Author Topic: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.  (Read 351 times)

overunity33

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #20 on: October 26, 2010, 11:09:52 PM »
I don't think strike could have done it any worse... He started a chemical company after a stint in jail for meth manufacturing, wrote multiple books on the subject, which he published through a company he set his family members up with, then started the hive and sold blatantly questionable amounts/combinations of chems to anyone that would send $$ his way.. not to mention was directly involved in numerous large scale mdma labs.   I think strikes story is a testament to how HARD it is to get yourself busted if you follow basic rules...

poorfish

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2010, 09:31:35 AM »
Perhaps one is confused, but regarding the subject of these "grants", could that not create huge huge huge potential problems for the site and its opperators if the recepient turned Turkey and used it to fund a nefarious opperation, and was caught doing so? Maybe even...conspiracy trial type problems? Again, one probably misunderstood, and/or fails to grasp how rigorously these recipients would be scrutinized prior to money exchanging hands, but it seemed worthy of consideration
??? Maybe? O_o

Regards,
-poorfeeeeeeeeeesh
And the boy's father was shouting:

Quote
"He doin' the stanky leg! He doin' the stanky leg! Two yearz ol' an' he doin' the stanky leg an' he NOT EVEN TRIPPIN'!!"

The infant was, in fact, doing 'the stanky leg.'

Believe me boy, I seen everything.

Vesp

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #22 on: November 26, 2010, 09:39:02 AM »
Obviously that would be an issue and would be completely avoided. It would not even give grants for research based on explosives..
But instead just good old' fun amateur chemistry, biology, and whatever else..
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poorfish

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #23 on: November 26, 2010, 04:51:41 PM »
Cool, cool was just a random thought  :P

It should be put forth that this is indeed a good idea Vesp, seems like most of the replies have been "well yeah but don't F that S in the A, mang" (mine included), and obviously if one has the capacity to put together a forum such as this, one would know/understand how to do so safely/properly (one hopes)  ;)

In any case, apologies if one only added to the storm clouds above Vesp's parade ;D

Do it to it!

-po'fish
And the boy's father was shouting:

Quote
"He doin' the stanky leg! He doin' the stanky leg! Two yearz ol' an' he doin' the stanky leg an' he NOT EVEN TRIPPIN'!!"

The infant was, in fact, doing 'the stanky leg.'

Believe me boy, I seen everything.

OoBYCoO

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #24 on: November 26, 2010, 09:38:50 PM »
Well I'm a little late to this thread and I would tell you Vesp to definitely do it....  I think that's it's a wonderful idea and everyone that has posted on this thread has contributed excellent ideas as well as the precautions you should take.  So I wish you all the best of luck in your endeavors.
Even though I am in no way on the level that everyone here is in the sciences I have gained valuable information from both here as well as your other forum! ;D
« Last Edit: November 26, 2010, 09:57:48 PM by Vesp »

Happyman

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2010, 03:18:36 AM »
The challenges here might be a little too complicated, but ever been on Innocentive? A lot of the challenges there are team challenges, we could be a team! http://www2.innocentive.com/

Vesp

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2010, 06:31:32 AM »
I will look into that more -- I think a site ran kickstarter would be the best - but have it be for smaller amounts of money at first, as well as incorporate a voting system that would allow for the sites money made via ads, donations, and supporter accounts to add to the most wanted but unfunded research projects.
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RoidRage

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2010, 07:28:40 AM »
I have read this thread many times Vesp, and I think your idea is simply awesome...The only thing is, most researchers here aren't really into legality as far I know, so getting involved with money into probably isn't a legally good idea... Just my 2 cents !

That idea would probably be a lot better on a site like sciencemadness...

Vesp

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2010, 08:10:31 AM »
It wouldn't be on this site, nor for ""these"" people... so to speak -- unless you happen to be like me - where you don't actually do anything illegal - I know a lot of people really just enjoy reading stuff and get a little curious about this sort of chemistry, but do not part-take in it at all - or they only try to find new ways to something that might be useful - such as a certain type of oxidizing agent, etc.

