Author Topic: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification  (Read 278 times)

Assyl Fartrate

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Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« on: September 15, 2012, 06:57:40 PM »
Tertiary alcohols can be converted to tertiary carboxylic acids with CO and H2SO4 (Koch-Haaf hydrocarboxylation). The source of CO can be formic acid or oxalic acid. See attached document...

It'd be simple enough to convert this into the ethyl ester by working up with EtOH. It would be similar structurally to the propionic ester, except the the carbonyl carbon in the carboxyl would be bonded to the main loperamide structure as opposed to the ethyl.

It would be much easier to prepare the des-chloro compound without that benzylic hydroxyl to worry about.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2012, 09:37:17 PM by Assyl Fartrate »
Someone Who Is Me

Dope Amine

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2012, 09:45:44 AM »
Any new ideas about improving the activity of loperamide interests me.  I don't understand you statement though: "It would be much easier to prepare the des-chloro compound without that benzylic hydroxyl to worry about."  My CTH removal of the Chlorine atome, performed similarly to the paper I cited, seemed to work just fine and CTH's are one of my favorite reactions due to their ease of setup (erlenmeyer flask on stir-plate), ease of work-up and confirmation of successful reaction by the observation of bubbles (carbon dioxide generation (if using potassium formate, not necessarily ammonium formate because of potential hydrogen generation).

Also, that paper is excellent for just getting a better general understanding of the CTH mechanism and optimum conditions.  I recently did an imine reduction via CTH and at first I wasn't getting the reaction to go  (no bubbles).  Then I thought about all of the NaCl, as well as other amine formate and potassium formate salts that were in my reaction mixture, and because of that paper I realized that I might need to add a bit more water because the salts might be tied up with the salt ions and therefore not as available for coordination to the palladium.  I added more water and the reaction took off. 

Both water and the formate ion need to be able to coordinate to Pd.  The paper found that the ideal ratio was 3:1, moles of water to formate.

atara

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2012, 08:03:12 PM »
So... this could also be used, perhaps, to convert ephedrine to methylphenidate analogs? Or would the nitrogen somehow interfere?

Also, this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_monoxide_poisoning#Signs_and_symptoms

jon

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2012, 06:03:53 PM »
dope-amine you failed to mention that ammonium salts cause dimerization of the benzene rings i wasted 40 bucks before i learned this.
also i don't think it could take the punishment of h2so4 catalyzed reflux unless the concentrations were very low.
it might well work to catalyse your ester since we are'nt to worried here about neurotoxicity why not try that next?
« Last Edit: November 03, 2012, 01:23:21 AM by jon »

Assyl Fartrate

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2012, 06:44:22 AM »
Quote
I don't understand you statement though: "It would be much easier to prepare the des-chloro compound without that benzylic hydroxyl to worry about."

Namely, being able to use reductions to strip off the chlorine that would otherwise remove the benzylic hydroxyl as well.

Quote
So... this could also be used, perhaps, to convert ephedrine to methylphenidate analogs? Or would the nitrogen somehow interfere?

So long as ephedrine doesn't rearrange, yes - but this is a hot and acidic environment. It would take experimental data or a review paper to be sure, but there's good reason to believe that the alpha methyl would just scoot over, providing an inactive product.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2012, 06:49:22 AM by Assyl Fartrate »
Someone Who Is Me

jon

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2012, 07:38:29 AM »
these reductions aryl dehalogenations always take place under basic conditions no alcohol going to eliminate there.
i sussed it all out

Dope Amine

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2012, 05:32:31 AM »
My preferred synthesis of deschloro-Lop.  Please read the paper if you're interested. 

To a 500 ml flask are added: 0.01 mol Lop HCl (5.135 g), ~250 ml EtOH/IPA (whichever or both, EtOH will make the reaction go a bit faster), (consider converting to the freebase either prior to reaction or while in solution with equal molar KOH before Pd/C-remember water generation for below calc's),1 equivalent of formic acid,  1 equivalent of KOH, .1 grams Pd/C 10% (not sure what mol% that actually worked out to, maybe could be less, the paper calls for 0.2% Pd).  Ideally, one wants the ratio of water to formate to be 3:1 but the water from the 90% formic acid plus the water from making the potassium formate is going to make the amount of water greater than for optimal reaction rate.  If one wanted to, they could just increase the KOH and formic acid to get the optimal ratio.  If one were using a larger amount of Lop HCl then eventually water would need to be added to get the 3:1 ratio.  Anywayz, heat to reflux, or if concerned about the hydroxyl, at least to a temp. where all materials are dissolved (>50-60 deg.C).  If using the optimized water:formate ratio and EtOH then the reaction would be complete by 1 hour of reflux.  If using IPA then it would be 93% complete at an hour. Factor in your solvent and water ratio and heating as needed.  (The paper doesn't call for reflux even, just 50 degrees, but in my case higher heat was needed for me to get everything dissolved.)

