). I'm just looking to maximize my yields and minimize my effort. And unfortunately running ~200mL of MDP2P through 8-10 amalgamation reductions just isn't my cup of tea.

Thanks for the info though, I read over the post and it was certainly an interesting discussion.

Vesp · « **Reply #3 on:** March 23, 2010, 06:06:02 AM »

Is it the toxicity you are worried about?

Goldmember · « **Reply #4 on:** March 23, 2010, 07:01:35 AM »

Originally posted by Barium or Polythenesam at the hive

Aluminum alloys having a high reducing capacity and preparation thereof

http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/4273679/description.html

Comments from the thread it was posted in:
(Dont know if I should post a direct link to that thread)

Osmium
(Stoni's sexual toy)
12-17-02 16:49
No 390360

"Hg works so well because of "overvoltage". You won't get that with most other metals. Their reducing power might still be good enough for some reactions, but not necessarily good enough for reductive aminations."

Rhodium
(Chief Bee)
12-21-02 07:56
No 391451

"The Hg activates the Al towards reaction, but deactivates it towards hydrogen gas evolution. "

lugh · « **Reply #5 on:** March 23, 2010, 11:29:33 PM »

It's easy for an experienced person to reductively aminate/alkylate 2 L of mdp2p in one run using the al/hg, the boro methods or the Leuckart reaction

No one is going to spoon feed you on how to do so for several good reasons, but there is the time tested route of doing it yourself on a smaller scale first

There are catalytic hydrogenation methods that can be used as well, but they require more equipment and are inherently more dangerous than the methods already mentioned so most people aren't interested in them

There is a lot of information on the internet about doing such reactions already, posting a thread asking about it isn't necessarily the best way to find out what you want to know

Author Topic: Alternatives to Al/Hg? (Read 137 times)

akcom

Alternatives to Al/Hg?

Vesp

Re: Alternatives to Al/Hg?

akcom

Re: Alternatives to Al/Hg?

Vesp

Re: Alternatives to Al/Hg?

Goldmember

Re: Alternatives to Al/Hg?

lugh

Re: Alternatives to Al/Hg?