Of they just have an interest in exotic/medicinal plants, mushrooms  and so on...

It would be more fitting for a sciencemadness type site - even though a large majority of them are hive members, or people interested in such subjects - and if they aren't those people, they are interested in explosives - which is perhaps even worse for a recieving a grant.

I want the site to mainly focus on biological issues - for now, botany, and mycology - it can have a few questionable plants, and what not - but eventually I hope it turns into something that gets people trading bacterial samples, interesting legal seeds, and getting grants to make such things as acetic acid, acetone, butanol, butyric acid, and alginic acid from azobacterium or whatever that little bug is called...
As well as making haploid plants, polyploid plants, hybrids via protoplast fusion, finding ideal micro-propagation nutrient mixes for various plants, or how to get them to start flowering, etc...

I am pretty sure there is a lot of potential when keeping it biologist and chemistry or biochemistry related. It will have to be started just like any other forum and than slowly add onto getting a grant system, a journal, and a classifieds in place...
still working out all of the minor details and what not - and I am still not really happy with the forum structure.. - but it is coming along.

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RoidRage

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2010, 08:18:29 AM »
Don't get me wrong Vesp, I don't actually mind if ''thoses guys'' gets the grant...The nature of my out-of-university research are REALLY QUESTIONABLE  ;) I'm just saying you sounds like a great guy, and that you're not into illegal stuff, so I hope you can't get into trouble financing some Researchers :P

Vesp

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #30 on: November 28, 2010, 10:55:03 AM »
Oh yeah, that would be a concern - but when it would be done I would have a contract, form a non-profit organziation and obviously not have a clue IF that ended up happening.
I want to just get DIYbio off the ground for the most part... nothing wrong with getting it so critters can make our chemicals for us :D
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RoidRage

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #31 on: November 28, 2010, 11:13:03 AM »
Agreed  :D

Anyway, I don't consider anything people are doing here bad...Otherwise I wouldn't be here ;D. I REALLY like this place since it seems that while the topics are of questional (and interesting!!!) nature, the people here are smarter than the persons I'm studying with at university ??? ;D

By the way, I really like your little-chemists plants :D I wish I was that dedicated at botany..
« Last Edit: November 28, 2010, 11:17:07 AM by RoidRage »

Vesp

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #32 on: November 28, 2010, 10:44:32 PM »
Yeah - this isn't much at all, but it is a start...
http://www.thelaboratory.org/

I need to find ways to improve it - but it is hard to make the site better when there is so little content, and much fewer users.

Needs a lot of work, so far I have mostly just been focusing on the forum.
Its pretty tricky to get people interested in making chemicals from plants or bacteria (especially) - so I will just get it going like any other forum by selling out to the main interests - than slowly drive the forum into the direction I want it to go in...

Feel free to join and post if you want - I would appreciate the help. No need to bring up this site on that site, though. You might even want to use a different pseudonym but I don't really care.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2010, 10:47:44 PM by Vesp »
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hypnos

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #33 on: November 29, 2010, 07:15:17 AM »
Quote
Well I'm a little late to this thread and I would tell you Vesp to definitely do it....  I think that's it's a wonderful idea and everyone that has posted on this thread has contributed excellent ideas as well as the precautions you should take.  So I wish you all the best of luck in your endeavors.
Even though I am in no way on the level that everyone here is in the sciences I have gained valuable information from both here as well as your other forum! Grin



Took the words out of my mouth!!

