Author Topic: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine  (Read 582 times)

no1uno

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Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« on: March 15, 2010, 11:58:02 AM »
Permonid (aka Desomorphine/Dihydrodesoxymorphine-D) can be made a couple of ways, the most well known of which involves hydrogenation of a-chlorocodide (made with thionyl chloride and codeine) and subsequent demethylation of the dihydrodesoxycodeine-D to dihydrodesoxymorphine-D.

Now, thanks to several people, we have a shorter, much more OTC and amateur friendly route to this substance...

Step 1 - Codeine.H2O to 8-Bromomorphide (from the first attached paper, page 4/4, bottom of the left column)

(8S)-8-Bromomorphide (16) Hydrobromide from Codeine.H2O (7).

A solution of 30% HBr in acetic acid (7.5 mL) was added to a solution of codeine.H2O (3, 1.58 g, 5 mmol) in glacial acetic acid (7.5 mL). The procedure was the same as that used for the preparation of 15%HBr. The 16âHBr crystals from the reaction mixture were obtained as a white solid (2.10 g, 98%). TLC of the crude material showed 2 minor impurities at Rf 0.26
and 0.55. The impurity of Rf 0.55 was isolated by column chromatography with solvent: CHCl3/MeOH/NH4OH (100:10:1). It was identified as desoxymorphine C (20, Scheme 2), which was found to be identical with Small’s sample 16 using TLC, MS, and 1H NMR. Free base 20 was crystallized from ethyl acetate: mp 192-193 °C (lit.16 mp 189-190 °C)....


Now, the tricky bit was working out the name Small, et al would have used for this substance, which it was discovered, was B-bromomorphide, so another article was sourced:

Hydrogenation of Bromomorphide

Bromomorphide was prepared by the method of Schryver and Lees and purified from methanol. It sintered and darkened at 164', and melted above 200". In methanol it showed [or]: +73.9" (c = 2.788). When bromomorphide was hydrogenated in methanol, with Pd-BaSO4, 4.85 g. of alkaloid took up 1.86 moles of hydrogen, and yielded 1.0 g. of dihydrodesoxymorphine-D hemihydrate. The remaining material was a viscous oil, containing a trace of the high-melting base mentioned under a-chloromorphide. The oil did not give a crystalline ether on treatment with diazomethane. The methylation product in benzene with methyl iodide gave a methiodide of m. p. 235-238", which appeared to be amorphous, and could be purified only by washing with acetone. It was not the monomethiodide of a dimolecular base, for analysis showed 29.51% iodine, and its properties were not those of bis-dihydrodesoxycodeine dimethiodide. The  hydrogenation of bromomorphide in methanol with platinum oxide gave only a small amount of crystalline product, which. proved to be tetrahydrodesoxymorphine.

Hydrogenation of bromomorphide in dilute hydrochloric acid gives more crystalline material than in methanol. From 4.85 g. of bromomorphide, absorption of 1.87 moles of hydrogen, 2.4 g. of dihydrodesoxymorphine-D hemihydrate, 0.2 g. of tetrahydrodesoxymorphine, and 1.2 g. of uncrystallizable oil were obtained.


The yields seems like shit, but it actually equates to some 78%, which could probably be improved upon, but given Rice's starting procedure is cited as giving a 98% yield, that means that the entire process gives about a 75% yield from GAA/HBr, dilute.HCl (and I'd be disposed to using Rice's improved hydrogenation technique using 10%Pd/C, 20psig (just above STP) with a stirrer over Small's dated procedure, the yields would probably improve too - similarly, increases in yield have been reported using EtOAc as solvent too, probably in this case with 1N HCl).

With a little work, this could be made to be the biggest find of quite some time - Codeine is still cheap and plentiful, anyone with a distillation setup (not me atm :'()  and some CaCl2 can purify EtOAc from the sheepworths-select-homebrand non-acetone nail-polish remover (pink IIRC). Using EtOAc it is possible to concentrate AA (liquid-liquid extraction from vinegar and the EtOAc allows for the preparation of PURE GAA by forming a low-boiling azeotrope with any remaining water).

The only things that are even slightly hard to acquire is HBr and Pd/C... But this would sure as fuck beat the living shit out of the homebake demethylation of codeine, both in terms of yield and the potency of the product. I wonder, what would the 6-monoacetyl variant be like?