Jon- I told you once that I preferred potassium formate over ammonium formate because it was considered the best CTH hydrogen donor.  Methylammonium formate is going to be present in an imine reduction with an excess of the amine, methylamine in my case, but I would never recommend ammonium formates over potassium formates personally.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2012, 09:55:00 AM by Dope Amine »

jon

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2012, 10:40:35 PM »
dopamine i see once again you not taking into account the protons associated with lop hcl.
remember once you failed in your reduction because the conjugated acid neutralized your potassium formate and you only used one mole of potassium formate.
that's why you spotted co2 evol. but no joy.
you shoulld take this into account in the future this reaction preffers basic conditions anyway
it might have worked this time because you refluxed it up to 80C i can see that increasing hcooh activity.
it might have actually worked like this you neutralized your lop hcl by that addition of base then the HCOOH would associate with the basic tertiary amine as a conjugate base so you had the ion-counterion in play and the reduction worked.
depending on the order of addition, which i see you added the acid first.
so that means at best an incomplete reduction maybe 20-30% reduction i had some tlc data for loperamide we might have to start doing this to proove it out.
bioassays aside.
with all due respect and diligence.
yours, truly.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2012, 11:07:11 PM by jon »

Dope Amine

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2012, 09:39:02 AM »
I don't know what to say except I have only done this deschloropropionyl-Lop synthesis ONE time.  Therefore, this is the same reaction where I used 1:1 potassium formate.  I had CO2 generation.  If the HCl from the lop HCl neutralized the KOH which was added at the end then formic acid can, although not as well, do CTH on it's own.  Shit, the loperamide ammonium formate could have gotten the job done.  There's just too many unknowns.  At the same time that the aromatic Cl hydrogenolysis was going on, there was the benzylic tertiary hydroxyl could have been removed as well.  So while I normally like to use an excess of reagent and thus why I wrote 1.2 excess in the above instructions, you have helped me realize that in my actual synthesis I'm glad that there wasn't an excess (as well as the presence of a Lewis acid like FeCl3 or AlCl3)/ This conversation has actually given me hope that I didn't waste my propionyl chloride on a hydroxyl that was no longer there.  But yeah, I have only done this reaction once.  So, hopefully the 1:1 formate to Lop favored the hydrogenolysis of the aromatic Cl and left that hydroxyl well alone.   ;)  Please note the correction for the above (and I will go fix it now...), it may bee more prudent to keep the formate to halide ratio at 1:1.

BTW, indisputably I did get ROCKED by the deschloropropionyl-Lop once I got the dose high enough plus factoring in the methadone-like slow increase in effects... :o  And that was while I certainly had aftereffects from methadone still present in my neurons.  I'm sure if I had kept to classic opiates for a few weeks and then dropped the DCP-L it would have been even more pronounced.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2012, 09:46:58 AM by Dope Amine »

jon

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2012, 03:02:59 AM »
i did some research for you on SM but they pulled the thread it basically said reduction or benzylic ketones in your case methylone and alchohols all take place at 110C in GAA so acid conditions are need for this to happen.

jon

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2012, 12:25:14 AM »
jon managed to duplicate his sucess evidenced by the vigourous co2 evolution.
it subsided about an hour later.

so this is how this went .081
gm 95% formic acid and equimolar KOH 70 mg were mixed with 95 mg's of water
.00148 moles of loperamide base (.5gram) pd/c 5
5% pd/c 48 mg were added
were dissolved in 30 ml ipa
in and the reagents added and refluxed until co2 evolution stoped, ridiculously easy.
filtered of palladium i reclaimed the free based good's with some ultra dry rubbing alcohol,filtered and proceded to weigh my base it was quantitative.

fi

Dope Amine

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #11 on: November 24, 2012, 09:06:13 AM »
 ;) Hence why I love CTH's!!!  ;D

jon

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Re: Hydrocarboxylation of loperamide and subsequent esterification
« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2012, 05:40:01 PM »
oh another trick for us poor fellows who cant afford pure loperamide is to get it in methanol and use hot methanol.
filter add about 4 volumes of water and make basic the bases with come crashing out as a white powder.
easiest extraction i ever done.
be sure to add a pinch of salt to salt it out and use a hirsh funnel to filter it, cone filters always plug up.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2012, 08:55:24 PM by jon »