   As is THE caveat,,,,"its NOT FOR HERE"  but yes its a neat idea,,,,

     I think 'capitalising' on maybe having some "homework help online"...make it fun...like the "Facebook of/for chemistry people"]
  THE place to find an answer...IMO   Sciencmadness has become too "serious"  ::)

            I'm not sure "publishing" anything is that important,,,,

.maybe their could be "prizes" for the best "forum peer reviewed" experiment thread, OR chemistry Idea's i.e another nifty oxidant/process :-\


  go for ya life waspman...

ps. klosetchem13 sounded a touch disinhibited,,however, di anyone get this punnishing bit..
Quote
.Amine lets face it
...amine= I mean...kinda neat 8)  



I dunno why this whole post is in "quotation blue" It shouldnt be????
(I fixed it, forgot to end the quote mark - vesp ;) )
« Last Edit: November 29, 2010, 07:37:54 AM by Vesp »
"the two things you can give away and never lose, are what you know, and how you feel...."

Vesp

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #34 on: December 04, 2010, 01:52:48 AM »
all right, so the forum (the laboratory) is having a hard time getting started - what is it that turns people off about it?

and what do you think I can do to get people more interested?

**I realize it is on a very cliche topic, but it is mostly focusing on things like micropropagation, colchicine, and that sort of stuff...

How to alter it into something better?

People just are not joining it, or really finding it.
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Sedit

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #35 on: December 04, 2010, 05:26:41 AM »
Hmmm, how long has it been?

How long did you have here before it took off? I feel there is an initiation point in a forum kind of like a chemical reaction where things appear to proceed very slow until combustion. Combustion can be trigged by a catalyst of somesorts.... What was the catalyst here??? Find something simular to set ablaze The Laboratory forum....

I think your best bet of finding that head over heels enthusiast is more then likely over at the shroomery if I would have to guess. A pot head will also help expand the site since they are dedicated to growing there plants and can share a topic many want to join in the conversation. Its all about enthusiasumm.

Hit me up for suggestions Vesp...
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Vesp

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #36 on: December 04, 2010, 08:29:20 AM »
..ok, well the amount of posts on the laboratory far exceed the posts when this site was begging... but it has been greatly been "inflated" by conversations with friends and me just adding a lot of crap to the site about my plants, etc.

Quote
What was the catalyst here???

Llamabox, and You were the catalyst here. lol I am in need of finding someone like that for biology for the laboratory - someone like Una from the shroomery, or a few other things.

I will try to get someone from the growery or the shroomery maybe. I've kind of been sharing it on other sites but it seems the people that really helped get this site. I've been trying to contact llamabox, but I've had no success... same with justme. He has been gone for a long time.. :S

I think once I start to post about my attempts at micropropagation and callus formation of salvia, san pedro, jolokia, banana, and poppy, etc for 'mass' production it will get more attention...
I just need them to grow out more -- there is a lot of interest in that field.

I guess it is going fine actually now that I have compared its statistics to this sites...
I am just being impatient I guess..




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salat

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #37 on: December 04, 2010, 10:53:47 AM »
Maybe you need a different venue - sort of a combo blog & discussion.  I have seen some good science blogs and learned a lot from them - they usually allow comments, but I don't know if that would satisfy your desire for interaction and discussion.  

I have been thinking of getting a blog simply because when I know I may be writing something up for someone else later, I take better notes and do less deviation from my plans.

Also if other people know what you're working on they may have suggestions etc, I often don't want to write until I am finished because it isn't useful to people til you have results and there are a gazillion people posting theoretical plans that they are hoping someone will either explain or shoot down so they don't have to think about them.

Thinking of "the laboratory"  in marketing terms, as a concept it seems to lack focus, but in practice has a focus on plant chemistry & micropropagation.  Thinking of the chemistry sites I have joined since I got into chemistry, there are only 3 I visit daily - SciMadness, the Collective, & Vespiary.

I love Vespiary for it's laid back flavor and very deep information.  I download the references automatically because the requests are deep and usually indicate potentially productive experimental directions.   My level of chemistry skills isn't really up to most of what goes on here so my posts are infrequent but I follow it daily.  Actually they aren't up to the other forums either, but there were some threads already started at collective that fit what I'm working on so I stuck my neck out to get 25 decent posts going.  (Didya see Chi's cat-eating New thread button icon?) Ya'll do a good job of moderation so there isn't a lot of flaming and ego BS like some sites overall it's a great place to hang out.

