Author Topic: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane  (Read 717 times)

NaBH4

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #20 on: September 04, 2010, 11:12:50 AM »
Tips for something very very darkside :

1) Chlorination of benzoic acid with Sodium Hypochlorite will give 3,5 dichlorobenzoic acid.
Fisher speier esterification of (pseudo)tropine by 3,5dichlorobenzoic acid will give a compound similar of Tropoxane (without the carbomethoxy group of course)

Which is far more potent than cocaine and act as a both dopamine and serotonine reuptake inhibitor (the problem of salicylic tropacocaine was the loss of serotonine reuptake inhibition)

Chlorination of vanilic acid/benzoic acid with Sodium Hypochlorite




2) Be careful with the following compound  :P
Fisher Speier esterification of (pseudotropine) with 2-(6-Methoxy-2-naphthyl)propionic acid (legit and cheap) will give an analogue of WF-33 (without the propanoyl group 'course).

WF-33 is one of the more potent cocaine analogue, the tropacocaine version should be far more potent than cocaine then.






Enjoy  :D



@Naphyrone : I used boric acid to help salicylic acid to dissolve in water ;) ;)
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Naphyrone

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #21 on: September 04, 2010, 11:23:21 AM »
Good stuff NaBH4 have you tried the 3,5, dichloro one yourself?
Also I meant that the salicyl tropane has to dissolve in water if you ROA was intranasal xD
Where as apparently the scopine impurity if using alkaloids from datura/nightshade etc. forms needles insoluble in water.

Also what does the HCL salt of the salicyl tropane look like?
« Last Edit: September 04, 2010, 11:27:53 AM by Naphyrone »

NaBH4

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #22 on: September 04, 2010, 11:29:17 AM »
I'm planning to synthetize the 3,5 dichloro analogue next week (damn, lot of things to do next week ^___^).
I'll post the results.

Yeap, tropacocaine and salicylic tropacocaine or Dichlorotropacocaine are painful in nose. For salicylic tropacocaine I used xylocaïne ^____^


Do you mean that, if you're doing an water extraction of datura, you won't have scopine impurities ?
That'll be a..dream :D
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Naphyrone

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #23 on: September 04, 2010, 11:35:43 AM »
Not a water extraction of datura but rather being able to separate the salicyl scopine from the salicyl tropacocaine after one does the hydrolysis with the alkaloids and then salts. Then transfer salts to water, and the salicyl-scopine impurity should not dissolve unlike the salicyl tropacocaine; recrystallize then compromise a little more yeild for purity by doing it over again.
Still haven't answered what the salicyl tropacocaine looks like :P
« Last Edit: September 04, 2010, 11:37:33 AM by Naphyrone »

Naphyrone

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #24 on: September 04, 2010, 11:55:09 AM »
Fucking damnit, that book i referenced, was talking about a glycoside called scopoline, i was thinking scopoline was an alternative name for scopine. Fucking google.

Naphyrone

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #25 on: September 04, 2010, 12:14:20 PM »
Ok maybe it's not as bad as i thought...

"Bayne et a14 have reported that after extraction from plasma and brain, scopolamine is
hydrolyzed in NaOH to scopine which immediately undergoes rearrangement to scopoline 2
(Fig 1). Derivatization of scopoline with heptafluorobutyric anhydride (HFBA) and ..."

http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/content~db=all~content=a747212538

I can't view the full version of that doc.

[edit] ok guys, i don't think i have anything to sweat after reading the part of this paper(luckily just the part i needed to know)this http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/ja01560a042
apparently scopine rearranges to scopoline upon hydrolysis if it is not a quaternary salt.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2010, 12:24:20 PM by Naphyrone »

Vesp

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #26 on: September 04, 2010, 03:41:51 PM »
What about Datura stramonium var Tatula, or datura wrightii?