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TooCold

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2010, 12:02:29 PM »
Excellent write up...I love to see people working on relatively OTC opiate chemistry.

m35

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2010, 01:31:04 AM »
Quote
Codeine is still cheap and plentiful
I know I'm probably missing a major detail here, but isn't codeine scheduled in most countries? How exactly is it obtainable (besides the blackmarket) without a prescription?

Sedit

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2010, 02:23:21 AM »
No its only scheduled in a few IIRC. I know of a couple major countrys that still sell it over the counter last I knew.
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mumbles

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2010, 03:53:21 AM »
HBr isn't that hard to synthesize but Pd/C is always unfortunately in the way of good opiate dreams. Nice find though. Yeap codeine is still available in many many countries.

Sedit

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2010, 05:09:40 AM »
Quote
Pd/C is always unfortunately in the way of good opiate dreams

Isn't there other means of performing the reduction? Many instances of literature for other reactions that call for Pd/C can be performed with relatively over the counter materials to perform the reduction. Pd/C in many cases is just the result of ease and access for the scientist. Would you toy with other reduction methods if you had Pd/C and H2 on hand all day everyday?
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fryzee

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2010, 12:27:54 PM »
as of april 2010 codeine in australia is going the way of psuedoephedrine and is becoming harder to get
you used to be able to buy 100 8mg tabs with no q's now you can only buy 40 without a prescription.
i think these restrictions will only get tighter :(

jon

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2010, 04:10:21 PM »
really nice find congrats on that one!
just curious what is the tertrahydro derivative?
is that the benzene ring reduced?
perhaps why they used a slightly poisoned version of palladium catalyst?

also in the united assfuck they have a over the counter version of codeine as a cough syrup but the pharmacists have to fill out so much paperwork to get it, few if, any carry the product.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2010, 04:37:37 PM by jon »

drone1240

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2010, 07:19:30 PM »
[quote author=jon link=topic=868.msg13345#msg13345 date=1279037421

also in the united assfuck they have a over the counter version of codeine as a cough syrup but the pharmacists have to fill out so much paperwork to get it, few if, any carry the product.

[/quote]

Ya in most of those northern states(OH MS) its a schedule five. You can buy 4 ounces over the counter every thirty days and its up to pharmtechs digression. Cool post though.
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Dongle

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #9 on: July 18, 2010, 02:48:33 AM »
If someone regularly travelled to a third-world country where codein sulphate in sugar syrupp was available OTC but the liter, what would be the best way to extract the Codeine Sulphate from the sugar syrup? Titrating a basic solution of water oxidizes the syrup into a nonusable mess.


jon

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #10 on: July 18, 2010, 04:10:53 PM »
ok i'll refine my answer a possibility is to
a: adjust the ph to 8.5-9 and see if whatever carbohydrates stand up to it chloroform is the preffered extraction solvent for codienes.
also bear in mind if this does not work there are sulfur containing antioxidants that are commonly used during these titrations to prevent oxidation usually in trace amounts as the presumed mechanism is free radical.
examples are sodium hydrosulfite sodium thiosulfate, etc.
i don't have time to delve too deeply into carbohydrate chemistry but page 201 of this book seems to suggest as i suspected that h2so3 protects carbohydrates from oxidation

http://books.google.com/books?id=E22gW9CbU_0C&pg=PA201&lpg=PA201&dq=carbohydrate+ph+oxidation&source=bl&ots=WIdWCeXNAE&sig=BXfL1Rvl--ozEbhp5cL8lCIv7ps&hl=en&ei=GilDTML2PML88Abs-qncDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CCgQ6AEwBjgK#v=onepage&q&f=false


hope that helps.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2010, 04:23:09 PM by jon »

no1uno

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2010, 09:49:53 PM »
From memory, the Tetrahydrodesoxycodeine is the diphenolic product (opening of the oxide bridge) such as one would get from the 3,4-ethylenedioxy-N-methylmorphinan, it is one phenolic group away from being levorphanol (in fact Gates, IIRC, came up with a way of converting the diphenolic base to 3-hydroxy-N-methylmorphinan but the yields sucked).
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jon

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2010, 04:11:27 AM »
good explanation, thanks!
now we know  why Pd/BSo4 is used.

this is why
ie. stronger catalysts split the 4,5 epoxy bridge.

