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Author Topic: phenylacetic to phenylacetone  (Read 568 times)

tryl

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phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« on: January 15, 2012, 10:13:43 PM »
have done/am doing my homework, but based on actual hands on experience, which method works best/yields most?

also, might have to exclude/substitute the acetic anhydride.

"In the words of Archimedes, give me a lever long enough and a place to rest it... or I shall kill one hostage every hour."

smellslikeindole

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2012, 10:48:06 PM »
My goat says that he have bit into a tree and hurt his teeth.

The tree was the lead-acetate/PAA method what was not as good as expected and even the calcium acetate wasn't so good. But the goat heard a kid who said that iron(II)-acetate is better(:

The goat had a friend who used grignard reagents and had awesome yields with methyl-phenylacetate and methyl magnesium bromide in diethyl-ether(:

And also... Use the search engine.

lugh

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2012, 11:48:50 PM »
Chemistry is our Covalent Bond

Balkan Bonehead

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2012, 12:55:44 AM »

Baba_McKensey

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2012, 10:50:48 PM »

fishinabottle

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2012, 12:28:30 PM »
Yes, the magnesium hot tube or the dry distillation with lead acetate. The lead acetate distillation is technically less challenging, it can be done like the benzene procedure (look at SCM for benzene + Organikum). The hot tube is higher yielding when done right.

Baba_McKensey

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2012, 03:04:35 PM »

POSEIDON

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2012, 05:06:53 PM »
The chemists are a strange class of mortals, impelled by an almost insane impulse to seek their pleasures amid smoke and vapour, soot and flame, poisons and poverty; yet among all these evils I seem to live so sweetly that may I die if I were to change places with the Persian king.
— Johann Joachim

tryl

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2012, 05:16:52 PM »
oh, i am very skilled at google-fu, i just like to be spoon fed with links..

and what's so fucking wrong with that?
"In the words of Archimedes, give me a lever long enough and a place to rest it... or I shall kill one hostage every hour."

fresh1

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2012, 06:06:16 PM »
Whom are you suggesting to UTFSE more? ???

 A lot of people have posted in this thread

Tube furnaces, especially when the process runs for more than 12 hours, is not really the thing for this forum, as has been discussed at length ::)

Ok, I dont speak OR read russian, and my translators dont do cyrrilic, would you be so kind as to translate it for us :P although if its like the other 2 papers, see the comments below before you do!

As we try to be as OTC (Over The Counter) as possible, I note that 9 out of 15 of them chemicals listed here, in one of the papers you have posted, are virtually UNOBTAINABLE for 99% of the time, for most folks here.....so....its "unobtanium" for most

thanx for trying, but its a) nothing new b)about as "doable" at home, as enriching uranium ::)

Quote
acetic acid (64-19-7)
ethyl acetate (141-78-6)
methyl alcohol (67-56-1)
ether (60-29-7)
Norite (7782-42-5)
sodium (13966-32-0)
sodium ethoxide (141-52-6)
Benzyl cyanide (140-29-4)
Methyl benzyl ketone (103-79-7)
?-phenylacetoacetonitrile,
?-Tolunitrile, ?-acetyl- (4468-48-8)
sodium amide (7782-92-5)
phosphorus pentoxide

which of the above list do YOU have access to POSEIDON?

"Curiosity is a gift"

tryl

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2012, 06:19:41 PM »
Quote from: fresh1 on January 29, 2012, 06:06:16 PM
Whom are you suggesting to UTFSE more? ???

 A lot of people have posted in this thread

Tube furnaces, especially when the process runs for more than 12 hours, is not really the thing for this forum, as has been discussed at length ::)

Ok, I dont speak OR read russian, and my translators dont do cyrrilic, would you be so kind as to translate it for us :P although if its like the other 2 papers, see the comments below before you do!

As we try to be as OTC (Over The Counter) as possible, I note that 9 out of 15 of them chemicals listed here, in one of the papers you have posted, are virtually UNOBTAINABLE for 99% of the time, for most folks here.....so....its "unobtanium" for most

thanx for trying, but its a) nothing new b)about as "doable" at home, as enriching uranium ::)

Quote
acetic acid (64-19-7)
ethyl acetate (141-78-6)
methyl alcohol (67-56-1)
ether (60-29-7)
Norite (7782-42-5)
sodium (13966-32-0)
sodium ethoxide (141-52-6)
Benzyl cyanide (140-29-4)
Methyl benzyl ketone (103-79-7)
?-phenylacetoacetonitrile,
?-Tolunitrile, ?-acetyl- (4468-48-8)
sodium amide (7782-92-5)
phosphorus pentoxide

which of the above list do YOU have access to POSEIDON?