I'd be interested too see the source you've heard that..

below is a preview of Mechanism of the isomerization of tropine into pseudotropine - it might be useful to some..
« Last Edit: September 04, 2010, 04:00:37 PM by Vesp »
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Naphyrone

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #27 on: September 05, 2010, 08:22:19 AM »
ok tropine is expensive and it would probably cost more in solvents, yield etc. working from atropine containing plants, tropine/tropinone being slightly watched, i think the best route if possible would be synthesizing the tropine and nortropine oneself from 1,4-Butanedione(made from oxidizing 1,4-Butanediol), amonia or methylamine and acetone dicarboxylic acid calcium salt. However im not sure on the overall yield of this process or aware of the specifics. Wikipedia says that improvements have lead to 90% yield. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropinone The other thing is the reduction to tropine:/

NaBH4

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #28 on: September 05, 2010, 11:37:04 AM »
This synthesis give 2-Carbomethoxy-Tropinone isn't it ?

You asked me about NaBH4 but simply I2/red phosphorus could be used or even 1,5% sodium amalgam as a catalyst  :D
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Naphyrone

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #29 on: September 05, 2010, 12:10:38 PM »
It gives tropinone, from what I've read. Better yields than the condensation with acetone. I just need to find a detailed synth paper.
Help, anyone???

NaBH4

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #30 on: September 05, 2010, 12:28:14 PM »
Succinaldehyde + methylamine + methyl ester of Acetone Dicarboxylic acid give 2-Carbomethoxy-Tropinone ;)

The problem with that is to find methylamine (controlled because of methamphetamine potential use) and anhydride acetic which is the key of Acetone dicarboxylic acid ==> acetone dicarboxylic anhydride ==> Acetone dicarboxylic monomethyl ester.


Anyway, tropinone could be bought and simply reduced to have tropine. Then pseudotropine is formed in a NaOH bath refluxed (epimerisation) to have good yield of 3-pseudotropine.

cheers !
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Evilblaze

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #31 on: September 05, 2010, 06:41:12 PM »
Ohhhh, what have I found on orgsynth ;)

http://www.orgsyn.org/orgsyn/prep.asp?prep=cv4p0816
This is the synthesis of pseudopelletierine what is really similar to tropinone, the only difference is one carbon and to hydrogen. Here the starting aldehyde is glutaraldehyde instead of succinaldehyde what is needed for the tropinone. The yields are really-really good. If we are lucky, than the synthesis of tropinone will also have a similar yield 58–68%.

Can anyone get a normal synthesis for succinaldehyde from 2,5-Dimethoxytetrahydrofuran? It would be almost a miracle! Because 2,5-dimethoxytetrahydrofuran is cheap as hell ;D
At first I found this: To 400 ml of 0.2 N sulfuric acid was slowly added 44.2 g (0.334 mol) of 2,5-dimethoxytetrahydrofuran (Aldrich) and stirred for 15 min. The succindialdehyde was allowed to stand for 4 h without further treatment.
-but it would be good to know that what is the yield and how does this should be made....
« Last Edit: September 05, 2010, 07:30:02 PM by Evilblaze »

Naphyrone

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #32 on: September 05, 2010, 09:52:27 PM »
Evil blaze, for the succinaldehyde, 1,4-butanediol and KMnO4 is what i'm thinking($40 for 2 liters 1,4-butanediol). NaBH4, methylamine from hexamine, could one use plain ammonia for nortropinone? Also "Acetonedicarboxylic acid or 3-oxoglutaric acid is a simple carboxylic acid, which may be used as a building block in organic chemistry.
It is commercially available. It may also be prepared by the one-pot decarboxylation and oxidation of citric acid by sulfuric acid:[2]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acetonedicarboxylic_acid
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropinone

« Last Edit: September 05, 2010, 09:58:11 PM by Naphyrone »

Vesp

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #33 on: September 05, 2010, 10:01:13 PM »
If I remember correctly, it isn't just sulfuric acid - but a mixture of SO3, and H2SO4. though, I could be wrong.
I remember looking into this reaction a while ago and it has quite a few turn offs.
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Evilblaze

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #34 on: September 05, 2010, 10:10:57 PM »
Oxidation 1,4 butanediol to succinaldehyde with KMnO4 looks as a dead idea for me. These are cheap chemicals, but the yield would be really low because the permanganate is a really aggressive oxidizer and it would oxidise the aldehyde to carboxylic acid in a minute.
Th is is the same reason whydo the don't make glyoxal from glycol and KMnO4....
Methylamine is available, as I remember I still have a half liter of water solution from it somewhere..... But it will be easy to find it, because it's "special odor"  ;D
Acetone dicarboxylic acid can be ordered from chemical supplier 50g is around 25 Euro.