It's not much, but in Chemical Reviews, (1985) 85(2), 129-170 they state:

" [the following] order of activity was found in the hydrogenolysis of benzyloxycarbonyl and benzyl protecting groups of peptides using cyclohexadiene as hydrogen donor, Ie., Pd black > 10%
Pd/C > 5% Pd/C > 10% Pd/BaS04 > 5% Pd/BaSO4."

ref provided: Felix, A. M.; Heimer, E. P.; Lambros, T. J.; Tzougraki, C.; Meienhofer, J. J. Org. Chem. 1978, 43, 4194.  
  
 
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=9881
« Last Edit: August 02, 2010, 04:42:58 AM by jon »

Assyl Fartrate

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2012, 06:24:38 PM »
Perhaps a nicer way of getting to the desired product - reduction of allylic alcohols to alkenes (with isomerization of the double bond) using amalgamated zinc in ether:

hxxp://www.orgsyn.org/orgsyn/prep.asp?prep=cv6p0769

Reduction of alkenes is easy, sodium dithionite is available by the bucket at any hardware store and it reduces alkenes easily.
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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #14 on: March 29, 2012, 07:36:14 PM »
Does anyone knows what method (EXATLY) are using Russian addicts?
One that uses Red P and I2, BUT NO SOCl2.

I found few ridiculous methods and more than few news articles but nothing with usable chemical background.
If anyone here speaks/reads Russian he might find it easily...

Lower is only usable info I found and it's definitely not "home-freindly" as that other method.

Quote
React SOCl2 with codeine, purify with 2M HCl then precipitate with Sodium Carbonate extract
the amorphous precipitate rapidly into ether. Repeat, then wash with cold ethanol, with
removes further inpurities. This give a-chlorocodide freebase.

Five grams of a-chlorocodide suspended in 100 ml of water was brought into solution by
addition of 37% hydrochloric acid and hydrogenated in the presence of 1.05 g. of
palladium-barium sulfate. The absorption amounted to 2.27 moles of hydrogen most
of which was taken up in the first hour. Expect it to be finished in under 11 hours.

By precipitation with ammonia and extraction with ether, 1.5 g. of Dihydrodesoxycodeine-D
hemihydrate was obtained.

A solution of 1.5 g. of dihydrodesoxycodeine-D in 4.5 ml of hydriodic acid,
sp. gr. 1.7 was boiled vigorously for three minutes.

To the cooled solution, water (about 15 cc.) was added slowly with scratching
until crystals no longer separated. The mixture was warmed nearly to boiling,
whereby the crystals became pure white and more granular. The yield of
dihydrodesoxymorphine-D hydriodide was 1.73 g.
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Tsathoggua

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #15 on: March 31, 2012, 06:17:10 AM »
Small wonder bodyparts fall off, no?:D
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jon

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #16 on: March 31, 2012, 06:36:35 AM »
yeah that's pretty fucked up, i saw the pictures i could'nt eat after that

Assyl Fartrate

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #17 on: March 31, 2012, 09:11:50 AM »
Those photos literally look like they're out of a twisted zombie film...

It's probably because desomorphine can't be cleaned up with a simple A/B like meth can... it's tricky to clean something like that without a column, without a significant quantity to crystallize, and without accurate pH control.
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fresh1

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #18 on: April 01, 2012, 09:45:58 AM »
Quote
yeah that's pretty fucked up, i saw the pictures i could'nt eat after that

pussy  ;D

Quote
Those photos literally look like they're out of a twisted zombie film...

It's probably because desomorphine can't be cleaned up with a simple A/B like meth can... it's tricky to clean something like that without a column, without a significant quantity to crystallize, and without accurate pH control.

nah the zombies are more together

Its bad enough taking some powder you dont really know what it is....I just couldnt bring myself to do this shit REGARDLESS of the stone :o

that said...how are we goona make some Permonid  ???
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Tsathoggua

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Re: Permonid Synthesis from Codeine
« Reply #19 on: April 02, 2012, 04:06:34 AM »
How unstable is desomorphine? this is new info to me.
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