all of the listed, back home.
still haven't quite made it my habitat here, so can't say, but based on rumors, even more easily obtainable.
ridiculous, isn't it?
RP and I are competely 100% legal in BG, the combination of the two + ephedrine is what would get you in trouble.

and as delightful as that might sound, i think the fact i wish i never go back there is eloquent enough.
i kinda believe the sole reason we're EU is us being neighbors with turkey, the only geopolitical connect east-west, cos the turks still like to refer the to the armenian genocide as a "relocation of the armenian population", and brussels and france and particularly fascist scandinavia like to play the hypocrite role of being all so altruist. and then there's russia, the empire of psychopaths in the clinical sense that don't really believe in sharing.

anyway, think i got a little carried away painting teh political landscape.
good to have a buddy in the east, avoid vacations there. summarized shortly.
"In the words of Archimedes, give me a lever long enough and a place to rest it... or I shall kill one hostage every hour."

Baba_McKensey

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2012, 08:26:05 PM »
The Russian was translated.

tryl

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2012, 10:30:36 PM »
i kinda do differentiate between latin ad cyrillic, but thanks.
"In the words of Archimedes, give me a lever long enough and a place to rest it... or I shall kill one hostage every hour."

no1uno

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #13 on: February 13, 2012, 10:47:09 AM »
Quote from: fresh1 on January 29, 2012, 06:06:16 PM
Whom are you suggesting to UTFSE more? ???

 A lot of people have posted in this thread


They may have, that would be from an inherent sense of decency and trying to help. Have a good look around the various fora - their search engines will throw back bucketloads of results from the search terms. How many such threads need to be repeated ad nauseum? As far as I can see there are several very good results on this topic, a bunch more that are so-so and hundreds that have small jewels embedded in hours of tedious reading. On top of that there are absolutely fucking shitloads that are misleading, spend most of the thread off-topic or simply rehash what is already known, and as such are worthless search result filler that should have been closed at inception.

Search engines are wonderful things, keeping extraneous crap out of the system is the only way to keep them viable.
"...     "A little learning is a dang'rous thing;
    Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
    There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
    And drinking largely sobers us again.
..."

letters

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2012, 12:18:13 AM »
i think the dakin west with MIM and acetic anhydride it is the best by far for paa to p2p.  DOI : 10.1021/jo0607966
it has been posted multiple times on various forums.

letters

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2012, 12:19:32 AM »
looking again, looks like poseidon was even kind enough to upload this lovely procedure when he suggested that you UTFSE!

fishinabottle

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #16 on: March 31, 2012, 08:56:50 PM »
Quote from: letters on February 22, 2012, 12:18:13 AM
i think the dakin west with MIM and acetic anhydride it is the best by far for paa to p2p.  DOI : 10.1021/jo0607966
it has been posted multiple times on various forums.
No! Best is buying P2P or the wanted Amphetamine directly by Merck or Chinese Suppliers they have it!

MIM and acetic anhydride in special are even for one very good connected not easy to score in reasonable amounts. "Best" is not in the sense of chemists on this boards but means doable with decent results for a "normal" person without getting incarcerated or killing oneself. As I think.

regards
/ORG

jon

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #17 on: March 31, 2012, 09:51:33 PM »
oh no!
not another one!

POSEIDON

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #18 on: April 06, 2012, 03:44:34 PM »
A few more articles
The chemists are a strange class of mortals, impelled by an almost insane impulse to seek their pleasures amid smoke and vapour, soot and flame, poisons and poverty; yet among all these evils I seem to live so sweetly that may I die if I were to change places with the Persian king.
— Johann Joachim

no1uno

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Re: phenylacetic to phenylacetone
« Reply #19 on: April 13, 2012, 03:53:41 PM »
Quick question, has anyone got any real knowledge of designing a sulphur vapour bath? I'm guessing it is similar to a steam bath, but works at ~444C (the boiling point of sulphur - although an online hit gives 448C). What metals would be appropriate for constructing the same, considering they are going to be in contact with gaseous sulphur for an extended period and also they are probably going to need to be welded given the heat & pressure involved. I'm also guessing that there would be a need to remove oxygen from the system, to prevent the gaseous sulphur reacting with it (also water - because SO2 and water would be kind of a bastard on most metals).

Quite an interesting constant temperature heating unit though - depending upon the metal(s) that could be used. Even a flame, or packed BBQ briquettes could be used to heat the bath, which is kind of home friendly (the temperature itself most assuredly isn't).
"...     "A little learning is a dang'rous thing;
    Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
    There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
    And drinking largely sobers us again.
..."
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