 "The laboratory" overlaps with a lot of other sites so while I enjoy it as a site, especially because of it's emphasis on plant stuff it does overlap with some of the mushroom/plant sites.  I think it might be more successful if you narrow it's focus to what you love - Hobby plant propagation and breeding or something in that neighborhood.  The need to keep the topics clean makes it less useful to many of the people who post on vespiary.  For example, I hesitated to post my ephedra extraction explorations because even though it is something I am pursuing for the challenge of it, it could be considered technically illegal.  Also right now there isn't much content, a few really great threads would probably help it - chances are you aren't going to find yourself in the search engines for a while.  It takes a good while for people to find you.  I found this site because it was in your tag line at other sites.  So advertise!!

Before I retired, I worked closely with a govt. grant writer and the reviewers are pretty lax, but you need a certain level of (can't think of the term) to get a grant.  Their worst nightmare would be to give a grant to someone doing something even remotely shady - although govt's and corps get away with shady easier than citizens - in other words they'll scutinize the hell out of you if you're not an agency of some sort.

I joined a bunch of different sites and they all have a different flavor:
   Drugs-forum is Blah and too big - more of a drug news site than a place to discuss chemistry although there are some good informational posts and threads there from before they banned it.  
   Science Madness is a great site that is more general in its tone, it seems very good for metal/catalyst and macgiver chemistry.
   The Collective is a cool place with good info on drug chemistry and weird conversations but I hate having to write in SWIM syntax cause if what I were doing was illegal referring to self as SWIM ain't gonna do much good.
 
  Can't even remember all the plant/ enthogen forums I joined, they seem rather narrowly focused than I usually want to be.  I'm sure there are a gazillion places already dedicated to Cannabis production so you would want to avoid that since I think you are interested in blazing new trails.

(just realized I recommended you narrow your focus when that isn't something I like - basically The laboratory feels like a more restrictive version of Vespiary)
Salat
« Last Edit: December 04, 2010, 11:13:58 AM by salat »
Salat

Vesp

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #38 on: December 04, 2010, 06:30:32 PM »
I agree it does need more focus - but it is kind of tricky to give it the focus I want - I want it to deal with using plants, fungi,bacteria for the production of chemicals, and how to modify the organisms - So I guess essentially bioprospecting - searching for plant or animal species for use as a source of commercially exploitable products.
Since I want it to deal with plants, fungi, and bacteria - its hard for me to properly categorize it, while keeping it a narrow focused site.
I suppose it might be wise just to turn it into something like this:

Advanced Biology
*Discussion involving advanced techniques such as PCR, protoplast fusion, isolation of mutant strains, etc)
Bioprospecting
*Discuss searching for plant or animal species for use as a source of commercially exploitable products, such as medicinal drugs, ornemental plants, food, etc)
Tissue Culture
*Discuss anything relating to tissue cultures of fungi, plant, or animal cells.
Biology in General
*Discuss anything related to biology that is fairly simple.
Biology Techniques, Tutorials, Grow Logs, and Pictures
*Share your techniques on cultivation and propagation, how you grow, and what you've grown.
Acquisition & Improvised Equipment
*where to get, how to get and make equipment.


But that almost makes it confusing what it is even wanting to be discussed... Though I guess it is a better layout. not sure.

« Last Edit: December 04, 2010, 06:42:25 PM by Vesp »
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salat

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Re: Vesp's Great Idea - In need of advice.
« Reply #39 on: December 04, 2010, 09:26:03 PM »
Actually phytochemistry and phytochemical are terms used for this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytochemistry
Economic Botany is related.

Salat
« Last Edit: December 04, 2010, 09:29:58 PM by salat »
Salat