So the only question would be the succinaldehyde. The 2,5-Dimethoxytetrahydrofuran is also cheap, 100g is only 40 Euro. And if just sulfuric acid or sulfuric acid and SO3 (what is also not so hard to get) should be added to it, and it would have a relative good yield, than it would be awesome.

I've just found something: http://www.google.com/patents?id=zucKAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4&source=gbs_overview_r&cad=0
US patent 6,486,323 B1. At example 1, 7, 8, 9 and 10 they start with making succindialdehyde from 2,5-dimethoxytetrahydrofuran, but they don't write the yields of the reaction. Maybe.... It's almost quantitative? That's hard to believe.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2010, 10:37:57 PM by Evilblaze »

Goldmember

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #35 on: September 06, 2010, 08:10:04 AM »
GB 844830

Alkali metal bisulphite adducts of succinaldehyde are prepared by reacting an aqueous solution of a 2,5-dialkoxy- or 2,5-diacyloxy-tetrahydrofuran with an alkali metal bisulphite. The reaction is advantageously carried out at an elevated temperature, e.g. about 100 DEG C., for preferably 80-100 DEG C., for about 6-12 hours. The product separates as a bis-alkali metal bisulphite dihydrate and may be recrystallised from an aqueous alkanol. Tropanone is prepared by reacting succinaldehyde bis-sodium bisulphate dihydrate, acetone dicarboxylic acid and methylamine hydrochloride in aqueous solution for 3 days at room temperature.

US2857427 another from the same mob.

US2710883---> From tetrahydrofuran

Hydrolysis with plain old muriatic acid is said to work, so Ive read somewhere.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2010, 08:52:14 AM by Goldmember »

Sydenhams chorea

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #36 on: September 12, 2010, 09:15:43 AM »
2,5-dimethoxytetrahydrofuran can be easily prepared from anodic oxidation of malic acid.

Unfortunately I lost the reference, but it should be easily found by any of you with Scifinder or Beilstein access, or general good searching skills. From the top of my head, I remember that in an undivided cell at platinum electrodes and high current density (Pt wire), 2 eq (anhydrous) malic acid was partially neutralised with 1 eq KOMe in MeOH and current was passed through. Succinicdialdehyde was formed which under the rxn conditions reacted with the MeOH to form 2,5-dimethoxytetrahydrofuran, in decent yields and as the main product.

Malic acid is dirt cheap and widely available (brewery suppliers), it would be easy to give it a try.

The reaction mechanism goes along the line of the Kolbe rxn
« Last Edit: September 12, 2010, 09:18:17 AM by Sydenhams chorea »
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Sydenhams chorea

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #37 on: September 12, 2010, 09:39:55 AM »
Concerning acetonedicarboxylic acid: oleum as used in the Org Syn procedure is not necessary, conc. H2SO4 will do fine on dry citric acid according to Peckmann.

Just be sure to vent the shitload of CO produced in this reaction. ;D
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t8er

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #38 on: September 18, 2010, 11:16:36 PM »
NaBH4 did you get around to synth the 3,5 dichloro analogue ??

if so how did it go ?
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NaBH4

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Re: kitchen-tek cocaine analog? 3-psuedotropyl-ortho-hydrox/acetoxy-tropane
« Reply #39 on: September 19, 2010, 07:51:23 PM »
Did the aspirin analogue yet.
Dichloro is for another day  ;D but i'm planning to make it, don't worry.
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